How to eliminate aefw in bigger tank with many colonies

[gcp123]

I have a 5x2.5x2 tank with about 100 sps colonies. The tank has been running for about 2 years. I have recently noticed that a few colonies of sps not doing well. So I took them out to dip in bayer and was shocked to notice that there is a lot of aefw inside. Then I took a few other colony out to dip and check and found to have no aefw. So I believe only a few of my colonies are infested right now.

Fortunately since the start of the tank, I have been using acrylic tube and rod to mount my sps to facilitate shifting of corals. So there is no encrustations of sps on my liverock. I can easily take the 100 colonies out to bayer dip for 4 weeks.

My question is instead of setting up a separate tank to house the corals, can I dip the 100 colonies and put them back into the main tank and do this every week for 4 weeks?

What about the liverock? Since there is no encrustations can I keep them inside or I have to remove all the rocks?

Thanks.

 

[Piper27]

Yes there is no need to qt. Just dip each coral once a week for 5 or more weeks depending on the infestation. Leave the rocks in the tank. Be careful using Bayer on so many corals. I would try revive or even melafix because they won't poison your water.
A good tip is to use a two stage stones system with so many acros. Buy three small tanks and use one for a dip of as many corals as you can fit. Line them up in order of time they were added so you don't burn any corals to death. Then rinse each piece of in the middle tank violently to get all worms detached. Use the third tank as a clean tank to inspect for eggs and hold the acros for placement. Make sure to scrape the eggs off in the middle rinse tank.

Aefw are sneaky so make sure you check every hole and crevice of each colony. If the colony is to infested and has eggs all over it in places you can't see or get to I would frag it up and keep the good parts. The object is to clean the I tested corals as best you can for the week before you start your dipping. That means looking at every piece you have and understanding how bad the flatworms have spread. Check every colony and dip any with bite marks or eggs and scrape all eggs. Do this and it will help during your weekly dips. Don't skip even a day! I dipped every 6 days and added a couple weeks to make sure. Good luck!

 

[Reel North]

I've just come through the aefw wormhole. I have a 60"x36"x12 frag system, so I got lucky. It wasn't set up when I noticed them.

I set up the system, and dipped every few days with revive. I had a lot of losses, where the frags bleached, or never recovered.

I tried coral rx with some better results, but the aefw were still there.

I ended up using melafix marine for the last 4 dips, and there is no trace whatsoever of flatworms. I haven't lost a single frag or colony, and the color is coming back.

The frags don't slime, but anything on them dies really fast (pods etc).

I bough a couple of small colonies the other day and dipped them, and cut them off the mariculture plugs. I had some miscellaneous baddies come off I. The dip, a long with a tiny baby bobbit worm. I had an Acro crab come off as well, so I scooped him out and put him in a container with fresh saltwater in it. He has returned to the colony lol.

I think that the tea tree oil in melafix really kills things fast. It seems more gentle, yet more deadly. Like a ninja baby lol.

Just letting you know my experience.

One more dip and I'll be putting the sps back in my tank.

 

[Piper27]

I agree melafix was very effective and gentle. I switched up between melafix and revive because after week three I found new eggs because I dipped a few days late or wasn't dipping well enough. I didn't want them to become used to the revive dip if it is even possible, just made me more comfortable.
It's defiantly a thing that takes practice. Finding the right time spans the certain acros can handle being dipped for and looking for eggs in larger colonies. Making sure to rinse very well is a must because they don't always fall off. I like to tell people to spot dip affected Colo is for a week or two if they are really hit hard. That way they can heal some before being subjected to weekly dips. Dipping from the display tank ime was the best way unless you have a qt that is stable and been running healthy acros. Quickly setting up a qt tank to house acros is a surefire way to kill them and I have watched many blame aefw for killing corals because they didn't think they could dip from the display. In the end it was their unstable ta that was killing the acros.
Your double post had a reply saying you must be diligent to eradicate aefw this way, which is so true. They will hide behind corals you can't move easy or see behind and lay eggs, like they know where you can see. They are sneaky evil little worms. But it can be done fairly easy once you get the process down and are willing to spend the time and effort each week. You must dip on time each week and dip every single acropora and scrape off any encrusted acro bases on the main rockwork.

And for the newer people reading...
Birdsnest, stylophora, poculipora, and montipora are not acropora and don't need to be dipped. But a Millepora is an acropora and needs to be dipped. If you have been collecting acropora and don't kown about pests do your research. Pests will come from hobbies just as much as wild or maricultures corals. Well known "trusted collectors" who constantly sell from their tanks on these forums I have had send me aefw on frags and act like it's no big deal. Just because you pay high dollar for a "high end" collector name doesn't mean it's pest free. Sometimes the money overpowers people's judgement, or they just don't care.

