DSB in a bucket for nitrate control
- Thread starter Hobster
- Start date
- Status
Anthony Calfo
New member
Paul... the dry rock alone in the display (versus LR) plus the various sand media will easily provide sufficient biological filtration to support a small bioload and then some. Nitrifying faculties will colonize surfaces fast and furiously.
But the DSB bucket alone cannot be relied on for any significent amount of nitrifying. The surface area is rather small for aerobic conditions. The DSB bucket is really just a potential (albeit) significant source of natural nitrate reduction.
But the DSB bucket alone cannot be relied on for any significent amount of nitrifying. The surface area is rather small for aerobic conditions. The DSB bucket is really just a potential (albeit) significant source of natural nitrate reduction.
Here we go. Give me a couple weeks and I will add this to my system. I have had many threads out here about my tank being practically overrun by GHA. Right now my Nitrates read 10ppm but we all know it's higher if I have GHA.
What I run right now is a 75gal BB with a 75gal DSB. 6" deep on the sand. By bio load is two clowns, 1 scooter blenny, 2 serpant stars, 30 Nassarrias, 30 hermits, 15-20 mushrooms, 41 pally thoas, 11 red zoos, 1 toadstool, and a couple other corals. When I get this made to tie in with my tank-to-sump I will let you all know. Then I will record my nitrates ever week, on Fridays, before I do my water changes.
QUESTION: I run fine silica sand in my sump with no problems of diatoms or anything. ANTHONY: what Exactly would you recommend for the sand I use, or don't it really matter? PM me.
What I run right now is a 75gal BB with a 75gal DSB. 6" deep on the sand. By bio load is two clowns, 1 scooter blenny, 2 serpant stars, 30 Nassarrias, 30 hermits, 15-20 mushrooms, 41 pally thoas, 11 red zoos, 1 toadstool, and a couple other corals. When I get this made to tie in with my tank-to-sump I will let you all know. Then I will record my nitrates ever week, on Fridays, before I do my water changes.
QUESTION: I run fine silica sand in my sump with no problems of diatoms or anything. ANTHONY: what Exactly would you recommend for the sand I use, or don't it really matter? PM me.
Anthony Calfo
New member
I do prefer some sort of calcareous/carbonate sand over silica for shape (tumbled or round) versus silica (sharp, angular).
I have very few worries about the composition of silica if you need to use it.
Get aragonite of you can... calcite is fine instead if you must for a calcareous source.
Seachem bags some very nice sands... calcite and aragonite of various colors. They are a big name that is not that hard to find in LFS shops across the states (or most LFS folks can easily order it form big regional distributors).
For how little sand is needed for a DSB bucket... it may be worth it instead of settling for silica IMO.
I have very few worries about the composition of silica if you need to use it.
Get aragonite of you can... calcite is fine instead if you must for a calcareous source.
Seachem bags some very nice sands... calcite and aragonite of various colors. They are a big name that is not that hard to find in LFS shops across the states (or most LFS folks can easily order it form big regional distributors).
For how little sand is needed for a DSB bucket... it may be worth it instead of settling for silica IMO.
I'll give it all a try and keep everyone up to date on haw it works. The only way I will know is if GHA starts to slow down.
As for the sand I have. I got some Handyman's silica sand and it is all like smooth little balls. It's not sharp. The only problem I have run into with using silica is the buffering factor. Either way though, I help control that by leaving lights on over my sump, 24/7.
As for the sand I have. I got some Handyman's silica sand and it is all like smooth little balls. It's not sharp. The only problem I have run into with using silica is the buffering factor. Either way though, I help control that by leaving lights on over my sump, 24/7.
Large Polyp Dave
New member
i run a barebottom system. purely lps. nitrates close to 0 but not zero. less than 5.
just out of curiousity. i tried this DSB bucket thing
i used a tropic marine salt bucket
filled about 4/5 with bomix calcite playsand
tee'd off some of the flow from my drain lines probably... 150-200gph worth
checked nitrates after a month. still about the same level. above zero. but defintiely less than 5
then i put 5 of manilla clams (again just for fun) after i had scrubbed and quarantined them. tested after a 4 days nitrates at complete 0.
again out of curiosity, i took out the manilla clams. cracked them open and tried to feed them to my fish. only my pink tail trigger ate it. (he'll eat anything)
checked 1 weeks later. nitrates still at a full zero.
