Is lanthanum chloride the best way to remove PO4?

[SAZ03]

Ive read the first few pages and the last few pages of many threads on differnt methods to remove phosphates and have been searching for what seems like days on what to do about high phospates. I see that in 2006ish it was all about GFO and calcium chloride. Then in like 2010ish it was all about algae scrubbers. Now it might be that lanthanum chloride is the way to go.
ugh.

I am hoping there is someone who has read through this to its entirety that can break it down for us new to this thread and topic. I am cycling a new 110 gallon tank and my phosphates are above 2ppm. Short story is that I likely have PO4 leaching from my base rock (that I reincarnated with bleach and muratic acid). I have a new tank and new dry sand (Caribea special grade). I put a raw peice of market shrimp (raw and fresh not frozen) in to cycle but once I read above 2ppm on my hanah checker. I pulled that shrimp out and now 3 days later I am still reading 2ppm. Ive been doing my homework but it is really hard to catch up and filter out the right information because the trends change so fast and there is so much off-topic discussion. See, I can demonstrate by my questions that I have been studying this like crazy but seriously people, lets try to stay on topic or this whole site will be unusable sooner than later. I surely hope I dont get banned for saying all this cause I mean well. :wavehand:

1. Is lanthanum chloride a) a proven method to remove phosphates or b) a way to bring them down and maintain low levels?
2. Is lanthanum chloride safe for the tank inhabitants?
3. What is the ideal (gallons of RO)/(lanthanum chloride) ratio for mixing with top off water?
4. What is the ideal drip (dose) ratio?
5. In basic terms, is the goal to get the phosphates to bind to something in order to remove them by precipitation and finally out of the tank by rinsing the 10um socks?
6. How often do we change the 10um socks our for new ones?
7. How do we know when to clean the 10um socks out and by what method?
8. is this a long term commitment to dosing lanthanum chloride?

 

[discocarp]

New rock, new sand, new tank. You're still cycling. I'd be tempted to just try one big water change and see if the phosphates stay down - or even just wait without the water change yet. You're going to get an algae cycle soon. It's inevitable. I'd be tempted to run without lights for awhile.

After bleaching and acid washing the rock, I would not jump right to the lanthanum. You really don't know if it's the rock or not. It could be the sand. It could be the shrimp. It could be a combination.

IMO you are on information overload right now. Don't feel bad, it's really, really common in this hobby.

 

[SAZ03]

New rock, new sand, new tank. You're still cycling. I'd be tempted to just try one big water change and see if the phosphates stay down - or even just wait without the water change yet. You're going to get an algae cycle soon. It's inevitable. I'd be tempted to run without lights for awhile.

After bleaching and acid washing the rock, I would not jump right to the lanthanum. You really don't know if it's the rock or not. It could be the sand. It could be the shrimp. It could be a combination.

IMO you are on information overload right now. Don't feel bad, it's really, really common in this hobby.

Thank you for your kind advice. I really do appreciate it and yes I am on information overload. I will take your advice and try a water change. I agree I dont want to start throwing money at it. I need to observe it and monitor it. Im going out today to get another test kit. I am using the Hanah checker and one reagent yesterday said 0.54ppm, another said 1.14 and another said 2.3ppm. I decided to repeatedly check it since my first reading was 0.54ppm and I had consistently seen >2ppm for about a week. Im gonna try a API test kit today.

Is it a bad idea to even monitor phosphates during cycle? Am I panicking over nothing?

 

[discocarp]

I think you're probably panicking over nothing, but people do get phosphate problems. Having bleached and acid washed the rock I think you'd be best off waiting it out. That's what I'd do. It is not unusual to get some algae cycles when starting the tank, so don't freak out over those either **unless it starts looking really bad**. Feel free to post some pictures as it starts cycling so we can give you advice as you go. If you do it in this thread I'll get the post notifications and try to keep up.

I don't monitor anything during a cycle other than ammonia and nitrates, and sometimes not even those if I'm just planning on going slow and waiting anyway. With those phosphate readings all over the place I'm not even sure I'd do a water change yet. How long has the tank been running?

Just keep in mind starting with dead rock is slower than starting with liverock, but both work just fine in the end.

 

[bertoni]

Personally, I'd stop measuring everything except ammonia, temperature, and SG. You could do some water changes, if you like. They won't hurt, and might help.

 

[TankRazr]

Saz,

I would suss out a DIY ATS algae Turf Scrubber. They are dirt simple and can be done inexpensively (or expensively). You have nothing to lose via this route except a little bit of you time and a few bucks, but I think you will find the endeavor a rewarding experience.

I prefer them over LC, Bio Pellets and GFO. The are easy to put online and take off line at will with out any ramping up or worries about upsetting any inhabitants. IIRC both GFO and Bio Pellets have been known to kill things like clams for example.

LC binds phosphates which are then removed via mechanical filtration, which I guess you have already gathered based on your post.....and I have unwittingly killed two very old very large yellow tangs. They seem to be more susceptible to LC than anything else.

TR

 

[SAZ03]

Saz,

I would suss out a DIY ATS algae Turf Scrubber. They are dirt simple and can be done inexpensively (or expensively). You have nothing to lose via this route except a little bit of you time and a few bucks, but I think you will find the endeavor a rewarding experience.

I prefer them over LC, Bio Pellets and GFO. The are easy to put online and take off line at will with out any ramping up or worries about upsetting any inhabitants. IIRC both GFO and Bio Pellets have been known to kill things like clams for example.

LC binds phosphates which are then removed via mechanical filtration, which I guess you have already gathered based on your post.....and I have unwittingly killed two very old very large yellow tangs. They seem to be more susceptible to LC than anything else.

TR

oh wow...good to know. I purchased some Phosguard from the LFS. Going to get those levels down and have bee researching how I want to maintain low levels in the long run. I have read about algae scrubbers and might try that but right now I am leaning towards hooking up a dosing pump to my RKE and dosing Kalkwasser.

 

[bertoni]

Algae scrubbers can work, too, although they are more costly to run (lighting) and require a bit more manual effort than GFO or carbon dosing, in my opinion. The scrubbers likely generate a lot of live food, though.