 

[reefmutt]

Yes there is no need to qt. Just dip each coral once a week for 5 or more weeks depending on the infestation. Leave the rocks in the tank. Be careful using Bayer on so many corals. I would try revive or even melafix because they won't poison your water.
A good tip is to use a two stage stones system with so many acros. Buy three small tanks and use one for a dip of as many corals as you can fit. Line them up in order of time they were added so you don't burn any corals to death. Then rinse each piece of in the middle tank violently to get all worms detached. Use the third tank as a clean tank to inspect for eggs and hold the acros for placement. Make sure to scrape the eggs off in the middle rinse tank.

Aefw are sneaky so make sure you check every hole and crevice of each colony. If the colony is to infested and has eggs all over it in places you can't see or get to I would frag it up and keep the good parts. The object is to clean the I tested corals as best you can for the week before you start your dipping. That means looking at every piece you have and understanding how bad the flatworms have spread. Check every colony and dip any with bite marks or eggs and scrape all eggs. Do this and it will help during your weekly dips. Don't skip even a day! I dipped every 6 days and added a couple weeks to make sure. Good luck!

I agree melafix was very effective and gentle. I switched up between melafix and revive because after week three I found new eggs because I dipped a few days late or wasn't dipping well enough. I didn't want them to become used to the revive dip if it is even possible, just made me more comfortable.
It's defiantly a thing that takes practice. Finding the right time spans the certain acros can handle being dipped for and looking for eggs in larger colonies. Making sure to rinse very well is a must because they don't always fall off. I like to tell people to spot dip affected Colo is for a week or two if they are really hit hard. That way they can heal some before being subjected to weekly dips. Dipping from the display tank ime was the best way unless you have a qt that is stable and been running healthy acros. Quickly setting up a qt tank to house acros is a surefire way to kill them and I have watched many blame aefw for killing corals because they didn't think they could dip from the display. In the end it was their unstable ta that was killing the acros.
Your double post had a reply saying you must be diligent to eradicate aefw this way, which is so true. They will hide behind corals you can't move easy or see behind and lay eggs, like they know where you can see. They are sneaky evil little worms. But it can be done fairly easy once you get the process down and are willing to spend the time and effort each week. You must dip on time each week and dip every single acropora and scrape off any encrusted acro bases on the main rockwork.

And for the newer people reading...
Birdsnest, stylophora, poculipora, and montipora are not acropora and don't need to be dipped. But a Millepora is an acropora and needs to be dipped. If you have been collecting acropora and don't kown about pests do your research. Pests will come from hobbies just as much as wild or maricultures corals. Well known "trusted collectors" who constantly sell from their tanks on these forums I have had send me aefw on frags and act like it's no big deal. Just because you pay high dollar for a "high end" collector name doesn't mean it's pest free. Sometimes the money overpowers people's judgement, or they just don't care.

This is brilliant, comprehensive and totally on the money.
I would carefully pay attention to every detail.
Very nice piper!

Having a heavily stocked sps tank with aefw, I am no longer able to remove and dip everything. I have a good 30-40 carribean peppermint shrimp in my tank which won't eradicate the flatworms, but do an excellent job at controlling the population by being extremely efficient at finding and eating the aefw eggs..

 

[Piper27]

Great to know your having success with using the Caribbean peppermints! How often do you have to baste your acros with them helping out? Are there only a few flat worms that fly off when you baste an affected colony? Will the peppermints from that area also help out with glass anemones?
Got a link to your tank thread? I would like to read it, I think I read it a while back but not sure.

 

[reefmutt]

Great to know your having success with using the Caribbean peppermints! How often do you have to baste your acros with them helping out? Are there only a few flat worms that fly off when you baste an affected colony? Will the peppermints from that area also help out with glass anemones?
Got a link to your tank thread? I would like to read it, I think I read it a while back but not sure.

I first heard about peppermints as a prevention for aefws from Olddude's second totm article. He mentioned that he had aefws and to combat the problem, he added an army of them and never had a problem again...
When I added my army, I was totally infested with aptasia and only suspected I had aefw. They eradicated the aptasia in no time. Many months later I spotted a flatworm and the odd bite mark. Whatever corals I can remove, I do and dip in bayer.
I can't really remove most of the bigger (still relatively small) colonies anymore and I have not had to do any basting yet.
I really don't see much indication that they are still in the tank but I'm pretty sure there are a few.
On occasion, I'll see bite marks on a coral and then they will heal and the coral is fine..
Many years ago my old tank for infected with aefw and I pulled all the acros out and qt'd them in a poorly conceived system. I lost many of the corals. After that, I clipped and dipped everything.
This time around, I still clip and dip but I just didn't have the tear down or at system in me so I'm hoping the peps will do the job. I really think hey are pretty good at egg eating in particular. I suspect adults may be able to travel from one colony to another by catching a ride in the currents but not sure about that.
I have seen them eat actual flatworms as well but they don't seem to hunt them down like they do the eggs. What worries me the most is if a colony gets big and gets a bald spot in the middle, if eggs get deposited there, I'm not sure the peps will find them.. So far I don't have that problem.
One caveat with using peppermints is that it makes adding other ornamental anemones out of the question. I tried adding a carpet in two occasions and the peps went for it. I had to remove it before the peps did real damage.
My thread is 'learning/rebuilding from my epic fail' in the sps forum. It ain't a short read anymore!

