Green Mandarin (Synchiropus splendidus) Breeding Log!
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mwp
In Memoriam
We still have mandarins - one that's doing its best to decimate the rotifer population, and another that looks like it's stuck in the meniscus of the water alone the edge of the tank. Well, that's 2 remaining...we'll see how much longer they hang around, and I'm going to keep taking development pics as long as I can find them!
Matt
Matt
Hi Matt,
Yeah, maybe one of those hatch that would go down the drain could be used that way. I´ve heard about larva from pelagic eggs starving at day 4 or 5. Hope I´m not being guided through the time yours are now.
You talked about the larvae traped at the meniscus. Can it be happening to the others ?
Anderson.
Yeah, maybe one of those hatch that would go down the drain could be used that way. I´ve heard about larva from pelagic eggs starving at day 4 or 5. Hope I´m not being guided through the time yours are now.
You talked about the larvae traped at the meniscus. Can it be happening to the others ?
Anderson.
mwp
In Memoriam
Anderson, I've seen several larvae at the meniscus, but also at the surface in general. The one obviously healhty and happy baby I found this evening was NOWHERE CLOSE to the surface and it hasn't been all day. I suspect that larvae at the surface = BAD 
So this will be the last pictures for a couple days, I'm headed out of town. Mandarin Larvae at 131 hours post hatch! If he's still around on Sunday, I'll drag him out for another round of pics! He was kinda freaking out but is now fine back in the 10...I didn't get any good 200X shots, but I did get a good vid (linked below). The other larvae in the pics is a 192 hours post release Apogon leptacanthus.
http://www.cichlidrecipe.com/nanoreef/man_131_4.avi
FWIW,
Matt
So this will be the last pictures for a couple days, I'm headed out of town. Mandarin Larvae at 131 hours post hatch! If he's still around on Sunday, I'll drag him out for another round of pics! He was kinda freaking out but is now fine back in the 10...I didn't get any good 200X shots, but I did get a good vid (linked below). The other larvae in the pics is a 192 hours post release Apogon leptacanthus.
http://www.cichlidrecipe.com/nanoreef/man_131_4.avi
FWIW,
Matt
mwp
In Memoriam
I thought this might happen...9-22-06, 1:38 AM, WE HAVE A SPAWN!. Unfortunately, I'm leaving in less than 7 hours...absolutely nothing I could do to care for these and I'm probably going to "chill" on them for a bit and give the Perc's larvae a shot (if they don't destroy their first nest). It's all about having something SUCCESSFUL to show for my efforts (will probably help earn that 2nd 10 gallon tank for larvae).
Oh well, just flipped the pump back on and let 'em go the route of any spawn I don't know happened. Night of a new moon, not surprising...I'm really starting to get some consistent data on spawn intervals and times of peak activity (new and full moons = good chance of a spawn). By the end of the year maybe I'll have enough data to see if there's a true correlation.
Well, that's it for now..I have to get the tanks ready for less experienced care while I'm away!
Matt
Oh well, just flipped the pump back on and let 'em go the route of any spawn I don't know happened. Night of a new moon, not surprising...I'm really starting to get some consistent data on spawn intervals and times of peak activity (new and full moons = good chance of a spawn). By the end of the year maybe I'll have enough data to see if there's a true correlation.
Well, that's it for now..I have to get the tanks ready for less experienced care while I'm away!
Matt
mwp
In Memoriam
Well, I'm back and we still have 1 live mandarin baby He's a tough one. I'll post an update late tonight perhaps!
Tito, we know that mandarins should "Settle" and look towards the bottom between 11 and 14 days. I would agree with the oxygen deprevation theory you've posted, but we can easily rule it out as the Apogon leptacanthus larvae who are currently sharing the tank were NOT at the surface. It's something else, I just don't know what. Most likely, not getting enough food, they float and then die.
Matt
He's a tough one. I'll post an update late tonight perhaps!Tito, we know that mandarins should "Settle" and look towards the bottom between 11 and 14 days. I would agree with the oxygen deprevation theory you've posted, but we can easily rule it out as the Apogon leptacanthus larvae who are currently sharing the tank were NOT at the surface. It's something else, I just don't know what. Most likely, not getting enough food, they float and then die.
