Disappearing Fish

R

rffanat1c

New member
So I have an interesting thing going on in my tank. I've had two fish completely disappear and one die in the last month. I have only added some coral and until yesterday, no fish. The first fish to go missing was my red firefish. He literally disappeared overnight. The last time he went missing, I found him in the sump and returned him to the DT. This time he is absolutely gone. Not in the sump, overflow, or on the floor around the tank.

The second fish to die was my Bi-color blenny. I found him dead on the sand bed one night after work fully intact and fat. I think my Azure damsel probably stressed him to death.

Just a few days later, less than 12 hours after I last saw my Azure damsel, he also vanished into thin air. No sign of him whatsoever. I suspected my emerald crab got these fish because they are the only ones that stay on the sand bed or sleep in a hiding spot.

I also have in the tank a pink spotted goby/pistol shrimp, a pair of Maroons that stay up off the sand bed and a Coral Beauty that sleeps with the maroons. I also have a Melanarus Wrasse that is about 5" long that sleeps in the sand bed. I just added a purple firefish and he is doing fine.

After the Azure went missing, I skewered the emerald crab out of my tank even though he was only the size of a quarter. The only other inverts in my tank are a cleaner shrimp and a red legged hermit crab that has been in the same rock hole for a month and is the size of a nickel.

Sg is 1.026, temp is 78, dkh is 9, calcium is 420, magnesium is 1400, nitrates are around 10, phosphate is below 0.3. Everything else is healthy including my corals. I just can't figure out how these fish are disappearing so fast. No carcass, no parts of fish lying around, no nothing. Just curious if anyone else has any insight. My LFS doesn't think the emerald could have done this but I've read different online according to some.
 
a quarter sized emerald crab isn't going to get a healthy fish. I've had very large emerald crabs (2 inches) without any problems, but people say they can nip at fins. fish can hide.. and then die in the hiding place. not sure how many hiding places you have in your tank but the fact that you cannot find the fish doesn't mean something is eating them.

I would suspect that the fish came from low sg water and were put quickly into the high sg water.

i have taken fish from a SG 1.02 and put them into 1.025 after too short of an acclimation period and several died after a few days.
 
I have nearly zero hiding spots. I've had this aquascape for two years and anytime something has died, it has appeared on the right side under my vortech. I lost a yellow tail damsel, a kole tang, a orange spot goby, and my blenny over the two years. All end up in the same spot regardless of where they die. I can find no trace of these fish at all.

2d81d00818969f7cda1235ca9b9109c1.jpg



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That emerald wouldn't get a healthy fish. How are you measuring SG? What is the source of your water?

Seems like too many fish to lose in 2 years.
 
Emerald crabs do not have the appropriate claw structure to hunt fish. Their claws are too small and tips are spooned for algae eating. Fish hunting crabs have large claws with sharp pointy tips.

No way a quarter sized emerald crab can tackle a fish. There are some reports that really large ones can overpower fish considerably smaller than them, but even that happens if the crab is starving. In most cases they are blamed for eating fish that are already dead or near death.

By the way keep in mind that duncan coral can eat small fish. http://s1280.photobucket.com/user/gcbose/media/duncan_zps9a48d50c.jpg.html

Either your Duncan coral ate them, or they died and cleanup crew simply consumed the dead before you can see the bodies.

Just to make sure that you do not have a sand burrowing fish predator, you can put in a bottle trap. But at this point I would not suspect that.
 
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Source of water is RODI. Sg is measured by a Milwaukee Digital Refractometer calibrated with their solution. My cleanup crew is ONE hermit crab the size of a nickle. I have two turbo snails and about 5 ceriths. My rock is was 100% dry when i started this tank 2.5 years ago so I have no hitchhikers.

And the Kole tang died due to refusing to eat and lasted a month. The orange spot goby wasted away after 6 months because he ate all the microfauna and didn't eat enough prepared food. The blenny was two years old and suddenly went out. The yellow tail got stressed by the Azure and died. So until recently, I've had the normal issues everyone else has


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A predator could have been on one of your corals as a baby. Might have grown up and is now eating your fish. It could also be that your fish are just dying and the cleanup crew is doing their job. Sounds like a nighttime stakeout is in order.
 
crawlerman said:
It could also be that your fish are just dying and the cleanup crew is doing their job.
Click to expand...

