DIY- "Pins" method of gluing acrylic.
- Thread starter Zephrant
- Start date
melev
Well-known member
30 seconds with #3, but at least 60 to 90 seconds with #4.
Btw, have you been using up all your needles? I was thinking about ordering some, unless you'd let me buy some of your excess ones. My preference is the one with the solid metal end (might be .16mm), but I think .20 is the better thickness.
Btw, have you been using up all your needles? I was thinking about ordering some, unless you'd let me buy some of your excess ones. My preference is the one with the solid metal end (might be .16mm), but I think .20 is the better thickness.
I still have a ton of .18s solid or not I use a box of the .20s and can almost do 2 tanks with that amount. I guess I am using just over 50 pins when I do a top or bottom lol. I have been wanting to get some shorter .20s. I feel when they are so long it can be a pain till I get the shims in there, esp when I am working on a wide tank and it hangs over the edge of my work space 
I would be happy to send you some extras or go in on an order again.
PM me your # if you like. I am a bit crunched for time ATM but I could work some time to figure out PiNZ!
I would be happy to send you some extras or go in on an order again.
PM me your # if you like. I am a bit crunched for time ATM but I could work some time to figure out PiNZ!
melev
Well-known member
What I did was cut the wires shorter to since they were too long for me as well. This helps when the end gets curly from repeated use and cleaning.
I'll buy some of yours, or do an order with you. I typically use 8 or 10 at a time, and I've been reusing them a lot as you can imagine. So if you want to unload what you aren't going to need or use, let me know. Or if you want to just get more, that is fine with me. PMing now.
I'll buy some of yours, or do an order with you. I typically use 8 or 10 at a time, and I've been reusing them a lot as you can imagine. So if you want to unload what you aren't going to need or use, let me know. Or if you want to just get more, that is fine with me. PMing now.
A Reef Scene
New member
that is some great info
I can't afford to send them to everyone 
Here is a link for you though.
http://www.healthpointproducts.com/index.html
There is a 25 buck min. Thats about 8 boxes you need to figure out.
Here is a few things that Melv and I think about the pins so far:
- We both like the accupuncture needles
- We both think the .18 might be a bit thin. But we don't know if the .22 or .25 are too big.
- I felt the 40mm were too long in many cases. I am a slob and I need the tool to complensate for my lack of grace. This next order I will get either 15mm (1/2") or the 30mm needles, max.
- I don't build stuff often, but when I do I make as many tanks as possible. I have enough space to do 4 at a time. I use lots of needles at once The best method so far is to pull the needles and drop them right into a tupperware. You need to clean the needles off before the next time you use them. They will have solvant residue on them... well, perhaps that would melt again, but I clean them off any how.
-melv prefered the solid handles on the Sharp brand.
-occasionally I whipped out a small .16 to pop a bubble before pulling the pin. But, i found in most cases the bubbles go away anyhow when I drop the sides (pull the pins). There was a few bubbles I regret not popping, but I cant always know when poping it will make it worse or better, so I gave up doing that.
I wish I had got acupuncture needles from the start. I wasted enough money on guitar strings and the smallest guage crud from the hardware stores I could find.
If your going to make any order at all i highly suggest at least one box of .20 Sharp 30mm. I am not sure those are the best, but I guess thats what will work best for most folks. We are still in the experiment phaze.
8 boxes should easly fill out your club with "pins" for the average diyer.
Here is a link for you though.http://www.healthpointproducts.com/index.html
There is a 25 buck min. Thats about 8 boxes you need to figure out.
Here is a few things that Melv and I think about the pins so far:
- We both like the accupuncture needles
- We both think the .18 might be a bit thin. But we don't know if the .22 or .25 are too big.
- I felt the 40mm were too long in many cases. I am a slob and I need the tool to complensate for my lack of grace. This next order I will get either 15mm (1/2") or the 30mm needles, max.
- I don't build stuff often, but when I do I make as many tanks as possible. I have enough space to do 4 at a time. I use lots of needles at once
The best method so far is to pull the needles and drop them right into a tupperware. You need to clean the needles off before the next time you use them. They will have solvant residue on them... well, perhaps that would melt again, but I clean them off any how.-melv prefered the solid handles on the Sharp brand.
