Having a go at breeding.

[mark97r6]

Hey guys alittle help if you would.

I have 2 pairs of clowns in my 360g reef system (pair of Tom's, and a pair of Black saddlebacks).

I have had the Toms for about 18 months and keep looking to see if they are breeding yet, as they keep the smooth, flat rock beneth their host RBTA spotlessly clean, but i aint lucky yet

I recently came across someone who is packing marines up and they have a pair of Percs that spawn every 2 weeks, and have done for a while now. Though the guy has never tried to raise them.

I have raised a couple of variety of marine shrimps and have fancied giving clowns ago for a while, so i have snapped em up and just setting a tank up for them.

As space is a big issue, they are going in my bedroom in a 35g (with a small sump), which is replacing a 55g i already have in their.

In the 55 already i have a pair of neon gobies, though i could never find the nest neither have i witnessed larvae being released, i am sure they are spawning also.

My plan is to set the 35g up like a reef tank, though keep it very simple, as it is primarily a breeding tank. Though cant look a mess or i would be in the doghouse from the missis!
would the 2 pairs be ok sharing a 'spawning' tank? I would also like to add a pair of spawning dottybacks (P.fridmani) that are in my main reef if i can catch them.

My main question is, i would like to have the 35g as a small SPS tank. Mainly for my frags to grow on. Would the clowns be to upset if i was adding the SPS frags on occaision? Or should i put in what i can before the clowns and thats it i cant touch it?

Also the clowns are hosting a Euphillia/Torch coral at the moment would they readily host something else or am i better of taking this coral also? And how long should i exspect them to stop breeding for after moving tanks?

All questions are aimed at the clowns being happy and back to there spawning ASAP!

Thanks alot guys, and sorry for the long post. Wasnt sure if it belonged in the breeders section, but figured it was a bit more specific to the clowns.

Cheers
Mark

 

[Weatherman]

Iââ"šÂ¬Ã¢"žÂ¢m curious, too, as to what makes Clownfish comfortable enough to spawn.

I bought one Tomato Clown at the end of July, last year. I bought a second Tomato Clown at the end of September. On January 1st they spawned for the first time (after being together for only three months). They spawned a second time about a week ago.

I couldnââ"šÂ¬Ã¢"žÂ¢t believe things happened that fast.


My clownfishesââ"šÂ¬Ã¢"žÂ¢ home is a 180g bare-bottom tank with three, big, healthy BTAs to choose from. The only other fish in the tank are a Powder Blue Tang, a little yellow Clown Goby and a mandarin. The environment hasnââ"šÂ¬Ã¢"žÂ¢t been completely stable. The anemones have moved around a bit and the tank had to go through a long power outage as a result of Hurricane Wilma at the end of October.

 

[ezhoops]

For most clowns; being comfortable means having a good supply of nutrition, some sort of host, raliable photo periods, a slighty increased temp, and consistancy. Not too many changes in the tank or maintainance schedule. Most of the rarer clowns just like to be left alone. i.e. typical breeding tank is covered in black and clowns are left in BB tank with just clay pots.

example below

 

[Elmo18]

Sorry for being off topic...

Ezhoops, is that a chrysopterus?

- Ilham

 

[ezhoops]

nope, just a nice clarki

 

[ahbroody]

My nigripes spawned within a month of pairing. This is not the norm, but it did occour and still does. I have a different take on a few areas. I agree they need to be left alone regardless of the clown, but think they are more comfortable and more likely to breed in an area that looks like home. My clowns have 60 gallons that they only share with a single blenny. They have rock, multiple nems and corals and a regualr light and feeding schedule.

Clowns and I assume most fish would want a comfortable surrounding and lots of food. If you have ever walked up on your tank when your clowns are spawning you will notice it effects what they are doing. If you walk up just before they start it may stop them all together for a little while.
Would you want to do it in a glass bowl with people watching no similarities to home. I knwo fish breed in these surroundings all the time, I am just saying for rare clowns or hard to acclimate clowns like gripes, lueks, etc. I would think comfortable surroundings may help.
____________________________________________________
As to your specific question
DO NOT PUT 2 PAIRS OF CLOWNS IN A 35 GALLON TANK!!!!!! You will have fighting and a lack of stability.

your clowns will likely mess up your corals and knock them over and re arrange if they get to close. My gripes moved things they didnt like until they did. In an old tank I actually had a gripes that would get a running start and head but things it did not like near it's nem sliding them across the tank. Funny as hell to watch. Actually became kind of a game.