Matt
Roks-Sharky
New member
From Fall 1989 issue of Seascope:
[ http://www2.hawaii.edu/~delbeek/delb15.html ]
"Mandarin larvae are extremely small and cannot be fed rotifers as a first food but success has been achieved through the use of marine in fusoria and especially copepod nauplii."
Could peppermint, glass shrimp or mysis nauplii work?
Are newly hatched brine shrimp really too large? You would know if you took a look under the scope? They do not contain HUFA, necessary for the larvae, because they are not actually marine animals, but they could help supplement the larvae's diet.
Sorry if any of this has been addressed already . . . .
[ http://www2.hawaii.edu/~delbeek/delb15.html ]
"Mandarin larvae are extremely small and cannot be fed rotifers as a first food but success has been achieved through the use of marine in fusoria and especially copepod nauplii."
Could peppermint, glass shrimp or mysis nauplii work?
Are newly hatched brine shrimp really too large? You would know if you took a look under the scope? They do not contain HUFA, necessary for the larvae, because they are not actually marine animals, but they could help supplement the larvae's diet.
Sorry if any of this has been addressed already . . . .
mwp
In Memoriam
I think that exact quote was already brought up. The smallest zooplankton out of all that you mentioned are the Rotifers. The "copepod nauplii" are a difficult option only because no one really has shown a proven method of culturing enough pelagic (Calanoid) copepods in a home setting. For now, rotifers are the smallest zooplankton avaiable, with the SS/S Strain (B. rotundiformis) smaller than the more common L-Strain. I've utilized both strains in my mandarin culture.
Another possibility is that the mandarin larvae may actually feed directly on phytoplankton in the earliest stages. To that end, feeding T-Iso and Tetraselmis are cited due to their motile tendencies...little algae that SWIM may provoke a feeding response. If rotifers can eat these algaes, the mandarin larvae would have NO problem doing the same.
It may simply be insufficient enrichment or it may be something completely different, but I should stress that mandarins have been done repeatedly now; as you can see with all my trials and tribulations with hatching, it may take a lot of experimentation to find the winning factor that eliminates the 3-5 day die off, and I think that's most likely food related at this time.
FWIW,
Matt
Another possibility is that the mandarin larvae may actually feed directly on phytoplankton in the earliest stages. To that end, feeding T-Iso and Tetraselmis are cited due to their motile tendencies...little algae that SWIM may provoke a feeding response. If rotifers can eat these algaes, the mandarin larvae would have NO problem doing the same.
It may simply be insufficient enrichment or it may be something completely different, but I should stress that mandarins have been done repeatedly now; as you can see with all my trials and tribulations with hatching, it may take a lot of experimentation to find the winning factor that eliminates the 3-5 day die off, and I think that's most likely food related at this time.
FWIW,
Matt
mwp
In Memoriam
So, just a little side note, I haven't seen our lone mandarin larvae since the evening of 9-24 - at that point it was basically 8.5 days old. I'm thinking that it most definitely could still be around, just "lost" in the sea of rotifers, copepods, baby A. leptacanthus and a bunch of green detritus that's pretty much the same color as the mandarin would be! Normally I would be tearing down the tank to prepare for the next spawn, but because I still have 40+ leptacanthus larvae, the tank is going to be up and running for hopefully several weeks meaning that the little mandarin, if still around, may still have a chance to grow up!
FWIW,
Matt
FWIW,
Matt
apistomaster
New member
Hi Matt,
Just a quick question for you? Are you using the 24 galAquapod setups out of the box and unmodified? I'm thinking about trying the HQI lit set so I can dabble in sps coral and maybe a pair of those red banded hifin gobies(don't know the scientific name yet) and I may modify it so I can add another 20 gallons in a remote refugium later. The gobies are small enough that they can scrounge 'pods after itts's well run in. I suspect they are a picky eater as are the mandarins.
Larrry
Just a quick question for you? Are you using the 24 galAquapod setups out of the box and unmodified? I'm thinking about trying the HQI lit set so I can dabble in sps coral and maybe a pair of those red banded hifin gobies(don't know the scientific name yet) and I may modify it so I can add another 20 gallons in a remote refugium later. The gobies are small enough that they can scrounge 'pods after itts's well run in. I suspect they are a picky eater as are the mandarins.