what does this tell us? i have no idea =)
but the bucket is still in there. and well. it an ugly addition to the sump.
i have a question anthony.. (if you're still even visiting this thread).. do you need sand stirrers in this dsb bucket? because i have none hehe. i put one bristle worm in there. but i think he ended up just flowing through it.
just out of curiousity. i tried this DSB bucket thing
i used a tropic marine salt bucket
filled about 4/5 with bomix calcite playsand
tee'd off some of the flow from my drain lines probably... 150-200gph worth
checked nitrates after a month. still about the same level. above zero. but defintiely less than 5
then i put 5 of manilla clams (again just for fun) after i had scrubbed and quarantined them. tested after a 4 days nitrates at complete 0.
again out of curiosity, i took out the manilla clams. cracked them open and tried to feed them to my fish. only my pink tail trigger ate it. (he'll eat anything)
checked 1 weeks later. nitrates still at a full zero.
what does this tell us? i have no idea =)
but the bucket is still in there. and well. it an ugly addition to the sump.
i have a question anthony.. (if you're still even visiting this thread).. do you need sand stirrers in this dsb bucket? because i have none hehe. i put one bristle worm in there. but i think he ended up just flowing through it.
Anthony Calfo
New member
no sand stirrers needed on the unlit remote DSB is there is enough water flow to keep solids in suspension over it 
RichConley
New member
RayinAZ said:
You probably wont get much result from that, but you could use a bucket that seals (Like an IO salt bucket with screw on top) and just run a maxijet or something in the tank pumping water down a hose into bucket in sump. Have a line in the bucket going back to the tank...essentially making the bucket part of a closed loop.
Issue with this is the bucket NEEDS to be sealed, because if it leaks, its going to drain your tank.
Essentially turn a 5g bucket into a DIY cannister.
I'm back ANTHONY or anyone. Here is a little different idea for the DSB bucket. What if I was to take my 75gal sump, section the middle 2 feet with glass. Holes drilled at the top. Here's the idea.
Water comes in at one end of sump. goes through the holes at the top of the first sleve, running over two feet of sand, then exiting the other side at the top. Pouring through the holes and filling the other end of the sump where my skimmer and return pump sit. The sand bed in the middle will be 2' x 18" x 18" deep and done with black PVC so no light gets to the sand. What do you think?????
I think it would work because of the size of the sump, it's all contained into one unit (drain, return, skimmer, cheato) and doesn't create an eyesore. I could sketch up a drawing of what it would look like, but I have no idea on how to do that on here.
Water comes in at one end of sump. goes through the holes at the top of the first sleve, running over two feet of sand, then exiting the other side at the top. Pouring through the holes and filling the other end of the sump where my skimmer and return pump sit. The sand bed in the middle will be 2' x 18" x 18" deep and done with black PVC so no light gets to the sand. What do you think?????
I think it would work because of the size of the sump, it's all contained into one unit (drain, return, skimmer, cheato) and doesn't create an eyesore. I could sketch up a drawing of what it would look like, but I have no idea on how to do that on here.
quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by RayinAZ
ChinChek mentioned this a few posts above, but no one commented. Could I use my old Fluval 403 to create a "mini" bucket DSB? (I know it would be smaller volume-wise than a 5 gallon) I have a 100gallon glass tank with no sump or plumbing. I don't have room in back to hang an overflow box, so I'm looking for options.
If I filled the canister with sand so it was 3-4 inches below the top and maybe added some foam up at the top (maybe one of the foam insets that came with?), as Anthony mentioned in a different context, to diffuse the water, would it work?
Any thoughts would be appreciated!
Ray
PS CC, the nano's working great as Quarantine tank.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
You might as well go to your local swimming pool store and buy you a medium sized sand filter. They are completely sealed, hold a lot of sand, no light, NO WORRIES!
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by RayinAZ
ChinChek mentioned this a few posts above, but no one commented. Could I use my old Fluval 403 to create a "mini" bucket DSB? (I know it would be smaller volume-wise than a 5 gallon) I have a 100gallon glass tank with no sump or plumbing. I don't have room in back to hang an overflow box, so I'm looking for options.
If I filled the canister with sand so it was 3-4 inches below the top and maybe added some foam up at the top (maybe one of the foam insets that came with?), as Anthony mentioned in a different context, to diffuse the water, would it work?