Pulling things in and out will effect their comfort level and create a situation less condusive to breeding. Would you want some big hand comming from above to rearrange your house every few days? It does not happen in the wild.

Basically if you want them to breed set up a 40 gallon breeder tank per pair with rock and stuff and they should be fine. It sucks its not what you want to hear, but its what works.
Mike

 

[mark97r6]

Thanks for the replys guys.
Mike real nice answer, makes alot of sense.

Though i think you miss understood my intentions. I already have two pairs in my 360g reef.
The 2 pairs that i am considering for the 35g is the spawning pair of percs and a pair of (hopefully) spawning neon gobies. And i am also contemplating adding a pair of dottybacks (P.fridmani).

How much more p[rotective will the clowns be with a nest? As i dont see the gobies being an issue, but not sure about the dotty's.

I think i will set the tank up with a few SPS frags and then just leave it alone.
Though my intention is not really to mass reproduce these fish, i just want to take the next step from the shrimp i have been raising.

The tank i am thinking of is:

A 13g sump/fuge, pumped to a 13g kind of above tank refugium, this will be my shrimp broodstock tank.
The fuge/shrimp tank will overflow to the main 35g tank then back to sump.

What do you think? In respect to breeding/larvae collection etc. Can i improve on this? while keeping it a nice show tank.

Thanks guys
Mark

 

[ahbroody]

I see

I see

Well as far as the pairs I would say as any lawyer would. It depends. I definetly dont think 3 pairs of fish in a 35 gallon is a good idea. Also dottybacks can be pretty aggressive. Or atleast my sisters are pretty agro. I would think they would drive the clowns nuts. And would eat anything they could given the chance. I would say it depends on what type of gobies and the area of the tank they will inhabit. I think the neon like to hide in rocks and corals so that would put them in the same space as the clowns. If they were sand based gobies I would think this would be less of a problem, but as they are not(unless i am wrong) it might be an issue with the clowns. Say it was signal gobbies or something that sifts sand I would think it would be less of an issue. The problem is there is only so much space in that 35 and your clowns will set up a perimeter around there nest and attack anything that comes near. Being the tank is smaller this will greatly reduce the amount of space the gobies can travel in as they will be in the same zone of the tank.
My gripes are understanding of the blenny as the feeder ring is near there nest, and he has been there as long as they have. During feeding they permit him into the area. But if he ventures at any other time they chase him and try to attack him.

As for raising the fry, I would not recommend doing it in the fugium. I am not sure if that is what you are implying. Clown fry are not the best hunters at birth and small. You need a seperate 5 gallon with a air pump and heater or atleast that is what is successfull for me now. you need to saturate the tank with rotifers which I donth think can be done in the fugium??? I am not 100% sure what your plans are for grow out.
That should really be a seperate thread though. Myself and some others more knowledged then me can give good advice on raising them. Buy joyce Wilkersons clownfish book if you dont have it aleready. Read it. Dont skim it like I did or it will bite you in the arse. Follow the book. You can always PM me and I will help you to the best of my ability.
Mike

 

[mark97r6]

Thanks again Mike.
I think i will put the dottys of untill i have more space.
The small tank upstream to the main will act as a fuge just because of lack of predatation, nothing else.

In this i plan to add my small group of peppermints and sexy shrimps that i have been breeding.
I will have seperate larval and growout tanks. I am actually getting quite good at raising larvae, but never done the first bit with rot's.
I have had joyce's book for a while, and read it many times.
Have you read Frank H. Hoff's book?: Conditioning, Spawning and Rearing of Fish With Emphasis on Marine Clownfish

Wondered if this was worth the purchase, or does he repeat what Joyce's book says?

I am just starting to have a go at culturing rots, though pyhto and brineshrimp wasn't a prob so i cant see them being!

I think i am trying to get too much from this little system, so i am just going to try the clowns for now.

If i can get these raised, i will move on then to the other fish i think.

Thanks for your help,