Early Preparation for my first Reef Tank

[JimKelly12203]

Hello,

thought i'd just introduce myself as it seems to be something that most do around here. I started this account a while ago (i guess i'll find out when i hit the "submit thread" button.

My dream has always been to build a reef aquarium, but my modest home and propensity for creating children (#4 on the way in June) along with an early mid-life crisis that sent me to law school after 10 years in pharmaceutical manufacturing just didn't make it possible. HAHA.

Anyway, with a new baby and career comes the need for a new (and bigger) home. One that can finally hold the type of aquarium i've always longed for.

I'm pretty much set on a 120 (4' x 2' x 2') reef ready aquarium. Still trying to figure out where i can get the best value and quality on that end. I'm reluctant to have the thing shipped from Michigan to Upstate NY. If anyone in the Albany area can recommend a good place to purchase the above tank, i'm all ears...

I'm going to build the stand and sump myself. If i can find a way to get a 75 or 90 gallon under the display tank, that's the plan. I want to have sufficient width (18" good, 24" better) in the sump for a large fuge, adequate to above adequate skimmer and return pump. I'll probably want to add a calcium reactor. My knowledge is all theory and no practice, but i've been specing this darn thing out in my head for nearly a decade so i'm gonna delve right into the easier stony corals.

I'm going to take this REALLY slow. I figure i'll scape the thing with dead rock and add to it about 40 lbs of Dr. Foster and Smith's Fiji live-rock. Then i'll let the pods and coraline really develope with a clean-up crew added at the right time for darn near 6 months before i add anything of value.

This site has been (and continues to be) an amazing source of great info.

At this point i'm trying to figure out what equipment i'll need.

This project won't start until the Fall, and i won't be adding anything of value (as mentioned earlier) until the summer months of next year. This will give me some time to note the temperature situation and whether or not i'll need a chiller to keep under 80 degrees. Also i should have a lot of coraline and a healthy pod population by then.

Given a 120 gallon system with a 75 - 90 gallon sump, does anyone think an AquaMaxx ConeS CO2 would be insufficient?

As to water movement, i'm looking at the Jebao RW-8 (two of them) for the display and something cheaper for the fuge.

Lighting is a complete enigma to me at this point. Cost is a factor and i would LOVE to use only T-5 fluorescents. I'm not interested in expensive MH lighting that heats the crap out of the tank. Any advice there would be great, but - again - i'll be doing a lot more research on this in the coming months.

Finally, is my live rock / dead rock plan above viable? That is to say, can i truly seed 60+ lbs of dead rock with 40 lbs of the Foster & Smith Fiji rock in 6 months time?

Anyway, i'll be around. And eventually asking lots of questions. Hopefully good ones.

 

[rustyjames]

Hello,

My dream has always been to build a reef aquarium, but my modest home and propensity for creating children

This made me chuckle

I'm pretty much set on a 120 (4' x 2' x 2') reef ready aquarium.

The 120 is a great sized tank but "reef ready" designs leave much to be desired.

If i can find a way to get a 75 or 90 gallon under the display tank, that's the plan.

With a sump that big make sure you leave room for an ATO and reactors if you want it all enclosed in the stand.

This site has been (and continues to be) an amazing source of great info.

It has for me as well.

Finally, is my live rock / dead rock plan above viable? That is to say, can i truly seed 60+ lbs of dead rock with 40 lbs of the Foster & Smith Fiji rock in 6 months time?

Yes, you can seed lots of dead rock with just a little live rock as long as you maintain good water quality.

Anyway, i'll be around. And eventually asking lots of questions. Hopefully good ones.

Good luck and looking forward to see what you do.

 

[JimKelly12203]

Good luck and looking forward to see what you do.

haha thanks rusty. I'm looking forward to it as well. It is going to be a LOoooooooong process. I'm not rushing into this. Waited over a decade to finally be in a position to do it. I'm doing it right!

