Donovan's Nitrate Destroyer

[nematode]

My reactor is just under 24 inches on the taller side. 4 inch drain piping (thin stuff). So about 9 liters of total capacity. And this has lowered the nitrates on my 500 gal system from 100 to 25 ( I have done a second testing now) in a little over two weeks (3/18 > 4/2) since set up without doing any innoculation with bacteria. I was running NOPOX before I started the reactor and diverted all my NOPOX into the reactor when I set it up (50 ml per day in 10 doses of 2 or 3 ml) spread out every 2-3 hrs. Quite amazing.

So far the only downsides are 1) I am having to play with the setting on the in flow virtually every day now to keep flow running through the reactor.
2) Lots of gelatinous clear mats growing in the area around where the flow exits the reactor.

But I have been trying so long to get the nitrates down for so long, it is more that worth these two hassles. (Enough Water changes to reduce nitrates on a 500 gal system is a nightmare).

 

[blackthunda77]

My reactor is just under 24 inches on the taller side. 4 inch drain piping (thin stuff). So about 9 liters of total capacity. And this has lowered the nitrates on my 500 gal system from 100 to 25 ( I have done a second testing now) in a little over two weeks (3/18 > 4/2) since set up without doing any innoculation with bacteria. I was running NOPOX before I started the reactor and diverted all my NOPOX into the reactor when I set it up (50 ml per day in 10 doses of 2 or 3 ml) spread out every 2-3 hrs. Quite amazing.

So far the only downsides are 1) I am having to play with the setting on the in flow virtually every day now to keep flow running through the reactor.
2) Lots of gelatinous clear mats growing in the area around where the flow exits the reactor.

But I have been trying so long to get the nitrates down for so long, it is more that worth these two hassles. (Enough Water changes to reduce nitrates on a 500 gal system is a nightmare).

Nematode, I'm in the same boat as you. Had no3 as high as 100+ in my 220 gal system. Only way I got no3 down consistently was with 50% + water changes, and that was a hassle and expensive. Thus why I have been following the thread for a couple months and I'm about ready to start the build.

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[jml1149]

There's no risk to do this, and the cost compared to other, less effective approaches is fairly small. I think it was like 20 bucks in PVC and 50-70 in material? And I overbought some of it.

 

[blackthunda77]

There's no risk to do this, and the cost compared to other, less effective approaches is fairly small. I think it was like 20 bucks in PVC and 50-70 in material? And I overbought some of it.

What media did you buy that is working for you? I'm still researching which media to invest in. I have about 2 or 3 liters of matrix in Tupperware in the sump witch is doing nothing, so I'll transfer that into the new reactor. Also have a plate of marine pure which is broken so I'm thinking to break it apart more and use that as well. But I will still need a bit more media.

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[jml1149]

The first leg of the reactor is various sizes of bioballs, which are dirt cheap. I must have hundreds and hundreds of leftover bioballs that I literally can't give away. Then ceramic rings of various sorts and sizes, get the generic ones on eBay. Then I the large pumice, followed by the denitrate. I have leftover denitrate too.

This does not include the fittings for the ORP probe, the probe itself, etc. I added later.

I would reuse the matrix, absolutely. It might be doing something, but using it in this application will make it work better. And yeah, you could smash up the marine pure block and use that too.

 

[djbon]

Nematode, if you happen to have extra socks, you can catch the excess bacteria and clean it up in the sink. I did this myself and I swear the bacteria slime was thick, slimy and yucky. Daily cleaning for more than a week brought down nitrate faster, I have to squeeze the slime for proper cleaning.

 

[nematode]

I am not actually sure if the thick slimy stuff is coming out of the reactor, or a growth because of what metabolites are coming out of the reactor.
I can easily add a sock. will do this evening.

 

[jml1149]

Agree, the filter socks on the output of nitrate reactor are super, super yucky.

 

[blackthunda77]

What about directing the effluent to the skimmer like when using biopellets?

