cyano bacteria battle

[saltwaterpicaso]

ive had cyano in my tank since the 5th or 6th month ive had my tank going. ive read everthying about it i used to use tap water about 6 months ago i bought a water general water unit. still nothing i only feed once every three or so days and its just pellets not much just enough to keep the fish happy. only fish i have are yellow tang. six line wrasse 2 clowns and there domino damsels all pretty small. i have a 20 gallon sump with 1500 micron socks that get changed once a week. my skimmer is a my reef creations becket style with a pondmaster 1200 gpm pump on it. ive got flow all over the tank. i have a bunch of mushroom corals, green nepthia, neaon green leather, cabbage leather, and some other leather, GSP, a bunch of xenia and a torch that never did any good from day one. the tank is a 72g bowfront with cree 3w led lighting. just wondering what i could be doing wrong. my clean up crew consists of 30 or so crabs blue leg and scarlet. and 2 pepermint shrimp. just wondering what everyone thinks could be the problem my readings are spot on i have the local pet store check my paramaters and they say its fine. they use the same water and they have no problems. just fustrating

 

[saltwaterpicaso]

tank is 2 years old sorry and i do a 15 gallon water change every week using reef crystals

 

[reefer buddy]

blackout your tank for a few days. It helped me

 

[Jstn]

It may be from your rocks leaching phosphates accumulated before and during your tap water phase.

 

[saltwaterpicaso]

ive done black out it just comes back i also thought about the rocks leaching it. kinda just ****es me off my tank looks great except the cyano

 

[saltwaterpicaso]

i wonder if i should take most of the rock out and boil it to start over

 

[DEEP BLUE SIX]

Lights out definitely helps. But no light does not get rid of all the potential in the system. You can also try a couple somewhat larger water changes over 5 - 7 days and vacuum out what cyano you can get. This also helps. But not a full cure to get rid of it. Some can still be stubborn and come back. Some survives on very little if any light too. Even in low oxygen levels. So less light decreases growth potentials but doesn't eliminate it entirely.

The key is phosphate reduction.
A real good skimmer helps too. Turn skimming up during the lights out period (if you don't always run close to the neck)

Don't know what you run as far as media. But I suggest GFO in a reactor to reduce phosphates more.

Test your water on Phosphates (and just for the hell of it- Nitrates too)
Water changes and Good Skimming combined with Carbon & GFO media should do the trick. But you have to "remove" your source through these methods before you'll see a change in the levels. So kep all the above up and continue to test until you see results of lowered phosphates. Then continue until you can bring your levels as close to 0(zero) on a test kit as possible.
The cyano will starve from none or not enough of the right nutrients then.

Research (if you already have not done so) the details of carbon dosing with Vinegar. It could help keep your phosphate and Nitrate levels in check- along with the continued Skimming and water changes.

Don't give up! It's your choice, but you don't really need to "cook the rock". You can get rid of it through all the methods above- Even if the rock is leaching phosphates. It just takes time. "cooking rock" is sometimes an option in starting a tank with undesirables on the rock. But I think you'd have a prolonged situation with new cycle and bacteria build up etc.. if you start over now. You have some corals and your problem doesn't really sound that bad. Regardless how annoying Cyano can be.

 

[saltwaterpicaso]

i figured the skimmer i had was kinda over kill for how small of a tank i have the person i bought it off had a 220g sps tank and with the skimmer. its a MRC 1 im going to look into the viniger dosing. as of right now i have never run any media no carbon no nothing i really wanted a self mantaining tank lol but i guess its kinda impossible plus i dont want to be buying everything all the time i like natural methods

 

[Gary Majchrzak]

what S.G. do you run at and how do you measure it?
ditto with alkalinity. You need to get your own reliable test kits.

I do not favor 'lights out' for battling Cyanobacteria

 

[saltwaterpicaso]

i keep it around 1.025 maybe slightly higher sometimes. i have just a lever gauge one from petsmart to check it alkalinity i dont know i dont have a kit.

 

[Gary Majchrzak]

lever guage = swing arm hydrometer? = get a refractometer

my suggestions might seem strange but they are long term solutions for beating nuisance alga and cyanobacteria.

You have a good skimmer. This is a very good thing. Raising S.G. to 1.026 ACCURATELY USING A CALIBRATED REFRACTO will allow your skimmer to work at it's fullest potential. Run the skimmer 24/7
An overrated skimmer working to it's fullest potential (alone) can beat red slime as long as you're not polluting the tank with too many additives or foods.

Maintain alkalinity between 8 and 11 dKH.

Siphon any red slime directly out of the display. You can return the water that accompanies the red slime back into the display.

Queen Conchs consume cyanobateria.

Use RO water.

Beating cyano the "natural way" is best IMO but chemicals can be extremely effective. GFO and carbon are the two big chemical filters to consider.

I used to think red slime was difficult to beat but after many years of doing this I can assure you that it isn't once you learn how.

 

[E_rock]

Hmm I didn't know having your SG at 1.026 will make your skimmer run better. Good to know

I tried to keep my tank all "natural" for a while too. But I finally broke down and got a reactor and ran GFO and carbon. And a week later all my cyano was gone. IME I am glad I made that move.

