Cubed & Squared

[Bello]

biggles: I forgot about the flow through the tunnel...it's pretty low at the moment. Wondering if its worth throwing in a 6025 in there? There is space.

troub: Thanks!! Hopefully, I won't mess it up. Thankfully, I also managed to catch a pesky Humbug damsel without making a mess, first time ever (fish trap).

I'm already thinking about adding a small rock towards the front left, will probably be just zoas there though. Have a couple clams, but certainly not sweet!! More like fugly :lol:

The rock you've got sounds good!! Its easier to scape with larger pieces than with bit size pieces. Waiting to see the pics... I'd be ignoring my in-laws if I were you :lol:...They think I'm nuts anyways :lol:

 

[biggles]

I think we can stop discussing the state of my bottom in this thread as it's covered most times except for the occasionally surge down there that blows everything all over the place - same thing happens in my tank...........

troub, why don't you make a cardboard back and side up to match the tank dimensions and use it for your aquascaping design stage - much easier and safer than messing about with your glass display mate. Do it in the garage so you can hide from the inlaws.........

Bello, i'd throw the other pump in there if you have space to get good flow through that tunnel. Might as well add that rock to the front left - you know you're going to do it eventually mate so get on with it lol. More pics please.......:thumbsup:

 

[troubadour11]

The rock you've got sounds good!! Its easier to scape with larger pieces than with bit size pieces. Waiting to see the pics... I'd be ignoring my in-laws if I were you :lol:...They think I'm nuts anyways :lol:

I can't wait to get to playing with the rock scape and get some pics up for you all. It's been crazy at work this week and then LOTS of bbq'in and entertaining the inlaws afterwards. Hopefully all their daytime sightseeing wears them out so I can break out the cardboard one of these nights though. ***closes his eyes and makes a wish*** :xlbirthday:

 

[biggles]

What's up with the tank Bello - a couple of top down pics would be cool (nudge nudge) :spin1:
Tank journal alert - Troub is getting close to firing up - that isn't phos leaching dry rock is it Troub as i've seen the problem mentioned a great deal in many threads. Whatever you do don't build anything like Bello's scapes or you'll get one of his nasty PM's........ best to ignore any incoming PM's from Bello actually as he's normally quite abusive in them :debi:

My one and only bought aquacultured frag of stylo that tried making friends with the pavona (bad idea) 6-7 weeks ago and is still smaller than when i bought it refused to stay glued down three times today but took on the fourth try.......until the ^#$!*$#% shrimp climbed on it and knocked it down. It now lives behind the skimmer after bouncing off the cabinet........ i hate it.

 

[troubadour11]

What's up with the tank Bello - a couple of top down pics would be cool (nudge nudge) :spin1:

Yeah Bello, +1 some more pretty pictures please. I'm living vicariously through you and Biggles right now :beer: Did you survive your Calc Reactor emergency?

Tank journal alert - Troub is getting close to firing up - that isn't phos leaching dry rock is it Troub as i've seen the problem mentioned a great deal in many threads. Whatever you do don't build anything like Bello's scapes or you'll get one of his nasty PM's........ best to ignore any incoming PM's from Bello actually as he's normally quite abusive in them :debi:

Well I don't think I could copy the DiVinci of rock work... I wouldn't do him justice. LOL. I don't expect the rocks to leach much phos. From the reviews and threads I've read on here, it doesn't seem like there is a big phos issue (in most cases) from this distributor. But there is no guarantee until I soak it and check. I guess I'm hoping the reviews are right and running the big fuge in the old 75 in the closet will suck some massive phos (EWWWwwwww) if there is an issue. That and since I'm using mostly dry sand/rock and seeding the system, it will have to sit and cycle for a few months I would guess. Some lawn mowing inverts could be interesting to watch then I suppose...