 

[Reel North]

Are those just regular peppermint shrimp?

 

[reefmutt]

Caribbean peppermint shrimp. They are more 'reef safe' than the other type of peppermint shrimp.
I'm not sure where the other peppermint shrimp come from.. Maybe Indo..
Peppermint shrimp, in general, will eat fleshy corals when very hungry. I had to remove all of my acans. Not to mention not being able to keep anemones.
The non Carribean peppermints are worse coral eaters..

 

[Piper27]

Wow great use of the shrimp! It's amazing you don't have to baste at all! I would say once things become large enough I think the random basting would keep the larger colonies in check well. I wouldn't have any worries if I were you from what you shared .

I think people create a stigma around acro eating flatworms unknowingly. People that sell corals have trouble admiting they have them when they pop up unexpectedly. And people who haven't dealt with them tell others they are the worst pest ever and you can't get rid of them. Once you have dealt with them reefing is so much more fun, or once you have researched and understand how to deal with pests. I watch a lot of people who dip to the point of killing new frags because of the fear of adding a pest. They won't touch wild or mariculture corals because "all of them are covered in pests and the survival rate is so low". Which is so untrue. I get the most enjoyment out of wild and mariculture corals. I think having all the same named corals everyone else has isn't really that fun. Experimenting is the best part of reefing.

Someone should get a mod to combine the two threads here.

 

[Myka]

I have a good 30-40 carribean peppermint shrimp in my tank which won't eradicate the flatworms, but do an excellent job at controlling the population by being extremely efficient at finding and eating the aefw eggs..

I first heard about peppermints as a prevention for aefws from Olddude's second totm article. He mentioned that he had aefws and to combat the problem, he added an army of them and never had a problem again...

Caribbean peppermint shrimp. They are more 'reef safe' than the other type of peppermint shrimp.

Matt, are these just Lysmata boggessi you're referring to? L. wurdemanni are considered the best Aiptasia easters, but they are definitely more aggressive. I'm wondering if it's not so much the collection location, but the species?? Greg's (oldude) account was the first time I ever heard of a correlation between AEFW and Peppermint Shrimp. They have a hard time surviving in my tanks though - I like wrasses, and wrasses find Peppermints quite tasty! :facepalm:

Someone should get a mod to combine the two threads here.

I was wondering where my first post went! :lol:

 

[gcp123]

Thanks for all the brilliant suggestions and advises especially from Piper27. I have learned a lot from this thread.

Instead of tearing down the tank and dip every week, someone has suggested for me to use a powerhead to blow at the sps every other day and let the fishes have a quick snack on the aefw that has detached from the sps. Will this method completely radicate the aefw if done persistently?



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[Piper27]

Doubtful it will. I have seen one or two say it's worked. Maybe with a lot of time, small frags and colonies and a large population of fish that will eat the floaters. But I would say take care of it while you can. Lots of people live with them though, just harder to trade and sell frags and you will have to do weekly if not daily work to keep them in check. Ime basting took a long time as well be wise if you don't get every angle some will stay attached. They also go through bloom stages where batches of eggs are laid in areas you can't et to and if you skip basting for a while during that time it's a huge pain and acros get eaten pretty good. Maybe try some peppermints? Would be nice to have more people's experience with them.
In the end it's all up to how much work you want to do and what your overall goal is.

 

[reefmutt]

Matt, are these just Lysmata boggessi you're referring to? L. wurdemanni are considered the best Aiptasia easters, but they are definitely more aggressive. I'm wondering if it's not so much the collection location, but the species?? Greg's (oldude) account was the first time I ever heard of a correlation between AEFW and Peppermint Shrimp. They have a hard time surviving in my tanks though - I like wrasses, and wrasses find Peppermints quite tasty! :facepalm:

Mindy, I couldn't, with confidence give you the scientific name.. There is a third pep shrimp, L. rathbunae which is also from the carribean and apparently identical to wurdemanni..
I suspect you are correct about collection. I just make sure the came from the carribean..
Big wrasse will definitely be a problem for the smaller shrimps, for sure!

Gcp123, the power head method will control them well, especially once the fish stop being scared of your hand and pump but I'm not sure it is a 'cure'

 

[Myka]

Mindy, I couldn't, with confidence give you the scientific name.. There is a third pep shrimp, L. rathbunae which is also from the carribean and apparently identical to wurdemanni..
I suspect you are correct about collection. I just make sure the came from the carribean..
Big wrasse will definitely be a problem for the smaller shrimps, for sure!

There are several "Peppermint" species - I think 6 or 8. Rathbunae look a lot like Wurdemanni, but with a good eye you can see the difference. Some individuals it is tough to determine though.