-occasionally I whipped out a small .16 to pop a bubble before pulling the pin. But, i found in most cases the bubbles go away anyhow when I drop the sides (pull the pins). There was a few bubbles I regret not popping, but I cant always know when poping it will make it worse or better, so I gave up doing that.
I wish I had got acupuncture needles from the start. I wasted enough money on guitar strings and the smallest guage crud from the hardware stores I could find.
If your going to make any order at all i highly suggest at least one box of .20 Sharp 30mm. I am not sure those are the best, but I guess thats what will work best for most folks. We are still in the experiment phaze.
8 boxes should easly fill out your club with "pins" for the average diyer.
Equalizer
New member
Here are the last of what I have so far. One is the tank, second is the sump/fuge, and the last one is the tank stand and fuge.
The tank is 24" cube made with 3/8 acrylic, the sump is 18" cube made out of 1/4" acrylic, and the stand and hood are made out of outdoor sign grade MDO.
Im plumbing my RO/DI unit this week and will have more updates to follow.
Thanks for all the help guys.
The tank is 24" cube made with 3/8 acrylic, the sump is 18" cube made out of 1/4" acrylic, and the stand and hood are made out of outdoor sign grade MDO.
Im plumbing my RO/DI unit this week and will have more updates to follow.
Thanks for all the help guys.
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FYI I have been recieving some PMs. It seems in all of our governments wisdom, some states prohibit the purchace of these dangerous needles ;p So, do not be supprized if a messege comes up and says, "You need to be a licensed acupuncturist to purchace these WMDs" Or, something to that effect.
gbr
Premium Member
melev, Zephrant, Acrylics...
a few questions for the pros...
It seems as though the preferred method is to glue the side to the back one at a time and then glue the front to both sides and then glue the bottom on...true? or would the top come before the bottom?
What does the term "euro-bracing" actually refer to? Is that where the top is out of one solid piece and then the openings are routed or is that were there are just strips glued along the top edges to make a brace...or is it just a catch term for any top bracing?
Is there a particular brand of double sided tape you find works best? (didn't see it in your pics on your tools page melev)
How do you align the framing squares when taping them? Due to the notched bottom that seems like it would be a guessing game.
What holds the vertical piece in place while you set the pins? I only have two hands...:eek1: I'm guessing more double sided tape but it seems like when you pull the pins you could pull away from the tape as gravity takes over...is that were you start shimming?...
Thanks for all the great info so far.
melev...always have loved your site...now I think it is time to break out the old video cam and post up a movie on doing one joint...would really help. Thanks again.
a few questions for the pros...
It seems as though the preferred method is to glue the side to the back one at a time and then glue the front to both sides and then glue the bottom on...true? or would the top come before the bottom?
What does the term "euro-bracing" actually refer to? Is that where the top is out of one solid piece and then the openings are routed or is that were there are just strips glued along the top edges to make a brace...or is it just a catch term for any top bracing?
Is there a particular brand of double sided tape you find works best? (didn't see it in your pics on your tools page melev)
How do you align the framing squares when taping them? Due to the notched bottom that seems like it would be a guessing game.
What holds the vertical piece in place while you set the pins? I only have two hands...:eek1: I'm guessing more double sided tape but it seems like when you pull the pins you could pull away from the tape as gravity takes over...is that were you start shimming?...
Thanks for all the great info so far.
melev...always have loved your site...now I think it is time to break out the old video cam and post up a movie on doing one joint...would really help. Thanks again.
