hybrid vigor

[Kathy55g]

So, right now I have juveniles from two different broodstock. My friend's broodstock is lighter in color and some individuals from each spawn have lordosis (shortened spinal column) and one or two had jaw deformities. My own broodstock have no deformities but are a deeper color. It is clearly easy to tell them apart. The two broodstocks have different parents possibly from different regions of the world. I think my friend's broodstock are siblings, as I also think my own are siblings to each other.

So the question is, if I kept back a perfect specimen from the spawn of my friend's broodstock, and mated it with one of the spawn of my own broodstock, would the resulting fish be healthier as a result, or would I just be propagating the "bad gene" of the friend's broodstock that brought on the deformities? Would I be strengthening, or weakening, the resultant fish line?

They would not be true hybrids, since both parents would be ocellaris, but they would be more genetically mixed than the products of siblings as things stand now.

What do you think?

 

[Luis A M]

I think you shouldn´t bother with that,Kathy.What you say is valid for guppy breeders with hundreds of brother to sister mating in their bckground.Not such thing with marines yet.The things you see are not due to inbreeding.

 

[David M]

More or less agree with Luis, it will be a while before you have to worry about inbreeding your stock. Seahorse breeders I know have gone 4-5 generations with one line and seen no problems. OTOH I really dislike many of the B&W ocellaris I see these days, the body composition is all wrong. They don't look like ocellaris, they are long and skinny. I am assuming this may be due to excessive inbreeding? I'm guessing this because there certainly doesn't seem to be a regular supply of fresh blood comming in from the wild. In any case I don't think you will have problems going a few generations with them.

 

[colby]

Though I am certainly no geneticist nor marine biologist (though I am working on it in college ...) I would have to say I see Luis and David's point and basically agree with them. I do not think that you would see issues with inbreeding in the first generation however I do think that if you mixed broodstock in ways they coud be considered "superior" in that their genes with be very "fresh" from the intraspecific hybridyizng.
Howver if I were you I would try and set up a sibling pair of both yours and his offspring, as you never know what hidden recessive traits they may be holding (funky striping etc...) that can only be exposed by breeding two of the carriers (brother and sister in this case...) Just some thoughts.. Best of luck...
BTW any chance you could post some pics of your babies and his...just curious...

Colby

 

[mwp]

FWIW outcrossing isn't usually a "bad" idea, but if the majority of the fish in the friend's brood are coming out deformed, I'd look for a different source of fresh blood...just my $0.02.

MP

 

[Kathy55g]

The majority are fine beautiful fish. Just a couple of wacky ones.

What i don't know is how many generations of brother sister matches produced the ones I have. How far back can it go? In the wild, do members of the same spawn associate with the same anemone?

 

[colby]

I think that a very cautious, reserved yet qualifying yes as far as your question regarding memebers of same spawn associating in same anemone. Given that clownfish have such short palegic periods, they don't get far. This is why we see such variation among species and such. It is all due to geographical speciation. That is why clownfish have such a small distribution as compared to say tangs which can be found everywhere thanks to their palegic larval period lasting weeks. So I would venture to say that yes in the wild I would think there are instances of sibling pairs etc...

Colby

 

[NicoleC]

Clowns also do not travel far in their lives, whereas most tangs do, which would have a greater affect on species variation, IMO.