Flying Dutch 700 gallon in wall tank-living room/home office divider - Build Thread

[Euler Kernighan]

Matt,

I'm speakless - you're very very skillful on 3D illustrations... what do you think about a freela job? I'm hiring a guy to drawing all my tanks!!! :bounce3: kidding!!! huahuahauhaau

I tried to highlight some points on your design - my main concern is about the pump head loss and i'm trying to figure out how to 'adapt' oceans motions on this setup. As I'm going to use two OM-4way there'll be four outlet pipes on each corner - how to 'hide' that and how to hide two inlets?

Unfortunately I don't have room on sides... just have about 10 inches on each side and I'm going to use it for overflow boxes... I may reduce the boxes's width so I can use your suggestions... let me sketch it!

If you look at this image below of David Saxby's tank you can see the large weir on the right directs water to the sump. The small black weir protects the cl feeds. You can also see his returns coming up and over the back of the tank. David added a false back wall to this area and built rock work up over it. You wouldnt have to do this as your in wall style would hide the pipe work in the corners.

Just giving you another option, hope it helps.

:thumbsup:

About Saxby's tank, for goodness sake, I'm not questioning the design, but it seems there is a lot of pumps to run this setup, right?

Again, with all these 45, 90 elbows there's a lot of head loss, I guess.

 

[Euler Kernighan]

i would not put the intakes of the CL pumps in your overflow.
if you do, when power shuts off, and the oveflow drains to the sump, it will create a siphon on the output of the pumps and drain the tank even with the overflow.... which means that the whole tank will drain to the sump creating a mess and dry tank....

If you look at the picture of the David Saxby tank, the intakes for the closed loops are the two outside pipes with holes drilled for suction. the three middle pipes are the rerun lines that propel water to the desired areas.

:thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup:

Thanks Dahenley for your consideration here - I owe you a beer!! have you been at billy bob's? :bounce2:

Please keep helping us!!! Any suggestion about CLs?

 

[Euler Kernighan]

One good way I have found to solve some of the issues with ball valves not closing is using bulkheads that have threads on the inside. This way If for some reason I can not get the valve to close I can simply screw in a plug on the tank side and I lose a small amount of water this way, instead of draining the entire tank. I understand that this is of little help in the event of a plumbing failure but it is something to consider.

Good work around redneck!!!:thumbsup:

 

[d3hree]

About Saxby's tank, for goodness sake, I'm not questioning the design, but it seems there is a lot of pumps to run this setup, right?

Again, with all these 45, 90 elbows there's a lot of head loss, I guess.

If I remeber correctly I think Saxby has about 6x turnover in flow on his tank, the Deltec HLP pumps dont put out a great deal Its as much about intelligent flow as it is amount of flow. He has them switching on and off in 3 second intervals which is pretty effective.

The elbows, whilst adding frictional resistance, do allow for the whole tank to be serviced without any deadspots.

Are you adding a picture frame to finish the hole?, usually this would encroach on the glass a little and with 25mm plumbing from the OM units you could tuck the pipes in the corners and hide with the framing?

Could you incorporate a coast to coast along the back wall instead of the two seperate overflow boxes?, this would give you and extra 20" to play with?

 

[Euler Kernighan]

Guys,

After a stressful week, finally got my hand dirty on this project. And you thought it'd never happen, uh? :lolspin:

Power tool? Not so power, just a cheapest chinese copy from a DeWalt/Makita/Milwaukee circular saw, I used it to cut a solid wall - a big hole in the wall for our tank

 

[Euler Kernighan]

a vacuum cleaner and its 'adaptation'... hauhaau

Another tool to use and discard...

That's the 'adaptation':

 

[Euler Kernighan]

swapping things - door to the left, wall to the right:

I drew the hole on the wall, just to make a 'perfect' cut - 99 inch long x 30 inch high:

 

[Euler Kernighan]

after that I fixed some wooden strips on wall to serve like a guides to circular saw:

This is how the cuts look like:

it's 'clean', uh?

 

[d3hree]

nice work Euler!

 

[Euler Kernighan]

Horizontal guides... that's me working like a horse! :bounce3:

On business days I work as Project Manager on a high tech company dealing RFPs RFQs and so on. On weekends I DIYing everything!!! uahuhauaha :dance:

 

[Euler Kernighan]

clean cuts on a solid wall - guides and circular saw works fine! :fun2:

and some dust... let my wife do something... :lolspin:

 

[Euler Kernighan]

If I remeber correctly I think Saxby has about 6x turnover in flow on his tank, the Deltec HLP pumps dont put out a great deal Its as much about intelligent flow as it is amount of flow. He has them switching on and off in 3 second intervals which is pretty effective.

switching on and off in 3 second intervals? that's causes a really nightmare on pumps engine I guess.