melev
Well-known member
<b>It seems as though the preferred method is to glue the side to the back one at a time and then glue the front to both sides and then glue the bottom on...true? or would the top come before the bottom?</b>
I like to put the front panel facing down, and glue the ends and baffles to it. That way the front seams look their best, hopefully. I flip the whole thing over and then glue all those parts to the back wall. Then I glue on the base, and typically the next day the top. (Another guy I know glues on the top (which has already been routed for the opening), then flips it over to glue on the bottom, because the top is open and air can get in and vapors out.) Here's a link to some construction images of a sump I built not too long ago:
http://melevsreef.com/acrylics/sumps/chvy/chvy_sump.html
<b>What does the term "euro-bracing" actually refer to? Is that where the top is out of one solid piece and then the openings are routed or is that were there are just strips glued along the top edges to make a brace...or is it just a catch term for any top bracing?</b>
Typically, Euro-bracing is how four strips of glass are glued within the top of a glass tank, reinforcing the panels so they do not bow due to the water pressure. It also refers to a tank that does not have a centerbrace of any kind. I prefer to build sumps with a top flange because I like the clean appearance:
http://melevsreef.com/acrylics/sumps/diy/flange.html
<b>Is there a particular brand of double sided tape you find works best? (didn't see it in your pics on your tools page melev)</b>
I almost never use it. Maybe two times out of 106 sumps. 3M is found at Home Depot.
<b>How do you align the framing squares when taping them? Due to the notched bottom that seems like it would be a guessing game.</b>
The smooth area of the Speed Square (or Framing Square) maintains the pieces at a perperdicular angle, or 90 degree angle. The notch that has been cut out is to avoid the solvent wicking or bleeding under the speed square, maring the surfaces within the sump. You'd be amazed how handy that is, having that corner trimmed off.
There are times when I put a speed square on both sides of one panel, which keeps it from falling to the left or to the right. And if it happens to be an end piece, one speed square is on the acrylic holding the end up, and the other square is on the wooden work area. Because of the notch, I can press it up along side the sump, and it fits right over the base piece and pressed up against the end piece perfectly. Without being notched, I couldn't do that.
I've been playing with the idea of mounting weights, or even affixing magnets to keep the square where I need it in a more permanent way, freeing up my hands. Maybe one day I'll follow through with that plan.
<b>What holds the vertical piece in place while you set the pins? I only have two hands... I'm guessing more double sided tape but it seems like when you pull the pins you could pull away from the tape as gravity takes over...is that were you start shimming?...</b>
Since I'm gluing on ends and baffles, those pieces are smaller. I use the speed square to keep my piece supported, although I do let it lean slightly. I slip the pins underneath, straighten the piece and tug to make sure the pins are holding. If they need a shim, I'll insert one where necessary. Keeping my hand on the upright piece, I apply the solvent, wicking it in to the seam. After about 15 seconds or so, I stand the piece up at a true 90 degree angle, which helps push out any excess glue out of the joint. The pins are pulled and the speed squares are positioned on both sides.
I make sure to verify the piece is in the exact correct spot during the next 20 seconds, moving it up and down and side to side if it has slipped out of position.
<b>Thanks for all the great info so far.
melev...always have loved your site...now I think it is time to break out the old video cam and post up a movie on doing one joint...would really help. Thanks again.</b>
You are right, I should do that.
I like to put the front panel facing down, and glue the ends and baffles to it. That way the front seams look their best, hopefully. I flip the whole thing over and then glue all those parts to the back wall. Then I glue on the base, and typically the next day the top. (Another guy I know glues on the top (which has already been routed for the opening), then flips it over to glue on the bottom, because the top is open and air can get in and vapors out.) Here's a link to some construction images of a sump I built not too long ago:
http://melevsreef.com/acrylics/sumps/chvy/chvy_sump.html
<b>What does the term "euro-bracing" actually refer to? Is that where the top is out of one solid piece and then the openings are routed or is that were there are just strips glued along the top edges to make a brace...or is it just a catch term for any top bracing?</b>
Typically, Euro-bracing is how four strips of glass are glued within the top of a glass tank, reinforcing the panels so they do not bow due to the water pressure. It also refers to a tank that does not have a centerbrace of any kind. I prefer to build sumps with a top flange because I like the clean appearance:
http://melevsreef.com/acrylics/sumps/diy/flange.html
<b>Is there a particular brand of double sided tape you find works best? (didn't see it in your pics on your tools page melev)</b>
I almost never use it. Maybe two times out of 106 sumps. 3M is found at Home Depot.
<b>How do you align the framing squares when taping them? Due to the notched bottom that seems like it would be a guessing game.</b>
The smooth area of the Speed Square (or Framing Square) maintains the pieces at a perperdicular angle, or 90 degree angle. The notch that has been cut out is to avoid the solvent wicking or bleeding under the speed square, maring the surfaces within the sump. You'd be amazed how handy that is, having that corner trimmed off.
There are times when I put a speed square on both sides of one panel, which keeps it from falling to the left or to the right. And if it happens to be an end piece, one speed square is on the acrylic holding the end up, and the other square is on the wooden work area. Because of the notch, I can press it up along side the sump, and it fits right over the base piece and pressed up against the end piece perfectly. Without being notched, I couldn't do that.
I've been playing with the idea of mounting weights, or even affixing magnets to keep the square where I need it in a more permanent way, freeing up my hands. Maybe one day I'll follow through with that plan.
<b>What holds the vertical piece in place while you set the pins? I only have two hands... I'm guessing more double sided tape but it seems like when you pull the pins you could pull away from the tape as gravity takes over...is that were you start shimming?...</b>
Since I'm gluing on ends and baffles, those pieces are smaller. I use the speed square to keep my piece supported, although I do let it lean slightly. I slip the pins underneath, straighten the piece and tug to make sure the pins are holding. If they need a shim, I'll insert one where necessary. Keeping my hand on the upright piece, I apply the solvent, wicking it in to the seam. After about 15 seconds or so, I stand the piece up at a true 90 degree angle, which helps push out any excess glue out of the joint. The pins are pulled and the speed squares are positioned on both sides.
I make sure to verify the piece is in the exact correct spot during the next 20 seconds, moving it up and down and side to side if it has slipped out of position.
<b>Thanks for all the great info so far.
melev...always have loved your site...now I think it is time to break out the old video cam and post up a movie on doing one joint...would really help. Thanks again.</b>
You are right, I should do that.
gbr
Premium Member
Thanks melev...I understand the need for the notches but I was more refering to how the two ends being glued together stay along the same line without angling slightly...I guess I would have to draw a picture. But what I am getting out of this is that the square can actually hold up your end piece without falling over and creating a mess????? I can just envision the end piece leaning up against the square, pulling the pins, and then watch as the whole thing falls either right or left in on itself...guess that isn't as big of a concern.
Your tools page shows guitar strings. Are you on to those now or are you on the acupunture pins? Have you found anywhere else online that sells the pins without requiring a $25 order? The local acrylic tank manufacturer uses fishing line...ever tried that?
Your tools page shows guitar strings. Are you on to those now or are you on the acupunture pins? Have you found anywhere else online that sells the pins without requiring a $25 order? The local acrylic tank manufacturer uses fishing line...ever tried that?
melev
Well-known member
"Acrylics" (James) recommends stainless steel wire that is .007 thick. http://www.smallparts.com/products/descriptions/SAW.cfm
That is $14 plus shipping.
I'm using the acupuncture needles Adrinal tried out. He pm'd me recently about getting more, but I've not had time to respond and decide.
You can even use the twist ties that come on loaves of bread if you like. The thicker the wire, the more solvent in the seam. As the acrylic comes down when the pins are pulled, the more stuff will ooze out. It doesn't look pretty.
Can a sheet fall over? Yes! Can it make a mess? Yes!
However, most of the time they stay put, if I put a speed square on both sides for a few minutes. After that, they stay put. However, if you remove the square a little too soon, it may begin to lean one way or the other and cure that way. So keep an eye on things, and don't rush.
That is $14 plus shipping.
I'm using the acupuncture needles Adrinal tried out. He pm'd me recently about getting more, but I've not had time to respond and decide.
You can even use the twist ties that come on loaves of bread if you like. The thicker the wire, the more solvent in the seam. As the acrylic comes down when the pins are pulled, the more stuff will ooze out. It doesn't look pretty.
Can a sheet fall over? Yes! Can it make a mess? Yes!
However, most of the time they stay put, if I put a speed square on both sides for a few minutes. After that, they stay put. However, if you remove the square a little too soon, it may begin to lean one way or the other and cure that way. So keep an eye on things, and don't rush.
