Fighting back against Vibrio
- Thread starter whatnot45
- Start date
Samala
New member
You may be able to find it at a well stocked LFS as well, I've seen it on the shelves at one of the larger ones near me. Erm, wait, that was seachem's NeoPlex, which does not appear to have the triple sulfa addition you need. (It says neomycin sulfate...) But, I would be picky, and get exactly what's been suggested -- Neo3. 
On the temperature, if you can keep it down with frozen water bottles and/or fans (but watch your salinity) that should be fine if you're in a relatively mild climate that happens to have heat waves from time to time. Best to invest in a chiller if its hotter for longer stretches.
So, grab the meds and keep up with temperature control, and keep us posted.
Torry -- thank you for reminding me that everyone benefits from posts, not just the thread's originator.
>Sarah
On the temperature, if you can keep it down with frozen water bottles and/or fans (but watch your salinity) that should be fine if you're in a relatively mild climate that happens to have heat waves from time to time. Best to invest in a chiller if its hotter for longer stretches.
So, grab the meds and keep up with temperature control, and keep us posted.
Torry -- thank you for reminding me that everyone benefits from posts, not just the thread's originator.
>Sarah
pledosophy
Active member
No Neo3 will not cure your seahorses from becoming carriers of vibrio. If you treat them with the Neo3 when they are not having an outbreak you will most likely make the strain that they are carrying resistant tot he antibiotic so it is useless when you really need it.
Neo3 is a cure for an outbreak, a seahorse that is just a carrier of the bacteria is not sick. Many organisims carry different bacteria's in there bodies to aid them with different things. The human stomach is full of bacteria. If you remove all of the bacteria you would be dead, the same is true with your seahorse.
It is not the goal to cure the seahorses from vibrio. The goal is to set the tank up in a manor where they can live and thrive happily. IME if a tank is setup ideally for horses it is more unlikely that they will experience disease.
I am of the opinion that vibrio outbreaks are secondary infections.
IME you will be more likely to convince your momma to let you spend the $12 bucks on a fan then convincing her to let you spend the $400 on a chiller. A Clip on fan is going to be your best friend right now. I know it sounds odd, but it is amazing and it works.
Neo3 is a cure for an outbreak, a seahorse that is just a carrier of the bacteria is not sick. Many organisims carry different bacteria's in there bodies to aid them with different things. The human stomach is full of bacteria. If you remove all of the bacteria you would be dead, the same is true with your seahorse.
It is not the goal to cure the seahorses from vibrio. The goal is to set the tank up in a manor where they can live and thrive happily. IME if a tank is setup ideally for horses it is more unlikely that they will experience disease.
I am of the opinion that vibrio outbreaks are secondary infections.
IME you will be more likely to convince your momma to let you spend the $12 bucks on a fan then convincing her to let you spend the $400 on a chiller. A Clip on fan is going to be your best friend right now. I know it sounds odd, but it is amazing and it works.
greenighs
New member
Samala
New member
So Pledo.. does it seem from What's descriptions that the SH are currently experiencing an outbreak and should be treated? There are two variables here that could lead to an outbreak: the high temperature indicated and the exposure of the two new females to the survivor (and likely carrier) from the last group. I was under the impression that bringing down the temperature alone will not be effective in controlling the early symptoms of the disease and they should be treated.
I agree that the goal is to get all three of these horses living and thriving well and to manage their known infection without trying to irradicate it.
Which brings me to a question for you Pledo -- what species of Vibrio are typically responsible for SH infection and death? I realize there are quite a few species, and strains within species, but I'm curious to know if this has been worked out in the literature and if you've come across it already.
[Clare dahling, when you've only been at this a few months, you have patience for everything.]
>Sarah
I agree that the goal is to get all three of these horses living and thriving well and to manage their known infection without trying to irradicate it.
Which brings me to a question for you Pledo -- what species of Vibrio are typically responsible for SH infection and death? I realize there are quite a few species, and strains within species, but I'm curious to know if this has been worked out in the literature and if you've come across it already.
[Clare dahling, when you've only been at this a few months, you have patience for everything.
]>Sarah
pledosophy
Active member
As far as I know the Shedd study that was put out by Jeff Mitchell from Shedd's only dealt with the syngnathids that were in there care. It is my understanding from others (I have never made it out there), that the systems shared water with each other so it is quite possible there seahorse infected each other.
In the speech from 03, Mitchell stated that every seahorse they have necropsied has tested positive for vibrio, and that they had had the least luck with one particular strain (escapes me ATM) which proved itself to be much more virtulent
Sarah, the strains of vibrio I know of that have been cultured from seahorses are:
V. alginolyticus
V. fluvialis
V. parahaemolyticus
V. vulnificus
V. hollisae
V. damsela
V. cholera
as well as some other strains that could not be confirmed due to poor growth of the cultures.
Classic symptoms of vibrio are things sloughing off the outside of the seahorse. Any type of rot, "skin" flaking etc. Mitchell put the most common symptom as death, but that's not really helpful for treatment. Unless I have missed something Whatot's horses do not seem to currently be experiencing an outbreak.
Hopefully since all of the seahorses came out of the same breeding facility then they have all been exposed to the sae strain of the pathogens and not cause an outbreak amongst themselves as long as the rest of there husbandry needs are met.
In the speech from 03, Mitchell stated that every seahorse they have necropsied has tested positive for vibrio, and that they had had the least luck with one particular strain (escapes me ATM) which proved itself to be much more virtulent
Sarah, the strains of vibrio I know of that have been cultured from seahorses are:
V. alginolyticus
V. fluvialis
V. parahaemolyticus
V. vulnificus
V. hollisae
V. damsela
V. cholera
as well as some other strains that could not be confirmed due to poor growth of the cultures.
Classic symptoms of vibrio are things sloughing off the outside of the seahorse. Any type of rot, "skin" flaking etc. Mitchell put the most common symptom as death, but that's not really helpful for treatment. Unless I have missed something Whatot's horses do not seem to currently be experiencing an outbreak.
Hopefully since all of the seahorses came out of the same breeding facility then they have all been exposed to the sae strain of the pathogens and not cause an outbreak amongst themselves as long as the rest of there husbandry needs are met.
ok so at this point, just keep the water quality in check, and temperature down, and that should do it? The temp. is now down to about 70 it comes up to about 73 during the heat of the day, but thats about it. The white splotches have dissapeared and the skin is normal color again...
greenighs
New member
Whatever you do, IF you decide to treat the horses with an antibiotic, please, FINISH THE ENTIRE TREATMENT as directed: correct amount per dose, correct schedule of water changes, correct number of doses per day, correct number of days. If you give them a partial treatment, you will be killing off the weakest bacterial organisms and allowing the tougher, more resistant ones to reproduce, thus insuring that any other animals you introduce to your system will be subject to a stronger, more treatment-resistant strain of bacteria.
pledosophy
Active member
Exactly what Clare just said.
Personally I wouldn't treat just for white patches. I'd have everything ready, but would not treat just for that.
My reidi has pigement loss and the spots fluctuate daily. They come and go, show up in different places. He is quite old but if I treated for every light spot the poor guy would never get out of the hospital tank.
These pigment changes have been ongoing for over a year.
Personally I wouldn't treat just for white patches. I'd have everything ready, but would not treat just for that.
My reidi has pigement loss and the spots fluctuate daily. They come and go, show up in different places. He is quite old but if I treated for every light spot the poor guy would never get out of the hospital tank.
These pigment changes have been ongoing for over a year.
