Extra CAlcium to use with 2 part???

[jerpa]

You haven't mentioned your magnesium level. If that is off it can make it difficult to keep calcium and alkalinity stable. Also is there a reason you are dosing so much more calcium than alk? The two part from BRS is balanced so adding the same amount of each keeps your alk/cal balanced relative to consumption. I would look into limewater as well. You will still have to dose but less dosing should make your salinity rise more gradual.

Nevermind the mag part just reread your last post.

 

[spawn2]

You haven't mentioned your magnesium level. If that is off it can make it difficult to keep calcium and alkalinity stable. Also is there a reason you are dosing so much more calcium than alk? The two part from BRS is balanced so adding the same amount of each keeps your alk/cal balanced relative to consumption. I would look into limewater as well. You will still have to dose but less dosing should make your salinity rise more gradual.

R U serious in regards to the MG level?? Re read about three reply up from this.
Yes the reason is because the Ca is low. I understood the balanced additions & raised the Ca because balanced additions fail to maintain Ca EVER.
& yes that is what I was hoping to do without to much effect or screwing around with anything in regards to keeping my PH stable as is currently @ 8.2-8.4 which may be a little high but is always constant. Thx.

 

[JMLewis]

I typically dosed 110ml of 2 part. I started running 1.5 gallons a day of limewater since I evaporate over 2 gallons a day I let my ato take care of the rest and since I've started doing that I've been able to lower my 2 part to around 30 ml a day.

I don't think anyone's gonna have a magic solution to your issues besides a CA reactor which you stated wont work for your situation. I would start dosing limewater if I were you and compensate what limewater cant do with the 2 part.

The only reason I dose specific quantities of limewater is to keep things stable since my evaporation rates varie through the year.

 

[JMLewis]

Double post

 

[jerpa]

Calcium and alkalinity are used in a known proportion though. The only reason i know of to dose differing amounts is if your offsetting a salt that is very high in alk and low in calcium or vice versa. You stated that you also added 8oz manually that's why I was wondering about the dosing. If your corals absorbed that much calcium then they must have used a known amount of alkalinity as well. It sounds like your system may be unbalanced as opposed to actually consuming a huge amount of calcium without needing an equally large amount of alkalinity. You could switch to recipe 2 to offset the rise in PH from the limewater.

 

[cthedaytrader]

I have a similar problem but not quite as extreme as you seem to have and my salinity has never been effected in any major way that a 5g water change every week or two hasnt managed.

My tank is 75G with a about 15g in water in the sump, with rock displacement I guess I have about 85G total water give or take.

I have a heavy packed SPS tank and dose about 160ml of each part a day. I try and keep my cal above 420 and my alk betwen 8.5 and 9.5.

I have had times when my cal didnt seem to keep up up with the alk, but not to the extreme you have, since the BRS 2 part should be balanced and it should be dialed in to maintain your demands.

What do you keep your alk at? From my understanding they should be balanced? Are you keeping your alk low or high becuase that in my expereince directly affects how much two part you are using and what your total ca will be?

Second are you manually dosing or are the pumps dosing? Are you sure the pumps are calibrated correctly and they are dosing the amounts you think.

Are you trying to adjust the two part mixtures such as adding extra to the calcium mix which in my expereince can throw off the balance.

Also, you should only use two part to maintain your levels not to raise them to the desired amount.

When my calcium is low I find it much easier(instead of using a ton of the CA portion of two part), I used Turbo calcium to raise my calcium to the desired level and adjust my pumps to what my tank is using. When I need to do that I check my usuage after 24 hours, and will usually do that for a couple of days. If it is dialed in then my alk and ca shouldnt drop off. Sometimes I have found I need to dose a little more Ca than ALk part to maintain a higher ca, but never as drastic as you seem to have, and I usally equate it to a mixing error or a slight diference in my dosing pumps.

 

[cthedaytrader]

I have a similar problem but not quite as extreme as you seem to have and my salinity has never been effected in any major way that a 5g water change every week or two hasnt managed.

My tank is 75G with a about 15g in water in the sump, with rock displacement I guess I have about 85G total water give or take.

I have a heavy packed SPS tank and dose about 160ml of each part a day. I try and keep my cal above 420 and my alk betwen 8.5 and 9.5.

I have had times when my cal didnt seem to keep up up with the alk, but not to the extreme you have, since the BRS 2 part should be balanced and it should be dialed in to maintain your demands.

What do you keep your alk at? From my understanding they should be balanced? Are you keeping your alk low or high becuase that in my expereince directly affects how much two part you are using and what your total ca will be?

Second are you manually dosing or are the pumps dosing? Are you sure the pumps are calibrated correctly and they are dosing the amounts you think.

Are you trying to adjust the two part mixtures such as adding extra to the calcium mix which in my expereince can throw off the balance.

Also, you should only use two part to maintain your levels not to raise them to the desired amount.

When my calcium is low I find it much easier(instead of using a ton of the CA portion of two part), I used Turbo calcium to raise my calcium to the desired level and adjust my pumps to what my tank is using. When I need to do that I check my usuage after 24 hours, and will usually do that for a couple of days. If it is dialed in then my alk and ca shouldnt drop off. Sometimes I have found I need to dose a little more Ca than ALk part to maintain a higher ca, but never as drastic as you seem to have, and I usally equate it to a mixing error or a slight diference in my dosing pumps.

 

[spawn2]

The pumps are dosing & were calibrated about 2 months ago & will redo again this WE. Alk is currently @ 10.4 on a hanna. The mix is mixed as labelled.
I had posted about using Kents turbo calcium on another forum & had intended to pick up this WE. Previously yes had been trying to correct using part A
I should add that the alk is rock steady.