What do you all think? Acid wash and LaCl the rocks, or aquascape them and rinse them with RO when I test the plumbing for leaks and then get it going? No guts no glory, right? :uzi:

Have you got some extra flow through that tunnel Bello? Any plans for inhabitants in that area once it's flowing? Or are you focusing on that new rock island you know is coming out front? hehehe

 

[Bello]

Whatever you do don't build anything like Bello's scapes or you'll get one of his nasty PM's........ best to ignore any incoming PM's from Bello actually as he's normally quite abusive in them :debi:

:lol: Abusive???....This is too funny :lol:

Troub, have your in-laws left yet??... I'm not very familiar with dry rock, but FWIW, rinsing/soaking in RO doesn't do jack for PO4, at least not in my experience. Biggles should have better ideas. You will be running GFO anyways right?

Biggles, anyways, added a 6015 for additional flow in the Monti tank. Sorry to hear about the stylo, this is the same brown turd that coloured up well right?

Anyways, you wanted pics..... you got pics!!!
M.Setosa

More Monty's

No idea acro

Desperately needs to colour up acro

The Acro tank LHS

 

[troubadour11]

Looking good Bello, thanks for sharing! :thumbsup:

That acro you said desperately needs some color at least has some good polyp extension from the looks of it. Is it better to be dull and healthy then dull and dead :rollface:

The in-laws are still in town. They fly out Saturday during the day sometime. So I'm looking forward to some downtime for my project this weekend!

I know just rinse/soaking in RO water won't do any for leaching Phos from dry rock. I could soak it and test to see if it is leaching... or just do an acid bath and LaCl to clean it off with an RO bath or two before I start anything. But, at least from the reviews I've read from others using this rock, Phos leaching hasn't been an issue. So I'm leaning towards just aquascaping it, getting the plumbing done, and getting the cycle going.

I still need to look into GFO and GAC a little more :reading: I need to get a better understanding of using them with a mixed reef set up that will have a large fuge as part of the system. I don't currently have any reactors or anything purchased. I do have a Fluval 305 canister filter from my old fresh water set up. So I suppose I could use that as a GFO/GAC "reactor." I may need to use the 305 as an lifting pump/power head to get water from the sump to the fuge and overflow it back to the sump return. So I could maybe utilize it there. But I will need to get that straightened out more as I create the build and get to the plumbing I think.

 

[biggles]

:lol: Abusive???....This is too funny :lol:

Don't fall for it Troub......... just delete any PM's from Bello without opening them, everyone reading this should do the same tbh. :thumbsup:

I've never used dry rock so i can't help with info, i do think running GFO big time from the get go would be wise to reduce the GHA cycle or add it the moment you see GHA appearing.

Good move with the 6015 Bello, i have a good current flowing through my arch as well - the only dead spot i have is behind the rocks against the overflow and i blast behind there with a turkey baster every few days and turn the tank water to a filthy detritus fog lol, the SPS love it btw.
I meant to say the seri frag, not stylo sorry. Typical run of the mill pink seri that took a nose dive into the pav colony overnight requiring cutting back to 1" from a 2" frag lol. The Pavona is the school bully of my tank, if he bashes another frag up i'm going to grab a Hydnophora and stick it next to him - then he'll find out all about getting beaten up by a nasty coral.......

Love the pics mate, you have some nice colors on those monti's - i would gladly swap my purple one for your red Setosa as i never see colors like that in my LFS's There's nothing wrong with your colors buddy, i'm certain you're only a few LED 'tweaks' away from getting the pop in colors you want.
I love that no idea acro, very pretty with green polyps and i can see purple tips wanting to pop out yes ?
I have a milli similar to yours, it has hairy brown polyps that basically hide all the blue and pink highlights that it has, i have given up on it and chucked all but a single frag of it into the sump dump lol. I've been ignoring all the millis i see at the LFS no matter the color as i won't buy another one unless i see colorful polyps on it.
The LHS shot looks great, i love that narrow channel between the rocks and the way you've mounted the corals. I do however notice that you failed to mention the lower right rock in that pic - the one with a large number of frags massed for battle......... i'm watching you Bello..... watching you real close buddy :strooper::lol2:

 

[Bello]

Thanks for looking Troub

You sir, have my respect!!! Over a week with your in-laws, and still sane? :thumbsup:

I know the big giant millie is a fairly drab brown. I was tempted to move it up and give it a go, to colour it up aka Biggles style :lol:. But as you said, brown....but healthy...and its been growing fairly well...and i love the structure...so, leaving it be for the next year if I have to :lol:

