Cracked For Life...!!! Help

[reeferman75]

pyrrhus
After reading what you wrote you are talking like a true retail person. I should know I was a GM of a very large retail store wont say any names and things your are saying is what we where told to tell the customer . People like you always look for ways out and you saying how could it me a manufacturing defect it simple. There are the ones that bought the acrylic . Once the bought it it belonged to them . So they built the tank with now there acrylic and there workmanship behind it. If there warrnty states it 100% then that cover material and workmanship. What they should do is repair or replace the tank , then go back to the company that sold them there acrylic and work something out with them. Another thing you state how is it a manufacturing defect, For the last 7 yrs I have been building Multi Million dollar retail buildings and resturants. If there was something to go wrong with the building the owners come to my company not my subcontractors. We fix it then deal with the subcontractors in all essents its are name on the build , like there names on there tank. You made a reference to a car warrenty. Look at all the recalls they have because of parts they may have not made but they still make good and replace the part or in Fords case replace the burning F150 and so on. Here is what is written on the about us page.
Advance Aqua Tanks offers a Lifetime Warranty on all our ClearforLifeâ"žÂ¢ aquariums. What does that mean? Simply this: We stand behind our product 100 percent. Our continuing goal is to manufacture the finest acrylic aquariums and systems available. We support that quality with value and service.

Where does it say anything about leaking. They stand behind there product 100% till there is a problem . Then they do like pyrrhus and start making excuses when the warrenty in not valide anymore. I knew a guy that he 90 AGA corner tank brake and AGA replaced the tank , and the rock,lights, pumps and paid the servpro bill. I am by no means a AGA person but that was service.

pyrrhus

one last thing to you , if this is the way you deal with your customers I cant see how you have been in business as long as you have , and I hope some of your customers read this thread and see who they are realy dealing with and find another shop to deal with.
That is my 2 cents on this and on pyrrhus.

camp
I hope things work out for you and fight it till the end. S**T like this with the companys always pointer the fingures and taking no responabilty is getting realy old and need to stop. What ever happend to integrity.

 

[Icefire]

Get your tank back, take them to small claim court.

Quick, easy and you can claim your day off, travel expense.

Ask for money, buy one elsewhere.

 

[Pyrrhus]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9579053#post9579053 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by reeferman75
pyrrhus

one last thing to you , if this is the way you deal with your customers I cant see how you have been in business as long as you have , and I hope some of your customers read this thread and see who they are realy dealing with and find another shop to deal with.
That is my 2 cents on this and on pyrrhus.

Just to set the record straight, my integrity is not in question here and any of my customers could tell you that. The one time that I had to deal with a tank warranty issue was when a Lee-Mar tank had the center brace begin to give way. Lee-Mar tried to tell me it was heat from the lights which it plainly wasn't. When I was told that we needed to break down the tank and send it back to Lee-Mar for warranty repair, I refused. A fully stocked 225 is not easily broken down or stored until the tank is in proper condition. This being the case I paid to have the builder flown out to the site to conduct the repair at my cost! The customer was not billed for the time and effort that was put into getting his tank repaired, not one cent!.This was accomplished within 3 days of me being notified of the issue. If that is not an example of a commitment to your customers I do not know what is.

Sorry guys, disagree with my points all you want, thats fine. Saying that I do not take care of my customers, or offer poor CS, or do not know what I am doing because of my views in this conversation is just asinine.

 

[reeferman75]

no see the builder told you it was due to the lights and it wasnt, the dealer and you are telling this guy it was chemical or something else and it doesnt sound like it is . So unless you know 100% what caused it dont make statements that it was only caused by customers neglect. I need to try and rember the compnay we used in Vegas to build the massive shark tank in the golden palace swimming pool. So I can him what he thinks about this tank.

 

[Pyrrhus]

ATM

Acrylic Tank Manufacturers

702-387-2016

Ask for Brett, he is the lead builder.

I would be interested in his opinion on this as well.

 

[aztbs]

I don't usually post on heated threads, but I haven't seen anyone ask, and I am curious. I am a fan of glass tanks, so I honestly don't know.

Can cracks like that form from torsion or pressure due to lifting/carrying the tank without proper support? There would be no impact marks, the weight of the tank itself could have pulled against the panels. It is a large tank, and I have often heard of people carrying them with far less hands than they should or even moving them by themselves. Could it also be an issue with the tank not being level when filled?

I am in no way trying to blame the original poster, if it was pre-owned, the tank may have been stressed/mishandled before he got it. The cracks may not have developed but the weaknesses could still have existed. This is merely speculation because I am no materials scientist.

I can see both sides of this argument. I feel for the consumer because that is a significant amount of money to spend on a damaged/unusable product, and it appears he has had the run around instead of a clear answer. I truly hope this is resolved soon.

