From chaeto refugium to Algae turf scrubber! Anyone?

[Brian DeGolier]

I find that the chaeto in my refugium just doesn't grow very well and have been thinking about changing to an ATS. Has anyone done this and have positive results? The bulbs are new 5000K, the chaeto now almost acts as an ATS, there is a lot of algae growing on it, and it does not seem healthy, parts of it I have to throw away becuase it just dies. I've been reading about the ATS lately and I like the idea of allowing algae that wants to grow in my refugium to just grow. I still will use my skimmer and carbon and GFO as needed, but I want to try this. Your thoughts. Thanks

 

[OodleyBoodely]

OK, I'll bite! If you decide to go algae scrubber, build it right using the correct lighting, water flow and screen sizing, or, you may find yourself dissapointed in the results. 5000K lights may grow algae on your chaeto, but, they are far from optimal lighting for an algae scrubber and may result in algae preferring to grow in your display tank instead of on the filter screens. Also, just passively allowing algae to grow over the sump will also cause problems that would be avoided by actively scrubbing in a dedicated filter setup....example; it would be difficult to clean/harvest algae from the sump and in fact would cause clouding and yellowing of the water in the whole system...this is avoided in an ats by cleaning the screens outside the tank system. Using the skimmer, carbon, and, gfo concurrently with an ats will strip the system of coral feeding organics, robbing the ats preventing it from developing properly as a whole system filter. Point here is a properly set up algae scrubber does not need the skimmer, carbon, and, gfo...they will only hurt its performance. ( I read too! lol!)

 

[ivans75]

Your chaeto in refug is dead because u have inadequate lighting. You should treat your chaeto like your SPS, it needs a STRONG light. Forget about ATS it doesnt really work on little system. Way too much hassle

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Point here is a properly set up algae scrubber does not need the skimmer, carbon, and, gfo...they will only hurt its performance. )

You're including GAC (carbon) in that that list?

How do you expect to keep organics down and the water from slowly yellowing if you neither skim nor use GAC?

And on the flip side, how do you think that GAC and skimming is decreasing turf algae growth? Iron? If so, that is easily added, allowing you to keep the water cleaner by using skimming, GAC, or both, along with macroalgae or turf algae growth. You'd most likely want to add it anyway.

 

[ivans75]

lol dont start ats hate thread Randy hehehe

 

[Brian DeGolier]

I guess I have always read that a refugium requires just dim lighting, sometimes the light was too strong, other times weak. I obviously need to find that sweet spot of the correct wattage and change the bulbs more often, I use a clamp light with 5000K PC's. In the past, my chaeto grew so well and I sold it to the LFS. I'm intrigued with the idea of no skimmer and GFO/GAC reactors and using a well seasoned ATS, the biopellets did not work for me after a full year. I'll still check into it and search RC with questions in the meantime, I may take the leap someday. Thanks

 

[psykobowler]

I have been running 150 watt metal halide 14k in my refugium with an unbelievable crazy growth. I gave a bucketful of chaeto to my lfs today and he was so happy. I had powercompact lighting in the fuge before. Halide is better and the heat from the lamp helps with the cold winter nights.

 

[jwoyshnar]

Most people that down play algae scrubbers have either never used one or used it improperly. I have used one on my 180 for the past few months and it was a much better improvement over the fuge. Also I have seen personally algae scrubbers work on tanks from 20 gallons up to 200+.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

I have used one on my 180 for the past few months and it was a much better improvement over the fuge. .

I don't doubt it exports more nutrients than a typical refugium. Do you use any method of organic export? FWIW, a few months might not be enough for the organic issues to develop.

 

[BHD]

Hello everyone, PLEASE help me understand this "organic". What is this organic that everyone is talking about??? I read that Chaeto will add organic to the water. now Randy is saying that the micro algae growing on ATS will add organic to the water. Then there is also organic carbon dosing that would also add organic to the water... What is this organic?? Can someone help explain this???

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Hello everyone, PLEASE help me understand this "organic". What is this organic that everyone is talking about??? I read that Chaeto will add organic to the water. now Randy is saying that the micro algae growing on ATS will add organic to the water. Then there is also organic carbon dosing that would also add organic to the water... What is this organic?? Can someone help explain this???

I don't recall saying the ATS adds organics, although it might. Almost everything in the tank adds some type of organic matter. I was saying that an ATS alone will not remove it, and so the tank water will slowly yellow and potentially collect toxic organics over time without some means of exporting organics (GAC, skimming, Purigen, ozone, etc).

This article details what I mean by organics:

Organic Compounds in the Reef Aquarium
http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2004-10/rhf/index.htm

 

[Brian DeGolier]

Interesting article Randy. Thanks

 

[WCreef]

Very interesting I have an ats. Great info thanks!


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[docstomper]

My cheato grows like a weed. I have a 65w bulb for it.. Personally I think people assume Cheato MUST grow.. No, If the cheato is battling for phosphate it will not grow fast. I do have a 6 inch layer of cheato... but I do NOT have any sps... my tank is too "dirty". I wish my cheato would stop growing so fast.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Interesting article Randy. Thanks

You're welcome

Happy Reefing.

 

[BigCountry74]

A metal halide to grow chaeto?? insane

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Maybe insane, but I've done it as well.

 

[jimrawr]

OP, I went from a fuge to an ATS and am very happy I did so. For me chaeto never grew either, so I am able to export with a turf scrubber more than I was with a fuge. I still have some gracilaria in my fuge right now but its not growing, just surviving.

ATS is so cheap to build it really cant hurt anything by giving it a shot.

 

[jwoyshnar]

I don't doubt it exports more nutrients than a typical refugium. Do you use any method of organic export? FWIW, a few months might not be enough for the organic issues to develop.

I use a skimmer still but i hope to do away with it eventually. I used a algae turf scrubber on a skimmerless 55 gallon a few years ago and my corals thrived. That was up like that for well over a year. My last 90 had a turf scrubber on it for a year and once again all of my stuff thrived. The only struggle i have had was when i went to the 180 i have now and didnt have a scrubber. My 180 has never looked as good as it does now.

 

[gbru316]

My cheato grows like a weed. I have a 65w bulb for it.. Personally I think people assume Cheato MUST grow.. No, If the cheato is battling for phosphate it will not grow fast. I do have a 6 inch layer of cheato... but I do NOT have any sps... my tank is too "dirty". I wish my cheato would stop growing so fast.

I used a standard 65w incandescent bulb for my last fuge (30g rubbermaid) as well. Chaeto also grew like a weed for me.