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[nematode]

There's no risk to do this.
I think there potentially is one. This morning my flow was down to a very slow drip 3 drops a second and when I tuned the flow up I definitely was smelling a little rotten egg smell. My system is so big I didn't worry about it too much, I just set the flow back up a little higher.

But, I would gather that in one did get the reactor running at the wrong rate (very very slow), you might get out some H2S. Not sure if there is a real potential for danger or not.

 

[nematode]

What about directing the effluent to the skimmer like when using biopellets?

Not easy currently in my case because of the skimmer input location.

 

[djbon]

Sure, skimmer is the key exporter other than being consumed by corals and filter feeders. Catching the excess bacteria with socks is way better than skimmer on initial stage of maturity. It will just stick to the socks, thickened and literally clogging the socks. Imagine that the slime build up was like blowing your nose to a bowl on a very bad flu. Luckily it doesn't smells.

 

[djbon]

There's no risk to do this.
I think there potentially is one. This morning my flow was down to a very slow drip 3 drops a second and when I tuned the flow up I definitely was smelling a little rotten egg smell. My system is so big I didn't worry about it too much, I just set the flow back up a little higher.

But, I would gather that in one did get the reactor running at the wrong rate (very very slow), you might get out some H2S. Not sure if there is a real potential for danger or not.

Happened to me once as well, after massive bacteria build up I believe o2 are being consumed very fast, creating huge anaerobic zones, to a point that some area is starting to use sulfate. Increasing effluent output will solve this issue. At this stage frequent flow adjustment is necessary, once less nitrate is available, bacteria will get lesser.

 

[ReefKeeper64]

My reactor is just under 24 inches on the taller side. 4 inch drain piping (thin stuff). So about 9 liters of total capacity. And this has lowered the nitrates on my 500 gal system from 100 to 25 ( I have done a second testing now) in a little over two weeks (3/18 > 4/2) since set up without doing any innoculation with bacteria. I was running NOPOX before I started the reactor and diverted all my NOPOX into the reactor when I set it up (50 ml per day in 10 doses of 2 or 3 ml) spread out every 2-3 hrs. Quite amazing.

So far the only downsides are 1) I am having to play with the setting on the in flow virtually every day now to keep flow running through the reactor.
2) Lots of gelatinous clear mats growing in the area around where the flow exits the reactor.

But I have been trying so long to get the nitrates down for so long, it is more that worth these two hassles. (Enough Water changes to reduce nitrates on a 500 gal system is a nightmare).

How are your phosphates? This goes for everyone on this thread.

I have been able to manage nitrate with carbon dosing alone in with my last build. With my new build I will be able to take it up a knotch with the Donovan low profile denitrator.

In the past I could usually get PO4 down to where I wanted it by adding a bit of sodium nitrate. This way bacteria could continue to thrive and pull out whatever PO4 remained in the DT. From what I was reading on a Natureef Denitrator thread last night, stronium nitrate is preferred over sodium nitrate because the stronium apparently helps to precipitate the PO4, which is an added benefit over sodium nitrate. So what is everyone's experience with PO4 using this denitrator and are you supplementing anything to drop it down without having to $$buy$$ a continuous supply of GFO?

 

[nematode]

0.5 ppm right now. Was significantly higher a month ago when I last tested ~1.5 ppm. Has in the past been even much higher than that, but I keeping it from going through the roof using GFO. I haven't used any new GFO in a few months now- since I started this set of nitrate reactor experiments since I figured the phophate would be used up as the nitrates got used up.

 

[ReefKeeper64]

0.5 ppm right now. Was significantly higher a month ago when I last tested ~1.5 ppm. Has in the past been even much higher than that, but I keeping it from going through the roof using GFO. I haven't used any new GFO in a few months now- since I started this set of nitrate reactor experiments since I figured the phophate would be used up as the nitrates got used up.

Compared to what your levels used to be, your tank is looking much better. Your tank still has a long way to go before that algae in the DT will die off. When you get to 0 nitrates, your bacteria will start to die off before the algae. You can either use GFO or dose nitrate to get your PO4 down further.

