how many fish??

Jasontkd

New member
I am getting a 40 gallon breeder. I currently have 2 clowns. I want to add more fish (probably a few wrasses). How many fish is too many. If I add a few wrasses, could I also ad a shrimp gobie or some other small fish?

how many are too many

I have a good a mount of flow. It will be an SPS dominant tank. I have a CSS 220 skimmer, that I am currently modding (mesh and gate valve).
 
ya, I understand that. I have an SPS dominant 29 gallon now that I am moving everything over to the 40 gallon. I have just never had a wrasse, and I heard they do beter in small groups. Plus, i am not sure how messy of eaters they are.

With one male and one female (total of 4 fish with my clowns), is there room left for any additional fish?
 
I'd say there is space for a few more. 1 fish per 5 gal. The inverts don't really make a difference in bio-load.
 
I would add a Carpenter Wrasse, and a Clown Fairy Wrasse. I had both of these Wrasse along with a pair of O. Clowns, and a Yellow Watchman for 2 two yrs in my 40 breeder with no problem at all. Just make sure you have a skimmer that can handle the bio-load. Also my 40 breeder was 85% SPS.
 
snatchbak, the fish/gallon and inch/gallon rules really hold no meaning anymore. depending on the size and diet of a wrasse you could probably keep a few. I would keep a leopard wrasse for sure in that tank, they are beautiful and I think are supposed to be fun once they start eating.
 
Moonstream, a Leopard Wrasse is also a good choice. Before anyone buy one have the LFS feed the tank with some mysis , and if if Wrasse eats it I would buy it on the spot.
 
<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=12379628#post12379628 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by snatchbak
I'd say there is space for a few more. 1 fish per 5 gal. The inverts don't really make a difference in bio-load.

Is the 1 fish per 5 gallons a reasonable rule for an 80 gallon (I'm talking regular/small size fish like anthias, clowns, etc.)
 
Depends on what you want your tank to be, a healthy reef or fish tank? The more fish you have without a lot of skimming and water changes, with constant upkeep on stable parameters, the less growth and health of coral.
Also there is no x#fish/x#gallon rule, so many things that contribute to change the number one way or the other.

I would think you could do a wrasse and a goby and still have a fine tank.
 
<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=12379526#post12379526 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by kar93
If you are going with SPS dominant then it is best to keep bioload to a minimum.

Not that I totally disagree with you on that, but I wanted to provide an opposing viewpoint on that...

Some of the best SPS tanks I see are packed with fish. The fish require more feeding, and in turn, the bacterial populations of such a tank are much higher, which feeds corals... not to mention the scraps of food which corals get that much more often with multiple fish feedings. As long as one has efficient/effective water control methods, I see no reason why not to pack a tank with fish (as long as they get along of course). An efficient skimmer (not, not large necessarily, but efficient more so... like a bubble plate skimmer or something), a refugium, and frequent water changes are ways to deal with loads of fish.

The fish I kept in my 40Bs, not all at once or in the same tank mind you....

1. pyjama cardinal: my male was very durable, but did take a bite out of the fins on my yellow tang time to time... rather LARGE bites at that. I would say lantern-eye or glass cardinals are okay as well, just no kauldern/bangii cardinals. They get too nasty, esp in that small of a tank.

2. royal gramma: good size for this tank, good temperment.

3. ocellaris clowns: in this size tank, they seemed more territorial than in a larger tank, even with two BTA anemonaes present.

4. fairy/carpenter/flasher wrasses: perhaps the best pick, but you have to stick with smaller species, and less nasty ones. My suggestion would be a few of the solar wrasses, carpenters, flashers, etc. Ones to avoid due to temperment: Temmincki (and related velvet style ones), Lineatus, Rhomboid. Scotts might be okay though, or maybe an exquisite. Some species get pretty large and should be avoided. Some species also get 'mega males', like lineatus or Temmincki, and these will dominate a tank, killing the others. Solars though, as well as some others, dont get the 'big nasty males' so much. Perhaps my favorite was to put 4-5 fairy wrasses in a 40B... they totally took care of the flatworm infestation within a week or so that I had (no more flatworm exit), and also decimated the acro-bugs (I added them on purpose to see what they would do, interceptor at the ready). Do not get a 6-line, 3-line, or other related wrasse. They will become terrors in a 40B in time. Stick to the fairy/carpenter/flasher types.