I think this is the overwhelming likelihood. You be surprised how quickly, and completely, a fish carcass is reduced. It always seems 'fashionable' to look for a boogeyman when fish disappear, but the explanation is unusually something less dramatic.
 
I know the vortech is why they end up where they do, question is why aren't i seeing them now. And please explain to me what clean up crew is eating a 2" fish carcass in less than 12 hours?? I have ONE hermit crab and sand sifting snails and the one emerald


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rffanat1c said:
And please explain to me what clean up crew is eating a 2" fish carcass in less than 12 hours?? I have ONE hermit crab and sand sifting snails and the one emerald.
Click to expand...

Because 90% of the CUC you never see - bristle worms, small crabs, bacteria ..... Also, though you have minimal 'hiding' spots, doesn't mean some remains aren't stuffed behind or under a rock.
 
If you're not QTing the fish, you could very well have a hidden parasitic killer already established in your tank. Velvet and ick both often kill with no visible signs--since it attacks the gill tissue first.

And as others have said here, your CUC--of bristle worms, bacteria, peanut worms, etc, will make short work of a small fish.
 
It does sound like your CUC is the likely culprit, combined with possibly pulling carcasses under rocks where you can't seem em. Could also be one of the fish died and was devoured by the duncan.

I wouldn't be too concerned at this point. If another fish mysteriously disappears, I'd pick up the rocks to see if it got pulled under.
 
Logic seems to dictate previous fish that died would have been consumed just as quickly and possibly could not have been seen but they were all found. It is just weird that suddenly in 1 month I have one fish die that I do find whole and in the usual spot and two disappear completely with no trace. The only common factor here are fish that sleep close to the sand bed and were small in size.

I tested my ammonia levels today and they are 0, so whatever that is worth. I'll keep an eye on all of it, but my gut tells me something else is going on that I can't figure out. We all get a feel for our tanks after enough time and something isn't feeling right.
 
You can set a trap to see if you have a sand burrowing fish predator like bobbit worm or spearing mantis shrimp but those animals rarely make their way into tanks as hitchhikers. If you can see the underside of your tank (like glass bottomed tank), check it out to see if anything is there.

What I dont understand is you suspect a quarter sized emerald crab can eat a small fish in 12 hours but dont think the CUC can do it. An emerald crab plus the cleaner shrimp and the red hermit would be enough to eat a small fish in 12H even without any other scavengers. They might not been able to consume your previous dead fish if the dead fish just kept floating around or if not enough time had passed for them find it .They will also scavenge better in dark, if the fish died during the day, you are more likely to find it.
 
It was just a suspicion based on reading people's experiences on here. The reason I don't think a CUC did it is because for some reason my fish have always died at night. I work midnights and leave the house at 6:30 p.m. and get home at 5:30 a.m. So I always look at my tank when I leave and get home. I get the CUC not taking care of a Kole Tang in 12 hours, but it almost seems physically impossible for one cleaner shrimp, one hermit crab and one emerald devouring a whole fish with no evidence in that time is all. Just seems like I would have seen it before is all. I'm not discounting the possibility at all. When I found my yellow tale damsel, it was half eaten but the skeleton was still present on the half eaten part. The kole tang, goby, and blenny were all untouched when I found them. Which I understand they could have died an hour or two before I found them and the CUC never had a chance.

I cannot see the bottom of my tank because when I was running BB, I had painted the underside of the glass. Anything is possible and obviously something is happening to them. It is just weird how it is all of the sudden like this.
 
rffanat1c said:
Logic seems to dictate previous fish that died would have been consumed just as quickly and possibly could not have been seen but they were all found.
Click to expand...

Who knows. If you went the 'hermetically sealed' route than it may be that bristle worms came in on your coral frags and have taken time to increase in numbers.
 
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