I'd just aquascape the rock direct and proceed. Should be fine

Hmm...When I moved into the salty side of the hobby years ago, I had the Eheim cannister filters. They do well with Fish only systems etc, but not sure on how well they'd do in a reef setup. Moreover, I doubt it has enough flow to use it as a return. If you can get fair value for it, I'd sell it. If not, it can be used for certain types of media. When I tried using the Eheim with Rowaphos (GFO), I observed channelling of the media within the reactor. But I can't confirm that it worked well or not since I didn't have a decent Phosphate test kit back then. I would still consider getting a dedicated return pump, and my vote goes to Waveline.

Looks like you're getting busy now :thumbsup: Biggles beware!!!

 

[Bello]

Biggles, you're ruining my reputation!!!:furious:.....oh wait, I don't have one :lol:

I've found seri hystrix to be quite unpredictable to be honest. The colouring up etc confuses me. Oh, and they are quite easily the most difficult frags to glue! Especially, if you have a big colony!! I've got a couple in the drop off that are actually doing quite well now, touchwood

Told you I'd be happy to trade the setosa with you, now all you have to do is train that pigeon :ape:

The no idea acro, I believe is an A. Aculeus, but I've been wrong plenty of times before :lol: I don't know if you read the into to my thread, but I had a whole range of problems a for the last 3 years, and this is one of those that survived against the odds. This and the setosa, my favourite. I don't think it'll have purple tips though, its doubled in size over time, but the colour has been consistent, very consistent. Woulda been nice

Come to think of it, most of my millie's don't have the "right" colour, but I've discovered a possible problem yesterday, that may solve these issues....We shall find out...soon :lol:

I didn't have that channel before in the original scape, but when the Big Daddy, Hippo tang came over, he threatened to destroy my tank unless I created a suitable spot for him :lol:. This is perhaps one of the biggest problems with minimalistic scapes, no hiding spots for the fish. Hopefully, I'll relocate him in a month, but the channel will remain, have grown to like it :thumbsup:

We're prepping Biggles, get ready :strooper:

 

[biggles]

In regards to the seri issue i felt bad enough last night to retrieve it and managed to glue it down in another spot, it's deathly pale from it's time in the naughty room though - i still have a grudge against that stupid coral.........
You need to train a carrier fish and send him over and i'll tie the frags to his tail and turn him around - use a multibar angel Bello, i promise i'll send him back...........
I think your no idea ID is correct, regardless of whether it gets any tip pigmentation that colony has a beautiful growth pattern and i want a frag of that sent over with my angel, put a piece of the setosa on his other fin to balance him out or he'll swim in circles.........:thumbsup:
Up to secret sneaky stuff with your milli's hey - i solved the brown polyp problem very easily mate - i threw it in the sump lol. Last time at the LFS there were 4-5 small branches of delicate branched green milli's, really pretty thin branches but they were all different greens and you know i am over greens so they stayed behind lol.
Glad you're keeping the channel, it looks very cool with the narrow gap and once corals from each side overhang the gap it will look awesome i'm sure :thumbsup: Easy fix for the lack of hiding spaces for fish - don't go putting the dirty little poopers (DLP's - fish) in there in the first place Bello

We're prepping Biggles, get ready :strooper:

Oh i'm getting ready buddy, you do realise i have been known to order full polly boxes of acros directly from a collector at times.......... i won't hesitate to use the black market 'arms' trade if you and Troub back me into a tank corner Bello.........:strooper:

 

[Bello]

You need to train a carrier fish and send him over and i'll tie the frags to his tail and turn him around - use a multibar angel Bello, i promise i'll send him back...........
I think your no idea ID is correct, regardless of whether it gets any tip pigmentation that colony has a beautiful growth pattern and i want a frag of that sent over with my angel, put a piece of the setosa on his other fin to balance him out or he'll swim in circles.........