5. pseudochromis types: watch out. They will kill other similar fish. This is why I would suggest the gamma (or even a black cap basslet) over these buggers. You can keep them, and if you do, get more than 3... the slight overcrowding will make their terrotories hard to set up or enforce (alot like freshwater cichlid 'overcrowding' is done).

6. Pipefish: they can tolerate higher flow even, but might need some supplimental feedings. Much more suited to a 40B than a mandarin though. Edit: not compatible with stinging inverts... will most likely get trapped by an anemone.

7. Mandarin: Unless you get one that accepts frozen foods, dont bother. From the sounds of it, I wouldnt consider you ready to try it either (no offense). Its a risky attempt. I ended up giving up and selling the bugger before it starved. Scooter or other dragonet type fish work well though.

8. bicolor/rock/sailfin blennies: I would avoid blennies, except for maybe the midas. If you ever plan on clams, they will nip on them in such a small tank more often than not, and they actually get pretty moody and harass other herbivores in such a small tank.

9. rainfordi/hector's gobies: get a few at a time, they are a pack fish. Great choice though... its just hard to get healthy ones (maybe try foster&smith).

10. yellow tang: the only tang possible, and even at that you will need to find a small one and keep it for about a year before it will need a larger tank. They arent that expensive, and make one of the best algae control critters around, so its worth considering. Only space for one though.

11. Clown Gobies: stay away from these unless a LPS/softy tank. They love to perch in corals, and secrete a poison which will kill the coral even.

12. neon gobies: a pack of these is a great pick. They will clean other fish, add some cool activity, etc. If you have other more active fish though, they will hide most of the time.

13. yellow candystripe hogfish: not compatible with pseudos and gamma types, but wicked enough of a fish to keep on its own and not care. Will munch on more delicate cleaner shrimp (skunks and peppermints). These fish are just rad though... mini versions of the larger hogfish, you can have fun seeing what they do when you add various small inverts to the tank (like small emeralds or sally-light foots... they go nuts!)

14: firefish/wormfish: cool to look at, need a secure cover/canopy... kinda boring once you get used to the cool colors... they dont do much.

15: Yellow Watchman or other 'shrimp' gobies: Most hide alot, but I would consider a watchman. Mine was always out and keeping an eye on me. I wouldnt bother with a shrimp though... they can be more of a pain than they are worth.

16: green chromis/schooling chromis types: they might look cool, and the idea of a schooling fish might be cool too, but they wont school in such a small tank, and they go get boring fast... 'saltwater goldfish' is what they are.

17: Jawfish: smaller fish and delicate shrimp are no-no's, but a jawfish or two, provided you have 5" of sand (so maybe a 50B or 65B rather than a 40B is a good idea) for them to make a den... these things are just wicked cool. They may hide at first, but as time goes on, they will come out often, they are the 'pugs' of the sea. Mine would even nip at my fingers like pitbulls if I got too close to their borrows. I had Bali Tigers (my favorite), but dusky, spotted, or yellowhead are all good.

18: grass eels: need open sand, so not SPS tank friendly for the most part. Actually very easy to keep and personable. You need many though to keep them from being too scared to come out. I kept them in a SPS tank by making my only tank decor/rocks from aragacrete in a way that the rocks were the background of the tank, so the whole 16" on the front of the tank was open sand, and all the SPS were on the back wall/rock of the tank.

FISH TO AVOID: Blennys, sand-sifter gobies, tangs, anthias, mandarins, angels of any type, hawkfish, butterfly, damsels, Tilefish...
 
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