I also know that I have worked in customer service for 12 years and there are customers that will go out of their way to take advantage of warranties. I have seen people that I thought were honest make up wild stories to explain why they should get a free replacement for something they broke. It is amazing how words can be twisted to mean different things if personal gain is involved. Again, I am not saying that this is true about the poster, but from the manufacturer's side, they can't let themselves be played like that and the honest customer is the one that pays the price when the manufacturer does not trust them.

Was there any written warranty given to you with the 'floor model' tank you purchased? I know if you buy an open box item, it usually has some conditional warranty attached or a deep discount is given because the warranty doesn't apply. I am not fighting for the manufacturer here, I am just trying to understand the details that you would certainly be asked if you decided to take this to court.

I am eager to hear how this is resolved and what their 'tests' show.

 

[The Grim Reefer]

aztbs raises an excellent question as far as why the tank cracked, one you would have thought the manufacturer would have asked. Could be the tank was not placed on a level surface too, havent seen that raised either. All that aside the manufacturer has not acted in a manner that will ever get them my business. They seem more interested in ducking responsibility than trying to determine why their tank failed.

 

[BeanAnimal]

Just to set the record straight, my integrity is not in question here and any of my customers could tell you that. The one time that I had to deal with a tank warranty issue was when a Lee-Mar tank had the center brace begin to give way. Lee-Mar tried to tell me it was heat from the lights which it plainly wasn't. When I was told that we needed to break down the tank and send it back to Lee-Mar for warranty repair, I refused. A fully stocked 225 is not easily broken down or stored until the tank is in proper condition. This being the case I paid to have the builder flown out to the site to conduct the repair at my cost! The customer was not billed for the time and effort that was put into getting his tank repaired, not one cent!.This was accomplished within 3 days of me being notified of the issue. If that is not an example of a commitment to your customers I do not know what is.

Typical. YOU had to support the customer because the manufacturer refused to stand behind their product. That is the point here. I could care LESS what happened to the tank. The manufacturer is very openly not willing to stand behind their product and has shown that by their actions and their public attack of a customer.

Anybody who does not see this needs to draw out a timeline and match that timeline and chain of events to the warranty wording, webstite ad copy, and the silly response from the company rep. They are full of it and have no intention of fixing the tank NO MATTER what happened to it.

Bean

 

[BeanAnimal]

Was there any written warranty given to you with the 'floor model' tank you purchased? I know if you buy an open box item, it usually has some conditional warranty attached or a deep discount is given because the warranty doesn't apply.

You may want to check your warranty law... this is another misconception that stores and manufacturers love to let live.

You have a lot more rights than you think.

Again, the bottom line here is the way in which the problem is being handled and how it is totally different than the companies sales pitch.

The fact that some customers go out of their ways to game the system is relevant and is no excuse for the manufacturers actions.

 

[BeanAnimal]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9582027#post9582027 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by The Grim Reefer
aztbs raises an excellent question as far as why the tank cracked, one you would have thought the manufacturer would have asked. Could be the tank was not placed on a level surface too, havent seen that raised either. All that aside the manufacturer has not acted in a manner that will ever get them my business. They seem more interested in ducking responsibility than trying to determine why their tank failed.

They do not care why the tank cracked. They have made it VERY CLEAR that...

1) it is not leaking, and therefore there is no warranty issue! Fine print at it's best...
2) that THEIR WORKMASHIP appears to be fine and therefore this is not a warranty issue. Of course they are using the fine print to disclaim any other problems.

I suggest you carefully read what the manufacturer said Then for a good chuckle take a look that the warranty and sales ptich on their website.

 

[Zoos]

There are a lot of opinions flying around and everyone is entitled to say what they want to, not matter how absurd it is.

But the bottom line is very clear (no pun intended)

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9583583#post9583583 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by BeanAnimal
They do not care why the tank cracked. They have made it VERY CLEAR that...

1) it is not leaking, and therefore there is no warranty issue! Fine print at it's best...
2) that THEIR WORKMASHIP appears to be fine and therefore this is not a warranty issue. Of course they are using the fine print to disclaim any other problems.

I suggest you carefully read what the manufacturer said Then for a good chuckle take a look that the warranty and sales ptich on their website.

At least this thread will help to inform others about the way Clear For Life does business.

Pyrrhus, what is the name of your LFS?