Larrry
mwp
In Memoriam
Larry, the 3 24 gallon cubes I run are all JBJ's. I have one (The cardinalfish tank) running hoodless with a 150 W Finnex HQI fixture above (picked the topless tank and such up from Nanocustoms). MY HQI 24 actually runs the coolest out of the 3 tanks due to the open top (max evaporative cooling).
FWIW,
Matt
FWIW,
Matt
apistomaster
New member
Matt,
Thanks for the quick reply. 150watt halide for a 20 inch cube!
That ought to be enough light for cloudy days! With the small
difference in price for only a 70 watt sounds like the way to go. I imagine sps corals need some regular pruning and when you get down to it that is a better simulation of the intensity of sunlight on the reef. May well be one of the keys to your spawning successes even though that occurs at night. I have long been convinced that pouring energy into reef tanks is not wasted. The cooling is tough for me because we usually spend weeks into the mid 100 teens every summer even before the global warming started to kick in. That's why they call the Snake river canyon Hell's Canyon it's a natural solar oven. I think the record is about 120dF.
The steelhead are beginning to arrive so it's time for me to spend some time on the Grand Ronde. Tightlines,
Larry
Thanks for the quick reply. 150watt halide for a 20 inch cube!
That ought to be enough light for cloudy days! With the small
difference in price for only a 70 watt sounds like the way to go. I imagine sps corals need some regular pruning and when you get down to it that is a better simulation of the intensity of sunlight on the reef. May well be one of the keys to your spawning successes even though that occurs at night. I have long been convinced that pouring energy into reef tanks is not wasted. The cooling is tough for me because we usually spend weeks into the mid 100 teens every summer even before the global warming started to kick in. That's why they call the Snake river canyon Hell's Canyon it's a natural solar oven. I think the record is about 120dF.
The steelhead are beginning to arrive so it's time for me to spend some time on the Grand Ronde. Tightlines,
Larry
mwp
In Memoriam
Well, the Mandarin pair is NOT under the Metal Halide....they're under the standard 2 X 36 watt compact flourescent.
On the tank with the 150 watt MH (+ 2 18 watt CF actinics) SPS growth is actually not that great and in fact at one point I lost just about everything when some SPS eating nudibranchs showed up. Xenia and Cynaria...those are the two things growing exceptionally well under the MH lighting!
Matt
On the tank with the 150 watt MH (+ 2 18 watt CF actinics) SPS growth is actually not that great and in fact at one point I lost just about everything when some SPS eating nudibranchs showed up. Xenia and Cynaria...those are the two things growing exceptionally well under the MH lighting!
Matt
apistomaster
New member
Matt,
I still have much to learn about growing corals. I only had lps like elegance, hammer and so on as well as the usual soft corals. I had 6-110 watt VHO over my 6 ft 125. But I did have mandarins, flame angels and yellowtail blue damsels spawn regularly in the evenings. I have just been thinking about trying the minireef approach. Especially from what I've seen you've been able to do. It's pretty hard to collect eggs out of a 125gal and it costs more than I'm willing to spend to fill such large tanks up enough to make it interesting to look at.
Larry
I still have much to learn about growing corals. I only had lps like elegance, hammer and so on as well as the usual soft corals. I had 6-110 watt VHO over my 6 ft 125. But I did have mandarins, flame angels and yellowtail blue damsels spawn regularly in the evenings. I have just been thinking about trying the minireef approach. Especially from what I've seen you've been able to do. It's pretty hard to collect eggs out of a 125gal and it costs more than I'm willing to spend to fill such large tanks up enough to make it interesting to look at.
Larry
mwp
In Memoriam
Well, it's 9-28-06, 10:45 PM and I noticed we have courtship activity in the mandarins. I may or may not be able to stay awake long enough to confirm a spawn (and collect it). IF I DO manage to collect eggs, I will hatch them tomorrow - with that said, anyone in the Chicago area want to try raising mandarins??? My lone larval tank has 15 day old leptacanthus larvae already and is likely going to get some percula larvae as well...there's simply no room to try to raise the mandarins at this point!
Matt
Matt
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