Any thoughts would be appreciated!
Ray
PS CC, the nano's working great as Quarantine tank.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
You might as well go to your local swimming pool store and buy you a medium sized sand filter. They are completely sealed, hold a lot of sand, no light, NO WORRIES!
Thales
Active member
Savatage said:
I do something similar, but I run my sand at the end of the filtration chain, not the beginning. The way you are suggesting might allow detritus to settle onto/into the sand - skimming/'fuging the water before the sand should cut down on the amount of detritus that could get into the bed.
I think I will have to work on my plans a little more and see what I come with for the extremely deep sand. I still have to work on getting some sand though. I have no idea what the silica would turn out to be like. Anthony said that it would probably work just fine, but he had some concerns of the jagged edges of the silica. I need to find some type of aragonite sand. NOT old castle either. I don't want to turn it into a calcium rock in time.
Anthony Calfo
New member
aragonite only fuses when you allow your pH to drop low and usually rapidly as with misdosing calcium supplements (too much kalk too fast, for example) or having unstable pH (dropping very low at night).
It's easy with good water quality/stability to avoid having aragonite fuse.
I'm so very strict about maintaining a strong and stable pH (8.3-8.6... never lower than 8.3 at night)... I have yet to have aragonite fuse. I recommend high and stable pH for more than a few good reasons aside form this issue.
FWIW
It's easy with good water quality/stability to avoid having aragonite fuse.
I'm so very strict about maintaining a strong and stable pH (8.3-8.6... never lower than 8.3 at night)... I have yet to have aragonite fuse. I recommend high and stable pH for more than a few good reasons aside form this issue.
FWIW
Bill Shultz
New member
Anthony,
First off, thanks for such a valuable post for all of us who have been fighting Nitrates for years.
I've recently set up a DSB in a 5 gallon bucket plummed into my sump. I was wondering: what is your opinion about the depth and consistency of the media which is in the DSB?
In my bucket, I've placed about 5" of sand (sugar grain size), then I have 2" of Carib Sea Aragonite reef sand above that, and then my final 1/5" is a combination of Kent Marine's Nitrate Sponge and Seachem's DeNitrate (about 4 lbs between the two).
I used this stratification in order to have the heavier rocks on top so to "protect" the sand underneath from being blown around. On top of my 8.5" of media, I have about 3.75" of water circulating at about 260 GPH.
To get back to my question. . .
Do you think I will need a deeper amount of the fine sand? I have noticed that most people do not seem to use a mix of media when they are creating these DSB buckets.
Thanks.
--Bill
First off, thanks for such a valuable post for all of us who have been fighting Nitrates for years.
I've recently set up a DSB in a 5 gallon bucket plummed into my sump. I was wondering: what is your opinion about the depth and consistency of the media which is in the DSB?
In my bucket, I've placed about 5" of sand (sugar grain size), then I have 2" of Carib Sea Aragonite reef sand above that, and then my final 1/5" is a combination of Kent Marine's Nitrate Sponge and Seachem's DeNitrate (about 4 lbs between the two).
I used this stratification in order to have the heavier rocks on top so to "protect" the sand underneath from being blown around. On top of my 8.5" of media, I have about 3.75" of water circulating at about 260 GPH.
To get back to my question. . .
Do you think I will need a deeper amount of the fine sand? I have noticed that most people do not seem to use a mix of media when they are creating these DSB buckets.
Thanks.
--Bill
Bill Shultz
New member
I thought I'd include the recent pics to show everyone my setup which I described in the above post. You will notice that I used my Fluval MSF 304 Canister Filter to power the DSB bucket. The Fluval draws water from the sump return area after it has been mechanically filtered and skimmed. The Fluval pumpt into the 5 gallon bucket above and then a 3/4" bulkhead gravity drains the water back into my sump.
http://reefcentral.com/gallery/data/586/56016RC-DSB-3.jpg
http://reefcentral.com/gallery/data/586/56016RC-DSB-3.jpg
Bill Shultz
New member
This last pic didn't show up above so I'll just repost it here. Sorry if anyone's bothered by scrolling past the big images, but I'm a fan of making the pics as clear as possible for your viewing pleasure. I'll keep you guys posted with my progress. On Day 1 my nitrates are 50 ppm. I'm hoping to check weekly.
--Bill
--Bill
- Status