 

[manderx]

Pyrrhus, what is the name of your LFS?

he clearly gave his full name, the store and the store's web address earlier in this thread. didn't you see it?


bean, so if you felt this guy was at fault for the cracks, would you expect the warranty to cover it? (that was what i was getting at with my chainsaw comment, which you totally missed apparently). you have not seen the tank, CFL has. as outsiders, none of us can take this as anything other than 'his word against theirs'. his interest is to get a free tank, their interest is to save money and not get scammed out of a free tank. we don't know their history, so we can't assume they do this to every single warranty claim. it might be fun to have a 'stick it to the man' mentality about this and assume they do, but we cannot assume that. the comparison to zippo is completely unrelated (whoever brought that up). their product costs cents to produce, and they make millions of them. these tanks cost a fortune in raw materials and they make them one at a time.

he could have helped his case if he had given more details and more pics, but he did not. CFL did give good details in their post. according to them, it was heavily beat up. OP agreed with this and said *all* his acrylic tanks look like that, which to me goes to say he's not especially careful with his toys. i've seen plenty of well used acrylic tanks than show little-to-no sign of wear. i feel that CFL upheld their obligation when they offered to test the material but the customer refused. the whole 'their stance on the warranty card' issue is moot (unless they had replied back and said they were sticking to it), it's very likely they didn't know the laws have changed so that warranty cards aren't required, they probably just copied parts of their warranty from others.

 

[dannieboiz]

Holy crap I just spent 30 minutes of my life reading the entire thread.

BeanAnimal, you always seems to amaze me with your responses around the forums. Most of which I found have a facts/research to back it up.

When I first got back into the hobby after 10 odd years, my first tank was a CFL, the quality of the acrylic was pretty crappy. Though it was only a 60g, it was in no way on par with my 15 year old Tru Vu tank that was left outside in the sun and rain for over 10 years. the CLF acrylic material feels as if they were going to bow in no time. Got rid of it after a few months and bought a Tru Vu tank. Thank god i didn't wait until I had to deal with this.

I'm just tagging along to see the result.

 

[Zoos]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9584268#post9584268 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by manderx
he clearly gave his full name, the store and the store's web address earlier in this thread. didn't you see it?

LMAO what was that all about, are you getting mad dude?

If I asked, it's because I didn't see it, Is that alright with you, or am I on time out? :lol:

Seriously though, don't take things to the heart, this is a forum and this is what we do in forums, everyone is entitled to their opinion, we don't have to agree with them, but there is no need to get upset either. I already see where this thread is going.
:mixed:

 

[Zoos]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9584357#post9584357 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by dannieboiz
Holy crap I just spent 30 minutes of my life reading the entire thread.

BeanAnimal, you always seems to amaze me with your responses around the forums. Most of which I found have a facts/research to back it up.

When I first got back into the hobby after 10 odd years, my first tank was a CFL, the quality of the acrylic was pretty crappy. Though it was only a 60g, it was in no way on par with my 15 year old Tru Vu tank that was left outside in the sun and rain for over 10 years. the CLF acrylic material feels as if they were going to bow in no time. Got rid of it after a few months and bought a Tru Vu tank. Thank god i didn't wait until I had to deal with this.

I'm just tagging along to see the result.

Thanks for sharing.

 

[dannieboiz]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9584580#post9584580 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Zoos
Thanks for sharing.

Thanks for reading.

 

[BeanAnimal]

bean, so if you felt this guy was at fault for the cracks, would you expect the warranty to cover it?

That is absolutely beside the point. That is the problem here, a lot of you are missing the big picture and instead are getting caught up in all kinds of tangent details.

Those details should come LATER. The problem is that the manufacturer started disclaiming and pointing fingers from the moment the claim was made.

We only had the OPs side of the story to start with, but when the manufacturer posted here, they discredited themselves with almost everything they said.

To answer your first question:
Of course a company should not have to cover USER INFLICTED damage that is outside of the scope of reasonable use. Again I suggest you do some warranty law research. To even suggest that I think or advocate anything else is nonsense.

(that was what i was getting at with my chainsaw comment, which you totally missed apparently)

No I did not miss it. It was frankly stupid and a tangent to the point here. You still do not see that do you? Instead of talking about the company, the process, the sales pitch, and the actions of the company when confronted, you are confusing the issue with things that have no bearing on where the problem is at. Why muddy the waters with stuff like that?

If it is USER ABUSE, then the manufacturer will need to show that. Again I suggest you read up on warranty law.

you have not seen the tank, CFL has. as outsiders, none of us can take this as anything other than 'his word against theirs'.

Again, you miss the big picture. I do not need to see the tank. I saw the type of cracks. I saw the response from the vendor. They do not match PERIOD.

the comparison to zippo is completely unrelated (whoever brought that up).

You telling me I posted something unrelated? That is kind of funny! It was simply an example of a company that wrote a "Lifetime Warranty" and has never breached it. If you do not see how it is related... then I understand why you are not able to see the big picture here. Your to busy fussing about chainsaws and thiefs. Step back and look at the big picture.... It has nothing to do with materials cost and everything to do with customer service and attitude.