:lol: just :lol:

A Multibar carrier fish??... Geez, its hard enough to get them to eat, let alone run errands :lol:

I'm actually trying to get rid of a couple fish now... a few unncessary ones are being held in the frag tank as we speak. Trying to sell/trade 'em off. Will probably still add a Flame Angel when I get the chance, since I dunno when I'll get the chance for a Multibar again. What can I say, I'm a glutton for punishment :lol:

Here's a couple pics to start your day....good 'ol fugly to cugly
Before

After


And a couple month's growth shot...think it's an A.Abrolhensis, and while I prefer it in green, still the only brownie I'll ever like

 

[troubadour11]

i do think running GFO big time from the get go would be wise to reduce the GHA cycle or add it the moment you see GHA appearing.

Thanks for the tip and duly noted in my research docs!

Thanks for looking Troub

You sir, have my respect!!! Over a week with your in-laws, and still sane? :thumbsup:

I'd just aquascape the rock direct and proceed. Should be fine

Looks like you're getting busy now :thumbsup: Biggles beware!!!

I give you rocks (if I post the images correctly)... Aquascape process somewhat started started!!!

Just neatly stacked in there for now. That's the 75 lbs. I still have another 20 of the same rock cut flat on one side. But there is something in my tank... it's no longer empty!!! :bounce1:

 

[troubadour11]

Hmmm... fail on my images :headwally:

One more time :fish1:

Here's the smaller of 2 the boxes unpacked...

One of the "Prime Cut" rocks and a regular of similar size...

EXTREME CLOSEUP!!!

And finally... the 75 lbs piled in the tank. No real attempt to scape it. Just neatly piled to see how much was there. Still 20 lbs of the flat cuts in a box.

SCORE!!! Hahahahaha :uzi:

 

[troubadour11]

And sorry for spamming you with multiple posts in a row... had to figure out those images.

And I can't wait to see that canyon rift between the two rafts once your corals grow out! It's gonna look so sweet. So do all those missiles pointed off the bottom right of that island!

Hmm...When I moved into the salty side of the hobby years ago, I had the Eheim cannister filters. They do well with Fish only systems etc, but not sure on how well they'd do in a reef setup. Moreover, I doubt it has enough flow to use it as a return. If you can get fair value for it, I'd sell it. If not, it can be used for certain types of media. When I tried using the Eheim with Rowaphos (GFO), I observed channelling of the media within the reactor. But I can't confirm that it worked well or not since I didn't have a decent Phosphate test kit back then. I would still consider getting a dedicated return pump, and my vote goes to Waveline.

I may not have worded it clearly enough. I do have a dedicated return pump to set up other then the canister. I've got a new Rio 12HF as my main filter recirculation for now. I'm guessing it will push between 500 and 650 gph after plumbing and head loss. But I expect to dial that down some (the manual says I can pull it back around 15%) to optimize skimming and a UV unit. I have to figure out how to plumb in the refugium... That's where I was thinking of using the 305 canister to draw water, post skimming, from the sump up to the fuge. Then the fuge would drain back to the sump into the Rio return pump. Since I already owned the canister, I was thinking it could be a free lift pump and powerhead for the Fuge, and inexpensive media reactor for the time.

 

[Bello]

Looks like I misunderstood :lol: I now understand by what you meant with the 305. That should work, and would use up the equipment without wasting any money :thumbsup:

The rocks are pretty impressive , and I think the dry rock was indeed the better way to go :thumbsup:. Would love to see the final scape. But usually, at least in my case, it takes about 15-20 iterations to get to the final scape :lol:

Was wondering that since your tank is tall, how about some bonsai type pillars with overhangs? So that the sandbed remains clean. Just my .02 cents

I'm waiting for my pieces to grow over the canyon ... and will widen the canyon when do....should take about 30 seconds to rescape :lol:

 

[troubadour11]

Was wondering that since your tank is tall, how about some bonsai type pillars with overhangs? So that the sandbed remains clean. Just my .02 cents

I'm waiting for my pieces to grow over the canyon ... and will widen the canyon when do....should take about 30 seconds to rescape :lol:

That is right along the lines I was thinking. And part of what drew me into the conversation you and Biggles were having about Reef Bonsai...

I'm a huge fan of the minimalist look. I really like open sand bed and negative space as part of the design. Plus it takes the end goal into account and gives space for the reef to fill in. I want corals and such, but hiding places and space for fish/inverts etc. as well. I'm sure we'll end up with lots of DLP's (as Biggles calls them) in our reef. We want the living ecosystem reef look with lots of life, including the corals.