As to the "dead rock" would you recommend purchasing or making it yourself visa vis the many concrete, crushed coral, sand & salt recipes i've seen on-line. I'd be more than happy to make my own and wait a VERY long time for it to be ready to use.

But i don't want to put bricks in there. I understand the need for porous rock. I'm trying to weigh my ability/inability to make sufficiently porous rock with my desire to create my own shapes.

 

[rustyjames]

I tried making my own rock and was never happy with it. Heavy, dense and the curing time was really long. Some people are good at it, just not me. Marco rock is what I have in my tank and have been happy with it.

BTW, I think the Bills are looking at the playoff's next year!

 

[shaggss]

I'm pretty much set on a 120 (4' x 2' x 2') reef ready aquarium. Still trying to figure out where i can get the best value and quality on that end. I'm reluctant to have the thing shipped from Michigan to Upstate NY. If anyone in the Albany area can recommend a good place to purchase the above tank, i'm all ears...

As above a 120 is a great size tank but get it custom made for a bean animal overflow. This is the most fool proof way to ensure a flood free house. There are some ebay sellers who make the overflow which you attach to the tank through bulkheads. Again do your research.

I'm going to build the stand and sump myself. If i can find a way to get a 75 or 90 gallon under the display tank, that's the plan.

Do a search on here for Rocket Engineers thread on DIY stands. Good thread!


I want to have sufficient width (18" good, 24" better) in the sump for a large fuge, adequate to above adequate skimmer and return pump.

A good direction of flow for your sump with a fuge is:

DRAIN to SKIMMER SECTION to RETURN PUMP. have the FUGE on the other side of the return pump and tee off your return to feed the fuge. This way you can independently control the flow through the fuge.

I'll probably want to add a calcium reactor. My knowledge is all theory and no practice, but i've been specing this darn thing out in my head for nearly a decade so i'm gonna delve right into the easier stony corals.

Not sure about Ca reactors but a good start for a low demanding tank is dosing pumps to add Alk and Ca. You can also use them for other things such as ATO and Cabon dosing.



I'm going to take this REALLY slow. I figure i'll scape the thing with dead rock and add to it about 40 lbs of Dr. Foster and Smith's Fiji live-rock. Then i'll let the pods and coraline really develope with a clean-up crew added at the right time for darn near 6 months before i add anything of value.

This site has been (and continues to be) an amazing source of great info.

At this point i'm trying to figure out what equipment i'll need.

This project won't start until the Fall, and i won't be adding anything of value (as mentioned earlier) until the summer months of next year. This will give me some time to note the temperature situation and whether or not i'll need a chiller to keep under 80 degrees. Also i should have a lot of coraline and a healthy pod population by then.

Given a 120 gallon system with a 75 - 90 gallon sump, does anyone think an AquaMaxx ConeS CO2 would be insufficient?

As to water movement, i'm looking at the Jebao RW-8 (two of them) for the display and something cheaper for the fuge.


Those pumps seem like great value for money. Be aware though there are more reliable pumps like Tunze and Vortech.

Lighting is a complete enigma to me at this point. Cost is a factor and i would LOVE to use only T-5 fluorescents. I'm not interested in expensive MH lighting that heats the crap out of the tank. Any advice there would be great, but - again - i'll be doing a lot more research on this in the coming months.

It is well accepted that MH light are about the easiest and best for corals. That said T5s are too! Lots of great T5 fixtures out there and they are more than capable of supplying suffice light. Loads of TOTM use only T5 lights.



Finally, is my live rock / dead rock plan above viable? That is to say, can i truly seed 60+ lbs of dead rock with 40 lbs of the Foster & Smith Fiji rock in 6 months time?

This is a good plan and will work quite well. Be aware though that dead rock can be bound up with PO4. Lots of info on here about cooking rock BEFORE adding it to your DT. I highly recommend this.