I am done with this portion of the conversation. I have stated my case clearly several times. The manufacturer is clearly NOT standing behind their sales pitch, that is where my problem lies. The manufacturer is clearly hiding behind fine print and an attempt to discredit the client with very poor arguements. Did the OP attack the company.... sure he did. That does not mean that the company should attack back THAT MANDERX IS THE PROBLEM.

I suggest you read their response a few more times and put it in perspective.

So we are 100% clear. I detest people that game the system and use warranty law or dishonest tacticts to fleece honest companies. I detest frivolous claims and litigation and the mush minded people who participate in the act of promoting them. I also detest companies who do not stand behind their products and instead stand behind fine print and legal council. The world is full of people and companies like that and it makes me sick. I do honest business and stand behind my work. I end up on the short end of the stick because of CLIENTS and VENDORS who act like that.

 

[manderx]

LMAO what was that all about, are you getting mad dude?

no, i saw a bunch of people ganging up on him for no reason, assuming he's a typical part-time lfs employee.

if you weren't paying attention enough to his posts to see that he already posted that, then you probably weren't paying attention to what he was saying period.

 

[jocoxVT]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9584824#post9584824 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by BeanAnimal
You telling me I posted something unrelated? That is kind of funny! It was simply an example of a company that wrote a "Lifetime Warranty" and has never breached it. If you do not see how it is related... then I understand why you are not able to see the big picture here. Your to busy fussing about chainsaws and thiefs. Step back and look at the big picture.... It has nothing to do with materials cost and everything to do with customer service and attitude.

I agree with Manderx here in that the Zippo scenario is a poor comparison. Plain and simple it is a lot easier for Zippo to please a customer when there product costs them pennies compared to what a tank costs. Go ahead and say lifetime warranty but at the sametime it is much easier for Zippo to back this with no questions asked then it is for an aquarium company. Personally I would want an aquarium to do a little research on why they need to be filling a warranty claim b/c if they dont and just give everyone a new tank at a drop of the hat then prices go up for all of us.

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9584824#post9584824 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by BeanAnimal
The manufacturer is clearly NOT standing behind their sales pitch, that is where my problem lies. The manufacturer is clearly hiding behind fine print and an attempt to discredit the client with very poor arguements. Did the OP attack the company.... sure he did. That does not mean that the company should attack back THAT MANDERX IS THE PROBLEM.

What is the end of this suppose to mean (THAT MANDERX IS THE PROBLEM).

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9584824#post9584824 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by BeanAnimal
So we are 100% clear. I detest people that game the system and use warranty law or dishonest tacticts to fleece honest companies. I detest frivolous claims and litigation and the mush minded people who participate in the act of promoting them. I also detest companies who do not stand behind their products and instead stand behind fine print and legal council. The world is full of people and companies like that and it makes me sick. I do honest business and stand behind my work. I end up on the short end of the stick because of CLIENTS and VENDORS who act like that.

Then how can you even have an opinion on this topic? You are going only be hear say? Yes we all want to sympathize with the customer but at the same time you cannot discredit some of Manderx comments then. He simply stated that this could be a result of misuse by the customer (hence the chainsaw scenario - yes a severe scenario but a scenario none the less - even if it was that the customer left it out and rocks got kicked up in it by his car pulling in and out of the garage that in my mind owuld be dishonest tactics on the customers part to be now trying to get a new tank under warranty).

 

[dannieboiz]

I agree with Manderx here in that the Zippo scenario is a poor comparison. Plain and simple it is a lot easier for Zippo to please a customer when there product costs them pennies compared to what a tank costs. Go ahead and say lifetime warranty but at the sametime it is much easier for Zippo to back this with no questions asked then it is for an aquarium company. Personally I would want an aquarium to do a little research on why they need to be filling a warranty claim b/c if they dont and just give everyone a new tank at a drop of the hat then prices go up for all of us.

Then they shouldn't put "Lifetime Warranty" on their product PERIOD!

What is the end of this suppose to mean (THAT MANDERX IS THE PROBLEM).

You obviously need to learn how to read. Another way of saying that would be "That is the problem, Manderx" :lol:

The manufacturer is clearly NOT standing behind their sales pitch, that is where my problem lies. The manufacturer is clearly hiding behind fine print and an attempt to discredit the client with very poor arguements. Did the OP attack the company.... sure he did. That does not mean that the company should attack back

That's the problem,, Not MANDERX is the problem!

Then how can you even have an opinion on this topic? You are going only be hear say? Yes we all want to sympathize with the customer but at the same time you cannot discredit some of Manderx comments then. He simply stated that this could be a result of misuse by the customer (hence the chainsaw scenario - yes a severe scenario but a scenario none the less - even if it was that the customer left it out and rocks got kicked up in it by his car pulling in and out of the garage that in my mind owuld be dishonest tactics on the customers part to be now trying to get a new tank under warranty).

Read again from the beginning, obviously there is no sign of banging or anything hitting on the tank.