 

[nanojg]

jerpa and cthedaytrader, what makes you think that the system should be in some sort of "balance" between alk and calc? While it is correct that calc and carb are used in a certain proportion the aquarium water does not have to have a certain "balance", as long as both are in the correct range and farily steady (more important for alk)

Also 2 part SHOULD be used for daily dosing AND ALSO for one time fixes, not sure why you state that they should not be used to raise levels to desired amounts? What do you think is in Turbo calcium? Why would that be different than the 2 part calcium?

 

[spawn2]

Calcium and alkalinity are used in a known proportion though. The only reason i know of to dose differing amounts is if your offsetting a salt that is very high in alk and low in calcium or vice versa. You stated that you also added 8oz manually that's why I was wondering about the dosing. If your corals absorbed that much calcium then they must have used a known amount of alkalinity as well. It sounds like your system may be unbalanced as opposed to actually consuming a huge amount of calcium without needing an equally large amount of alkalinity. You could switch to recipe 2 to offset the rise in PH from the limewater.

I dont think the corals used the extra Ca. I agree that something is likely out of balance, & have read the article about that on the reef alchemist. Tried to correct over the last 8 months to no avail. I'm using RBS for salt & when checked it tested out @
440 Ca
9.5 Alk
1350 Mg
I just did those tests with a brand new box, as I was using it to do a 30% WC. This issue has been the bain of my reef's existence for the last 8 months.

 

[spawn2]

jerpa and cthedaytrader, what makes you think that the system should be in some sort of "balance" between alk and calc? While it is correct that calc and carb are used in a certain proportion the aquarium water does not have to have a certain "balance", as long as both are in the correct range and farily steady (more important for alk)

Also 2 part SHOULD be used for daily dosing AND ALSO for one time fixes, not sure why you state that they should not be used to raise levels to desired amounts? What do you think is in Turbo calcium? Why would that be different than the 2 part calcium?

I have also heard of & read of lots of others who do not use 2 part in a balanced addition, with no issue's.

 

[jerpa]

My only point was if he consistently adds large amounts of calcium and sees little to no change something isn't right. I never implied a certain number but a balanced system should react predictably to increases in dosing. If all that calcium was being used by his corals he should notice his alk dropping unless he increases that as well. I may be confused but that is how I understand it. I agree 2 part is for one time corrections and dosing as well.

 

[nanojg]

I have also heard of & read of lots of others who do not use 2 part in a balanced addition, with no issue's.

I do not add equal amounts myself, I have to add about 1/3 more alk part than calcium part because I use a high calcium salt mix.

 

[jerpa]

I'm not sure what is going on but you might try adding limewater and stop dosing the 2 part for a few days and monitor your alk. Dose according to your alk drop with both parts and see if the calcium drops to a certain level and stays there. If your seeing problems in your corals with calcium at 360 this won't work but it might be worth a shot. I'm thinking if it's been doing this for 8 months a reset to your dosing regimen may be in order anyway.

 

[Habib]

If I understand it correctly, the calcium additions are a several fold of alkalinity additions.
That would imply that something is not OK.

I would do a calcium measurement on the tankwater before adding the usual large calcium addition then remeasure calcium again after say 10 minutes after the calcium addition.

The measured value should agree reasonably well with the addition. A large discrepancy might imply a problem with testing or with the actual concentration of the supplement.

No discrepancy would rule those out.

 

[spawn2]

If I understand it correctly, the calcium additions are a several fold of alkalinity additions.
That would imply that something is not OK.

I would do a calcium measurement on the tankwater before adding the usual large calcium addition then remeasure calcium again after say 10 minutes after the calcium addition.

The measured value should agree reasonably well with the addition. A large discrepancy might imply a problem with testing or with the actual concentration of the supplement.

No discrepancy would rule those out.

1)The Ca supp is only being added @ about 28.5% as of last night more than the Alk.
2) I will try this step

 

[spawn2]

I'm not sure what is going on but you might try adding limewater and stop dosing the 2 part for a few days and monitor your alk. Dose according to your alk drop with both parts and see if the calcium drops to a certain level and stays there. If your seeing problems in your corals with calcium at 360 this won't work but it might be worth a shot. I'm thinking if it's been doing this for 8 months a reset to your dosing regimen may be in order anyway.

I have turned the doser off let run for a day & tested just before xmas, this was how I arrived at these rates. It went well for awhile Alk has been rock solid pretty much the whole time before & after, but then the Ca fell off about 1 month ago & here i go again. I know that corals can go through growth spurts where their consumption can vary... but this is crazy.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Water changes with a low calcium mix (or a high calcium mix) are the usual ways that nonequal dosing of a two part may become necessary.

An incorrect recipe is another.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Randy if this was your setup, how would you deal with this. Is adding kalk to the topoff a viable solution? Or would you maintain the use of 2 part at a higher daily dose rate & compensate by increasing the amount of water being re/re?

Limewater won't make much of a dent in what a tank like yours needs. I'd do it for pH purposes if the pH runs low, but otherwise I'd use a two part or a CaCO3/CO2 reactor (or both).

 

[spawn2]

Limewater won't make much of a dent in what a tank like yours needs. I'd do it for pH purposes if the pH runs low, but otherwise I'd use a two part or a CaCO3/CO2 reactor (or both).

Thx. I will continue over the next 24hrs to raise the ca to 420 & I will recalibrate the doser again sat morning. After I get it to 420 I will turn the doser off for 24 hrs, check consumption & then resume dosing to meet that need. Following that I will re/re tank water @ the suggested rate. should note the top-off res. is 5 gal, & takes 4-5 days to use. This will hopefully result in steady Ca value & maintain sal, but hasn't to date.