The flat cut rock is mostly for an overflow cover I think. Then the plan is maybe 2 bonsai pillars that lean against the overflow cover rock. I'd like to try to leave arches or cave like areas between the base of the towers and the overflow. Have 1 (maybe shorter) in the front left corner and 1 (probably taller) that leans off the right corner of the overflow out into the center of the tank. Then over on the right side... maybe one more tower or pile in the corner with some low level raft or something extending off it. (No rock touching glass) I wouldn't mind maybe going for a small canyon look using the center bonsai tower coming to the front of the tank and the right island lower and going towards the back center of the tank. I definitely need to play with it to get the illusion of depth! That is a must.

I was hoping a design like that will look good and use the height of the tank to my advantage. Tall rock towers with open sand sounds like a good .02 cents to me! :thumbsup:

You have a 2 tank set up (an acro and a monty tank), right Bello? Has there been a FTS update of the monty tank lately? I saw the couple close ups of them. They have interested me more and more lately when I see them in the LFS.

I also appreciate your love of punishment for Angels! I'm always wanting one for ours in the end. I'm guessing if we got one, it should be one of the last fish we will stock. But their love of clams and LPS scares me a little. But the Coral Beautys at the LFS are always saying ":bounce2: Hey! Look at me! Hey YOU! Buy me! You know you want to! :bounce3:"

 

[biggles]

Here's a couple pics to start your day....good 'ol fugly to cugly
Before

After


And a couple month's growth shot...think it's an A.Abrolhensis, and while I prefer it in green, still the only brownie I'll ever like

That fugly is looking very cool now, that's going to be a stunner when the pigments develop more over time - i love acros with very pale to white branch coloration as any pigments 'pop' like crazy on them. :thumbsup:

The brown abro would already be in my sump mate.........:smokin:

Pics at last from the Troubster.......about bloody time Troub i might add.
That's some cool looking rock you have to work with there mate and being dry you can take your sweet time to create some awesome formations. Do a google image search on 'bonsai design' or similar and you will see some very inspirational images to get your creative juices flowing (have tissues ready)
Bello is right about the rock tweaking, don't expect to get it perfectly how you want it without a few minor alterations after water goes in - 'rock fiddling' is a prerequisite for cool aquascapes. Might be time to fire up the old tank journal Troub, i know at least two reefers who'll pester you with annoying questions and pick apart your every addition lol.

I woke yesterday to find a 6025 had somehow come out of its bracket and spent the night bouncing around my acro tips until it settled in the corals and blasted the you know what out of my new yellowish colored acro branch - poor little guy is history and the tank is a mess of sand which i'm still blowing out of the colonies and rocks, lots of smashed tips on the tall acro mounted on the end of the rear rock shelf. Other than that surprise things are going ok.

* I'm thinking one of you two were somehow behind the pump attack on my SPS btw........

 

[biggles]

I've 'mined' the overflow now with an SCC frag...........

 

[Bello]

That is right along the lines I was thinking. And part of what drew me into the conversation you and Biggles were having about Reef Bonsai...

Looks like the plan is in place :thumbsup:. Waiting for you start the scape, then we can offer our nutty inputs . I can't quite understand exactly what's your in head, so the sooner we see pics, the better. Guess I'm very visual . It's gonna be challenging though, so be persistent. Rock walls are easy, but getting these bonsai type structures to balance and sit right....that's gonna be fun :lol:

Glad you'll be adding some fish.....send some to spy on biggles :lol:. The first angelfish that I really liked was the coral beauty. Not very expensive or rare, but pretty!! It'll be a bit tricky to get 'em reef safe though. If any other dwarf angel will do, I believe the Potters or Cherubs will have a fair chance of being reef safe. I have a spare tank of softies where I usually throw in the angels and observe their behaviour. Still waiting on my flame

The older acro/monti tank pics are on this thread, but I've shifted a couple pieces around, so will take a fresh fts in the next couple days :thumbsup:

The hour is approaching.....time to get busy