Anyway, i'll be around. And eventually asking lots of questions. Hopefully good ones.

 

[rustyjames]

Great advice shaggss. 2x 250 watt mh would be stunning over a 120.

Jim, I commend you for doing your due diligence. Any ideas on stocking, fish or coral?

 

[JimKelly12203]

Thanks for the input Shaggss. I'll be sure to look into the PO4 issues with dead rock. To be honest, when i started speccing this project out 8+ years ago, the use of dead-rock never even occurred to me. Needless to say there will be much research.

I also always planned on using halides, but i'm weary of the power consumption, bulb replacement costs and heat issues. If T-5s can work, i'll try to make it so.

The sump is actually (strangely) one of the most exciting sub-parts to the whole project for me. I just love the thought of a refugium for macro-algae and some interestging critters that would not be good citizens in the main display. I've read a lot about this, but there is much more reading and planning to be done. Flow paths are a DEFINITE consideration still up in the air.

As to my precious Bills Rusty, yeah... i mean this is easily the most talented team we've fielded since the glory days. We're just flat out stacked.

Now about that quarterback thing...

Regarding skimmers, (and i know there are myriad threads addressing them). Any thoughts on the AquaMaxx ConeS Co2? It just blows my mind that i'll be spending many hundreds of dollars on a freaking plastic tube with a bubble generator and a pump... Ridiculous. But also niche, so i get it... But i don't want to buy a crap skimmer any more than i want to spend $500 bucks on a good one. This particular unit seems to be relatively well regarded for the tank size i'm looking at. And i can get it for like $320 bucks on-line.

Of all the things you have to buy to make this hobby work, i'm not sure which potentially disastrous purchase freaks me out more. The skimmer or the lights...

 

[shaggss]

If you make your own cement rock, I now believe they recommend to do it without the salt.

Not sure on your budget but other things to consider are:

1. Controller

2. ATO

3. Chiller

4. Heaters (Ehiem get the best reviews). Always good to have two heaters which are slightly undersized for your tank and controlled through a controller. Don't rely on the heaters internal controller. A $20 heater stuck on can destroy thousands of dollars worth of corals and fish. That's why a controller is a nicety. With the undersized heaters, even if the controller fails, then it won't cook your tank.

5. Skimmer

HTH!!

 

[shaggss]

Thanks for the input Shaggss. I'll be sure to look into the PO4 issues with dead rock. To be honest, when i started speccing this project out 8+ years ago, the use of dead-rock never even occurred to me. Needless to say there will be much research.

I also always planned on using halides, but i'm weary of the power consumption, bulb replacement costs and heat issues. If T-5s can work, i'll try to make it so.

The sump is actually (strangely) one of the most exciting sub-parts to the whole project for me. I just love the thought of a refugium for macro-algae and some interestging critters that would not be good citizens in the main display. I've read a lot about this, but there is much more reading and planning to be done. Flow paths are a DEFINITE consideration still up in the air.

As to my precious Bills Rusty, yeah... i mean this is easily the most talented team we've fielded since the glory days. We're just flat out stacked.

Now about that quarterback thing...

Regarding skimmers, (and i know there are myriad threads addressing them). Any thoughts on the AquaMaxx ConeS Co2? It just blows my mind that i'll be spending many hundreds of dollars on a freaking plastic tube with a bubble generator and a pump... Ridiculous. But also niche, so i get it... But i don't want to buy a crap skimmer any more than i want to spend $500 bucks on a good one. This particular unit seems to be relatively well regarded for the tank size i'm looking at. And i can get it for like $320 bucks on-line.

Of all the things you have to buy to make this hobby work, i'm not sure which potentially disastrous purchase freaks me out more. The skimmer or the lights...

T5 lights will be fine. You won't get the nice shimmer effect that MH give you but if you are worried about heat then T 5 s are your best bet.

