Drains vs Pump size help

[JMorris271]

Again, you have it backwards.
If you have to dial the drain in order to achieve a certain level and flow through your overflow and letting is run unrestricted caused overflow to go dry only means ur return pump is not sufficient.
guys its not the drain that run the show its the return pump.
its very simple, whatever the return pump will push up is same exact going to come down (generally speaking if return after head loss is not more than drain's capacity)

With a pump doing 600 gph,300 gal. per drain, one 600gph pump less head will be ok instead of 2 with only 1 return going back into the tank?

 

[RocketEngineer]

With a single pipe drain, 1" will not flow 600gph quietly. You would be lucky to get 100gph through a pipe that small and stay relatively quite.

The amount of water that the return pump introduces into the display is the same amount that will drain out of the display (whether into the sump or onto the floor). The trick is adjusting the return flow to match what the drains can handle. Using other methods like the Herbie or BeanAnimal allow the drains to handle a lot higher flow but they still get adjusted down to what the pump is pushing into the display.

 

[JMorris271]

I will have 2 1"drains Not one. Couldn't they handle 300 each and not be too noisy?

 

[JMorris271]

With a single pipe drain, 1" will not flow 600gph quietly. You would be lucky to get 100gph through a pipe that small and stay relatively quite.

The amount of water that the return pump introduces into the display is the same amount that will drain out of the display (whether into the sump or onto the floor). The trick is adjusting the return flow to match what the drains can handle. Using other methods like the Herbie or BeanAnimal allow the drains to handle a lot higher flow but they still get adjusted down to what the pump is pushing into the display.

Aren't most standard drains 1"?

So that is to say with I" drain pipe,I can only get 200gph through 2 pipes and not be noisy?:headwally:
I may as well stick with Durso then.

 

[JMorris271]

300 gph would be noisy? How exasperating

 

[shermanator]

Aren't most standard drains 1"?

So that is to say with I" drain pipe,I can only get 200gph through 2 pipes and not be noisy?:headwally:
I may as well stick with Durso then.

If you have a siphon (Herbie or Bean), it won't be noisy (even full siphon).

 

[JMorris271]

If you have a siphon (Herbie or Bean), it won't be noisy (even full siphon).

Is the max flow I can get with a Herbie full siphon system through a 1" drain 100 gph?

 

[shermanator]

Is the max flow I can get with a Herbie full siphon system through a 1" drain 100 gph?

No, it's about 1500 gph+ for 1". That is why it has to be gated.

I posted this earlier, but this is the best description of what and how to do a Herbie: http://gmacreef.com/herbie-overflow-reef-tank-plumbing-method-basics/ If you are interested in a Herbie, read that link.

With a Durso, you can do well over 100 gph in a 1", but it starts getting noisy at 50-100 gph due to the air/water mix. In a 1.5" Durso and you can do 300 gph (or so) without being too loud.

 

[RocketEngineer]

Whoever decided that 1" drains can run 600gph didn't understand physics. The tank companies never took notice of better systems, just kept selling the same junky idea.

If you have two 1" lines in each overflow box you are golden. Go with a herbie in each box and you would have plenty of flow.

 

[JMorris271]

No, it's about 1500 gph+ for 1". That is why it has to be gated.

I posted this earlier, but this is the best description of what and how to do a Herbie: http://gmacreef.com/herbie-overflow-reef-tank-plumbing-method-basics/ If you are interested in a Herbie, read that link.

With a Durso, you can do well over 100 gph in a 1", but it starts getting noisy at 50-100 gph due to the air/water mix. In a 1.5" Durso and you can do 300 gph (or so) without being too loud.

I did read that article you posted earlier. Thanks for sending it my way.Tons of good stuff about Herbie.

 

[JMorris271]

OK.
Herbie Overflow system
2 1" drains
2 Gate valves
1 600 gph pump
1 1" Return line


Done

 

[JMorris271]

Herbie just went down the drain.:hammer:
BA it is.

 

[RocketEngineer]

Good move.

 

[shermanator]

Herbie just went down the drain.:hammer:
BA it is.

You have dual overflows, right? What are your plans with the overflow that will now have stagnant water in it? Fill it with sand?

 

[JMorris271]

I'm glad you asked that as I was just thinking about the very same thing last night.
IDK. Good question.
Any suggestions besides sand?

 

[JMorris271]

The solution with the Herbie or Bean is that you dial back the siphon with a gate valve to match the return pump (it still maintains an air-free siphon, but lower flow). It makes it dead silent. And since this can be a recipe for disaster (perfectly matched drain and return), each siphon has an emergency return (usually with larger diameter pipe than the siphon). Bean adds the 3rd pipe, which is even safer but not an option with dual corner overflows.

The best writeup of the Herbie is at GMAC Reef: http://gmacreef.com/herbie-overflow-reef-tank-plumbing-method-basics/

They explain it much better than I can. The key innovation of Herbie / Bean is the use of a dialed back siphon (with gate valve).

Sherm, Can you tell me what you are talking about as per the recipe for disaster please?

 

[JMorris271]

I'm glad you asked that as I was just thinking about the very same thing last night.
IDK. Good question.
Any suggestions besides sand?

The 123 Deep blue has adjustable dams to raise or lower the overflow level.
The Emergency and return drain are in one corner that will be closed off to water body and should only contain water in an emergency event. "Therotically speaking"
This "should" prevent or at least minimize a stagnate water situation