 

[saltwaterpicaso]

its always been a constant battle. i just didnt want to use chemicals. i run the skimmer 24/7 use ro water i only feed once every three days and its very light. but the stuff just doesnt go away. i think im going to try the vineger dosing and hope for the best if not i will buy a gfo reactor. i just didnt want the added cost

 

[Gary Majchrzak]

if your aquarium is 5 or 6 months old it's fairly normal to go through a cycle of algae and cyano blooms.
Regular removal of cyano via a siphon hose is a good method of ridding a system of whatever is fueling the cyano growth.
A reactor is an indispensible tool IMO. You can choose to actively run GFO or GAC or both in it. You need to get a reliable alkalinity test kit beforehand, though.

 

[saltwaterpicaso]

the tank is has been up and running for at least two years. i never had a good skimmer or ro water up until about a year ago so for a year i was using sub par equipment. ive had cyano since the third month im just sick of it and want a nice looking tank

 

[alanbates12]

Maybe I've missed it but what are your parameters? What is your brand of light? What and how do you clean your tank? Also test your RODI water for nitrates and phosphates.

 

[saltwaterpicaso]

the local pet store test my water and they say its fine. i do 15 gallon water changes a week with reef crystals the lighting is 3w cree leds that i made 12k and i cant remeber the nms of the blues i used. i dont have a test kit im going to buy one. when i clean the tank i blow off all the rock and clean the glass and the over flow every water change and replace the 1500 micron sock. i clean the socks using a cap full of bleach and rinse them 2 cycles through the wash with water. i feed small pellets and some flake every three days. i know my di resin needs replacing its brown i have some coming in i run cold water through the unit. other than that i dont run and carbon or any other stuff all my corals look great its just the cyano looks horrible. i dont have any other algea just cyano. the only other thing is i have to clean the glass every other day couse it develops a brown tint to it and when wiped its like a powder not sure what it is.

 

[Gary Majchrzak]

the local pet store test my water and they say its fine.

for those of us that have kept reef aquariums for a long time we know this is a problem. YOU need to monitor your aquarium water.
IMO the first thing to get is a refracto.
Alk, Ca and perhaps a pH test kit next.

I've seen cyanobacters grow under all types of lighting and I never recommend the lighting approach.

'Brown powder' is usually diatoms. Green powder would indicate algae.

 

[alanbates12]

the local pet store test my water and they say its fine. i do 15 gallon water changes a week with reef crystals the lighting is 3w cree leds that i made 12k and i cant remeber the nms of the blues i used. i dont have a test kit im going to buy one. when i clean the tank i blow off all the rock and clean the glass and the over flow every water change and replace the 1500 micron sock. i clean the socks using a cap full of bleach and rinse them 2 cycles through the wash with water. i feed small pellets and some flake every three days. i know my di resin needs replacing its brown i have some coming in i run cold water through the unit. other than that i dont run and carbon or any other stuff all my corals look great its just the cyano looks horrible. i dont have any other algea just cyano. the only other thing is i have to clean the glass every other day couse it develops a brown tint to it and when wiped its like a powder not sure what it is.

Well cyano does not need light to grow. All it needs is a food source and low or high flow.

 

[tmz]

Some rare species of cyano bacteria do not need light but these chemo autotophic species are rare and I doubt they exist in a reef tank.
Most cyano are photo autotrophic, using the energy in light to bind carbon to hydrogen forming the organic carbon ( sugars and carbohydrates /calories) needed for energy. Most cyanobacteria whether it's on your sand bed , in a terrestrial plant leaf or on a polar bear coat is very similar to the chloroplasts in zooxanthelae in that way. Some species may be able to scavenge some organics from the environnment but usually make their own through photosynthetic activity.

Therein lies the rub; lights out stresses all photosynthetic organisms and does not remove or eradicate the cyano or the nutrients in it. I have never used light depravaton nor do I plan to even if I have a cyano issue.

Cyano needs only water, CO2 ,light and like all living things phosphorous and a source of bound nitrogen.

Many species of cyano make their own organic/bound nitrogen. They are unique along with related diazotrophs in this ability. They can make an enzyme called nitrogenase which, when deposited inside the oxygen free sacs they make called heterocysts, is capable of breaking the extremely strong bond between two nitrogen atoms in N2(nitrogen gas which is over 70% of the earth's atmosphere) ,thus, allowing the single N atoms to bind with H( hydrogen) and become bio available for such things as dna and proteins. Without cyanobacteria, often called the primordial slime, life on this planet would not exist. Fortunately, it is ubiquitous ,hardy and adaptable.

So, it needs light,water and CO2 ,phosphorous . It can make it's own fixed nitrogen and organic carbon. CO2 and water are plentifull in a reef tank. Light depravation stresses everything and cyano comes right back feasting on the nutrients even if other organisms don't. That leaves the elephant in the room,phospahte. Cut it down and the cyano will wane.

Clean up detritus accumulations
Siphon it out
Puff the sand bed if you have one
Puff out rock crevices
Reduce phosphate to very low levels and keep them there for as long as it takes wth reducedfeeding and a phospahte binder like gfo . If the PO4 is leaching from rocks and/or the aragonite sand previously exposed to high levels it may take months at low levels for it to stop.
I agree a Queen conch will eat it.