And yes you can research skimmers until you die. They are all basically the same if minor differences:

Either internal or external pumps. Internal take up lest room in the sump but sacrifice some performance due to limited height. External pumps allow for easier cleaning but take up more sump space. One thing though, get one with a reliable pump. This is my main consideration.

Venturi or pinwheel? Venturi supposedly don't harm the benifical oganisisms that are in the water column and generally speaking (from what I have read) allow a better skimming performance and are easier to clean.

I recommend a neck cleaner if you have room in your budget. This is cut down on your maintenance time.

 

[JimKelly12203]

Jim, I commend you for doing your due diligence. Any ideas on stocking, fish or coral?

This is the big question... And i'm still playing around with it. I'd love a hippo, but i'm not doing it as they seem to require a couple feet of additional swimming length (my wife can only take so much).

I've been advised that a kole tang is a good choice and it seems to check out. They grow a solid 6" smaller than the hippo, but it seems like they may be a bit aggressive... In any event, i'm all ears on an interesting, personable (that's non-negotiable) center-piece fish. I figure it would be a tang, or maybe a non-coral consuming angel of some sort...

Two false perculas is non-negotiable. They will be a part of the mix.

I'd also like a small group of blue/green crhomis but i have heard some rumblings that they inevitably dwindle down to just one.

Cardinals are interesting too. I'd love a few of each if that's viable.

I would also likely add a wrasse of some sort or a dragonnette. But i realize this will require great patience with getting my pod population to an insane level (hence i refuse to do much with this tank until the live-rock has been allowed to grow for nearly 6 months.

A shrimp or two would be great (cleaners if they'll actually clean whatever main display fish i settle on). If not, something else.

as to corals, i'm really early in the process of figuring this out. I like the stony corals, but am unwilling to commit to the kind of lighting that would be required to put the really needy varieties in the tank. I'll find species that can live with a solid t-5 system. I'm going to need to place the light lovers high, and the less demanding types low. These decisions will have to go hand-in-hand with my aquascape plan.

It's gonna be a lot of fun but much more work to do. It's just too darn expensive to mess up. Besides, i don't want anything to die. Just seems wrong.

 

[mmittlesteadt]

I too have been extremely patient. I've been thinking about this and researching reefkeeping for over a year now and have had my tank for over three months and have yet to even put water in it as I educate myself on every facet of this hobby, from equipment to water chemistry, to the livestock...well, everything.

I think it's great and want to give you credit for exercising patience while you learn and gain a better understanding before jumping right in with livestock. I wish you all the best!

P.S. - Totally relate to the career change and the 4 kids.

 

[JimKelly12203]

I too have been extremely patient. I've been thinking about this and researching reefkeeping for over a year now and have had my tank for over three months and have yet to even put water in it as I educate myself on every facet of this hobby, from equipment to water chemistry, to the livestock...well, everything.

I think it's great and want to give you credit for exercising patience while you learn and gain a better understanding before jumping right in with livestock. I wish you all the best!

P.S. - Totally relate to the career change and the 4 kids.

Awesome. Yeah you gotta do it right... That or you're just too impatient to be even doing this OR (worse yet) you just have so much disposable income that a catastrophe doesn't even phase you.

The way i see it, when this thing is built, to the creatures in that tank, i am god. And i must be a benevolent one or they will all perish. LOL!

 

[mmittlesteadt]

Awesome. Yeah you gotta do it right... That or you're just too impatient to be even doing this OR (worse yet) you just have so much disposable income that a catastrophe doesn't even phase you.

The way i see it, when this thing is built, to the creatures in that tank, i am god. And i must be a benevolent one or they will all perish. LOL!

Yes, I feel all life is important. Far too many feel some creatures are disposable, but then where does one draw the line? Being a benevolent god to these creatures is really a perfect, if not poetic way of viewing it.

My wife of course feels I spend far too much time reading up on the subject...well, and building stands, and sumps, and plumbing, and aquascaping and...LOL.