GoldFlake Angel

[RBU1]

OK so I got my Goldflake angel last Thursday. I put him in my 30 gallon QT and so far all is doing great. He has been eating since the first day in the QT. Well last night I am doing my almost 100% water change and I notice his front fins have some cloudiness to them. Crypt or Flukes????

I also notice he is flashing on the PVC pipe.......I was debating on starting a PraziPro treatment or start Cupramine. Well I started the cuprmaine so I will see whtat happens.......

What does everyone think cloudy spots on the front fins would be? Crypt or Flukes....If its gone today, it might even be bacterial and the large water change helped it out.

Here is a pic....You cant see anything in the picture but wanted to show what he looks like.

 

[LargeAngels]

Hard to tell from pic, but goldflakes are notorious for comming in with flukes. I'd do a FW dip to see if anything falls off.

 

[RBU1]

I am not a fan of fw dips. I am going to call seachem and ask about mixing cupramine and prazipro

 

[lhm nole]

Hard to tell from pic, but goldflakes are notorious for comming in with flukes. I'd do a FW dip to see if anything falls off.

And would put some melafix in afterwards if it is a minor fungus or bacteria on the fins.

 

[RBU1]

OK I know people have done it before, however Seachem states to not mix any other medication with Cupramine. SO I will finish out my 4 week copper treatment and then do a prazipro treatment.

 

[lhm nole]

OK I know people have done it before, however Seachem states to not mix any other medication with Cupramine. SO I will finish out my 4 week copper treatment and then do a prazipro treatment.

You can always take the angel out and do a fw prazipro dip and then put him back in the qt copper tank and should be no issues and you are not mixing meds.

 

[ROBONE20]

Same thing happened to my Semilarvartus Butterflies. I bought a pair this Saturday and they were doing exactly what your Goldflake was doing. I used Prazipro instead for the initial treatment since it's easier on the fish. After the first day, no more scratching on a rock, no more twitching, and the whitish film on their tails are both gone. I suspected it was flukes. If spots start showing up, then I'll start with Cupramine, but I've read you can use both at the same time. I'll look for the thread here on RC.

 

[RBU1]

Same thing happened to my Semilarvartus Butterflies. I bought a pair this Saturday and they were doing exactly what your Goldflake was doing. I used Prazipro instead for the initial treatment since it's easier on the fish. After the first day, no more scratching on a rock, no more twitching, and the whitish film on their tails are both gone. I suspected it was flukes. If spots start showing up, then I'll start with Cupramine, but I've read you can use both at the same time. I'll look for the thread here on RC.

I know there are threads around with people using cupramine and prazipro together. I just don't like the fact Seachem says not to do it...

 

[Recty]

I know there are threads around with people using cupramine and prazipro together. I just don't like the fact Seachem says not to do it...

IMO, they are just covering their butts... they dont want to get blamed if there is a problem and have people say that the Prazipro did it.

Literally every person I know who treats their fish uses both in conjunction and havent had any issues.

They are your fish so if you think you're doing what's best for them, great, but with so much evidence to point towards the two medications being fine together I think I'd "risk" the treatment especially since that's probably the medication they need most if they have flukes, rather than copper.

 

[RBU1]

Well so far I have only dosed 2ml of cuprmaine. My final dose to get me to .5 is right around 6 to 7ml. If the fish was still acting and eating like normal when I get home from work tonight I was going to add another 2ml of copper that should get me right around the .25 range. When would you dose the PraziPro? Does PraziPro disipate from the system or does it need to be removed somehow?

 

[LargeAngels]

"If" I was worried about mixing the meds, was uncomfortable with FW dips and I thought the fish had flukes I would treat with Prazipro first then Cupramine and not wait 4 weeks to treat for flukes.

That being said I would have no problem mixing the meds (I do it all the time) or just doing a FW dip while treating with Cupramine.

Recty is right. Cupramine is just covering their butt.

 

[RBU1]

"If" I was worried about mixing the meds, was uncomfortable with FW dips and I thought the fish had flukes I would treat with Prazipro first then Cupramine and not wait 4 weeks to treat for flukes.

That being said I would have no problem mixing the meds (I do it all the time) or just doing a FW dip while treating with Cupramine.

Recty is right. Cupramine is just covering their butt.

Do you mix the Cuprmaine with the Prazi when you are at full strenght .5 copper or at anytime? Like I stated about I only added 2ml of cuprmaine and I need to add a total of 7ml. Should I dose the prazi tongiht instead of the cuprmaine??? Do I need to do anything special to get the Prazi out of the system before continuing with the 4 week copper???

 

[LargeAngels]

My usual is 7 days Cup and praz, then 50% water change (full dose of praz and enough Cup to get back to 0.5) then after another 7 days 50% water change and just add Cup.

I would first do a FW dip and see if it does have flukes. JHemdal has expressed concern that if there is a heavy infestation of flukes a treatment of Prazi may be too much stress for the fish when all the flukes drop off. He recommends doing a FW dip first. Which is what I am now doing on smaller fish or fish I suspect may have heavy infestations. Then allowing the fish to heal from the wounds left from the dead flukes before treatment. On fish like goldflakes which have a reputation for comming in with flukes I would be inclined to first follow JHemdal's advice.

 

[RBU1]

Well what is your procedure for FW dips? They make me nervous....

 

[RBU1]

I called the place I got the fish and he told me the fish has already been treated with Prazi. So I feel a little more comfortable that we are not dealing with Flukes. I will continue to increase my copper level.

 

[LargeAngels]

I called the place I got the fish and he told me the fish has already been treated with Prazi. So I feel a little more comfortable that we are not dealing with Flukes. I will continue to increase my copper level.

That's good. Keep in mind that it usually takes 2 treatments of Prazi to kill adults and allow the eggs laid by the adults to hatch and be killed.

Here is a good ref. for FW dips. http://atj.net.au/marineaquaria/freshwaterdips.html

 

[RBU1]

Well I am not sure about the 2 treatments....I will get my copper level up to .5 and keep it there for 4 weeks provided all goes smooth.....Then I will do another couple prazi treatments.

THanks for the link.

 

[ROBONE20]

I wouldn't do the FW dip. Especially if you're not comfortable with the process. I think you're on the right path though. You started with Cupramine, so complete the treatment and be done with it. If the LFS treated with Prazipro and you trust them, it still wouldn't hurt to hit it with Prazipro on the back end later if you don't want to treat at the same time. You'll know if the fish has a bad case of flukes if he starts shaking/twitching or eyes get a little cloudy, and even scratching on the rocks. This is why I treat for Flukes first, because if it had ich, then you'd see the white spots. Prazipro can be removed by Carbon and water change. I believe Seachem makes a product that can absorb copper. Just make sure you keep monitoring the copper, don't overdose and watch you're ammonia levels. Water change is your best friend if those levels are elevated.

 

[RBU1]

Thanks

 

[skibum9884]

Also, I know we spoke this morning, but keep in mind I've heard that flukes will not kill a fish overnight (I heard this from a VERY reliable source, but please research this yourself too!). So, first priority might be to get the fish eating well and fattened up in case it goes on a feeding strike once you add praziquantel.

Also, don't be afraid to trust your own judgement. You've given great advice to others (including myself), so no need to second guess your opinions based on what you personally see!