The nitrate will provide your bacteria with what they want/need to drive your bacteria population back up. With more bacteria, both your NO3 and PO4 will be consumed by the bacteria. The bacteria seem to consume more NO3 at dinner time then PO4 so you have to supplement with extra N03. Take either one off the the menu and they go on a hunger strike!

 

[nematode]

This system actually doesn't have an algae problem. Left two thirds of 260 tank below.
My other system that has zero detectable phosphate or nitrates has many more algae issues.
Is it because high nitrates intefere with algae growth? or the fact that I have millions of little tiny nocturnal snails that come out of my rock every evening? or control by herbivores? or all 3? who knows. but algae problems isn't why I am trying to control nitrates.

It is because if I take an nice acro or monti frag from my 100 system and put it in this tank, it starts to die in 4 days. Day 1 looks great, day 2 less good, day 3 won't put out polyps, day 4 tissue recession starts.

 

[ReefKeeper64]

This system actually doesn't have an algae problem. Left two thirds of 260 tank below.
My other system that has zero detectable phosphate or nitrates has many more algae issues.
Is it because high nitrates intefere with algae growth? or the fact that I have millions of little tiny nocturnal snails that come out of my rock every evening? or control by herbivores? or all 3? who knows. but algae problems isn't why I am trying to control nitrates.

It is because if I take an nice acro or monti frag from my 100 system and put it in this tank, it starts to die in 4 days. Day 1 looks great, day 2 less good, day 3 won't put out polyps, day 4 tissue recession starts.

Cool picture. I got started in this obsession about 6 years ago and had the usual algae issues most of us see when getting started. You have a 2 tanks and one is 500 gallons, so I know you are no newbie here. In fact, you have probably been at this longer than I have. Now back then, even when my Alk and PH was steady, my little SPS baby frags would brown out die when PO4 creeped up above 0.020 for very long.

I happened to get involved with the ATS crowd in 2013 and bought a large Santa Monica 100 ATS. It did lower PO4 and also starved out the algae in the DT as promised. PO4 dropped to 0.03 or less in the process. The ATS was a headache however and I eventually ditched it and moved on to using macro algae in a refugium. Not as powerful as an ATS for the amount of space it takes up but the same idea and it worked ok. A refugium or large ATS that is well built creates a better environment for algae to grow than in the DT essentially.

No idea what magic is going on in that other tank of yours. One way or another, when you get your PO4 and NO3 down to ideal levels in this one you will be able to keep acros in it. I can see this in your near future!

 

[nematode]

I've tried an ATS and I did not find the benefits worth the hassle.

I wish I had answers to why systems (-tanks and associated sump, refugium etc) behave the way they do. I think they reach an equilibrium and its hard to change.
For example, I currently have a 20 gal (10gal tank, 10 gal sump) coral Quarantine tank I now haven't used to Q corals because it is a dinoflagelette magnet. I have tried everything to get this tank back to normal. 90% water change with water from my "good" tanks and scrubbing all the rock as much as possible, but the dinoflagelettes just taken over again.

But this never spreads to any of my three other systems (the 500 system , the 100 system and my fish 20 g Q tank.)
Each has their "reason d'etre" and it really takes a big change to alter the established equilibrium of the system.
Even within linked tanks in a system I see differences ( my 100 has a 55 coral frag tank, a 20 g "refugium", the sump, and my main 35 ) -yes, I know it adds up to more than 100.

The 55g coral has no algae problem at all, but in the main tank I am constantly fighting the algae. But both are linked to the same sump!!!. Somehow the balance or herbivores/fish/snails/ nutrient uptake is different. Now, I grab pieces from the 35 that have hair algae, move them to the 55, the aglae goes away, and I move them back. And that is the way I control algae in the 35.

The complexity of these system is astounding.

 

[djbon]

After one year marks since running this denitrator, it has been easier for me to maintain my tank. I tried a few nutrient export system and failed. Wasted a lot of money running off the shelf products (not much choice by the way).