The elbows, whilst adding frictional resistance, do allow for the whole tank to be serviced without any deadspots.

you're right! It's quality not quantity.

Are you adding a picture frame to finish the hole?,

yep!

usually this would encroach on the glass a little and with 25mm plumbing from the OM units you could tuck the pipes in the corners and hide with the framing?

good point! I'll take some measures to see if it is possible.

Could you incorporate a coast to coast along the back wall instead of the two seperate overflow boxes?, this would give you and extra 20" to play with?

Unfortunately not. :sad1: On one side is my living room on another side is my home office and my goal is to enable a clear view between the two environments - the front and back glasses will be starphire.

 

[Euler Kernighan]

nice work Euler!

Thanks Matt! Tomorrow I'll upload another pics!

Btw, are you going to watch the Royal Wedding? They invite me but I running out of time with other matters... :beer: huahuahauha

 

[dahenley]

have you been at billy bob's? :bounce2:

Please keep helping us!!! Any suggestion about CLs?

Never been to billy bobs.. (where is it, sounds interesting!)

I have never done a closed loop, but I have a tank in process that i am wanting to do a HOB Closed loop. (like David Saxby)

Closed loop systems dont have head loss. (from my understanding)
because the intake and output are looped in the same tank, it acts like a siphon on the suction so it pushes back on the output.
the pump is just helping out. (honestly, you could use a cheap china pump if hooked up and it would run it no problem.. just not reliable)

Having a mag driven pump over a shaft driven, its not as hard on the pump being turned on and off as long as its not fighting head pressure like a normal sump system.

With a HOB style, you dont ever have to worry about leaking, and if you want to change something, its easy. (if you want to change the plumbing under the rocks, its a little more challenging but not like a normal drilled closed loop.)


as far as the comment about smart flow. YES.
a friend of mine had a CL system, high flow return pumps, and tons of in tank powerheads and had tons of turnover, but not much "FLOW"

all his outlets and powerheads were fighting each other so it was canceling out a lot of potential flow and he could have done a lot better by positioning things differently and changing his rocks a little.
SO, by thinking and changing things and knowing what you want to achieve you can do a lot with a little.

i know its open ended, but thinking makes things better in the end.
(some people build their rock structure out of the tank and then you can plan your CL plumbing.)

keep the pictures coming.
:bounce1::bounce3::bounce2:

 

[dubes08]

looking good ! ! !

 

[Edward Ducharme]

Euler, you are a man with a plan.

I'll certainly be making this my first officially followed tank build.

I wish you the best of luck!

 

[d3hree]

Thanks Matt! Tomorrow I'll upload another pics!

Btw, are you going to watch the Royal Wedding? They invite me but I running out of time with other matters... :beer: huahuahauha

Lol, no royal wedding for me. I had to be dragged kicking and screaming to my own wedding let alone other peoples. From what i can gather most folks in the UK are happy to have the extra day off and would thank the Royals for that.

 

[Euler Kernighan]

Never been to billy bobs.. (where is it, sounds interesting!)

bet you'll like! it's a biggest pub with indoor arena and a lot of other stuff, the best part is beer, beer and beer!!! when you got in downtown Fort Worth spend some time there you will not regret!

http://www.billybobstexas.com/ :thumbsup:

I have never done a closed loop, but I have a tank in process that i am wanting to do a HOB Closed loop. (like David Saxby)

is it the 96*24*24 one?

Closed loop systems dont have head loss. (from my understanding)
because the intake and output are looped in the same tank, it acts like a siphon on the suction so it pushes back on the output.
the pump is just helping out. (honestly, you could use a cheap china pump if hooked up and it would run it no problem.. just not reliable)

Having a mag driven pump over a shaft driven, its not as hard on the pump being turned on and off as long as its not fighting head pressure like a normal sump system.

With a HOB style, you dont ever have to worry about leaking, and if you want to change something, its easy. (if you want to change the plumbing under the rocks, its a little more challenging but not like a normal drilled closed loop.)

a friend of mine had a CL system, high flow return pumps, and tons of in tank powerheads and had tons of turnover, but not much "FLOW"

all his outlets and powerheads were fighting each other so it was canceling out a lot of potential flow and he could have done a lot better by positioning things differently and changing his rocks a little.
SO, by thinking and changing things and knowing what you want to achieve you can do a lot with a little.

That's a good point of view and should be highlighted. I'm trying to figure out how to do a "hang on corners/sides" instead HOB, as I said I have no 'back' in my DT as it's a room divider :sad1:

thank's for sharing your knowledge and let's roll!

 

[Euler Kernighan]

looking good ! ! !

thanks for join dubes!

 

[Euler Kernighan]

Euler, you are a man with a plan.

I'll certainly be making this my first officially followed tank build.

I wish you the best of luck!

it's my honor - welcome aboard! Let's do this together!

thanks! :thumbsup: