Kessil vs Reefbreeders 2017

[Harbour]

Wrestling between Kessil 160we tuna blue vs Reefbreeders photon 24 v2.

Have searched the forums but much is outdated so thought I'd ask for current opinions...

Have a Mr. Agua 12 nano with minimalist aquascape. Dimensions: 35.4" x 8.3" x 9.4" Currently using orbit marine.

Opinions? Pros vs cons for my nano?

What would you choose and why? Disco effect? Shadowing? Color? Shimmer? Whatever you can add would be appreciated.

Thanks in advance,

Harbour

 

[LQT]

What's wrong with the Orbit Marine? At a depth of just 9.4" I would think that what you currently have would be perfect (and I usually don't say that about that particular fixture). The Photon V2 would have to be turned way down as you could easily fry everything with that shallow depth. Furthermore, you'd have excessive light bleed in the front of the tank and against the wall as the fixture is actually a hair wider than your tank at 8.5". If you go with an a160, you'd have to get 2 in order to cover the 35" length.

 

[Jeff4777]

I have the 24" v2 over a octopus tank (red light controllabilty is cool). It's nice but I can't turn the white up past like 5 because it's very intense.

Orbit marines on my seahorse tank and Def my least favorite light. Only have soft non stinging corals in there anyways.

Have 3 kessil 360we on my reef. Best lights hand down and they blow my mind every time I look at the tank..

 

[smatter]

I have the 24" v2 over a octopus tank (red light controllabilty is cool). It's nice but I can't turn the white up past like 5 because it's very intense.

Orbit marines on my seahorse tank and Def my least favorite light. Only have soft non stinging corals in there anyways.

Have 3 kessil 360we on my reef. Best lights hand down and they blow my mind every time I look at the tank..

Good it isn't just me then because my mind blows every time I look at my tank too! :beer: @OP if you don't mind some light spill and you aren't concerned with brightly lighting the ends of the tank one 160we would work.

 

[aznflyfisherman]

I would go with The reef breeder it will give you a lot better coverage for your tank size. Unless you planning to buy two a160 n a controller for it.

 

[Harbour]

Thanks a ton everyone!

Confirms some things I had been wondering, especially about coverage with one 160we.

Originally was going with the Kessil but then started hearing a lot of good stuff about reefbreeders!

Too many decisions when it comes to lighting choices! But choices are good - right?

Harbour

 

[xRAWRx28]

I actually have both on my 75 a reefbreeders 48" 2 kessils a350 e if I had to choose one it be the reefbreders just because of the spread and much less shadowing

 

[Harbour]

Thanks xRAWRx28! That's one of my concerns - coverage. Seems like I may need two of the kessil's plus a controller while the Reefbreeder has all that covered.

Harbour

 

[phasezero]

Depends what's more important to you. Coverage or color blending. I had the kessil A160 over a 20 gal long which is 30" in. length and it only lit the inner 16".

I saw the photon V2 at my LFS this past weekend and the color blending was just atrocious. It was extremely distracting to me to see a disco sand bed. If you have any surface agitation at all or any overhanging rocks it will look bad. So choose which is more important to you. Ideally I would pick two of the Kessil's.

 

[trueperc]

I personally have two A360WE over a 65 gallon RBTA and softie tank. I am actually in the process of selling them to buy the photon V2. Personally I find, yes Kessil have a great colour blend and shimmer, but are weak, have a terrible controller. Honestly with the A360we anyway the "blue" end of the spectrum is kind of disappointing. For sure nothing like a nice royal blue. The older A350 apparently had a better blue. To compare this 65 gallon is hooked in to the same system as my 300 gallon reef. I had kessils on it but the were really poor performers. I now have metal halides on it. The difference between the grow and size of opening of a RBTA between the two tanks is huge. The V2 seems like a good fit for the price and the fact you can get decent size fixtures. This is just my 2 Cents

 

[LQT]

I know we are all very passionate about lighting, but am I the only one that thinks going with a ReefBreeders on a 35.4" x 8.3" x 9.4" 12 gallon tank extreme overkill!?! Now if the OP were looking to upgrade tanks soon, I'd go ReefBreeders no question. But if not, then the Orbit Marine is fine, maybe the Orbit Pro...

 

[crazycolt42]

Depends what's more important to you. Coverage or color blending. I had the kessil A160 over a 20 gal long which is 30" in. length and it only lit the inner 16".

I saw the photon V2 at my LFS this past weekend and the color blending was just atrocious. It was extremely distracting to me to see a disco sand bed. If you have any surface agitation at all or any overhanging rocks it will look bad. So choose which is more important to you. Ideally I would pick two of the Kessil's.

Has anyone who has the photon V2 experienced this as well? I am on the fence about going with a cheaper LED option vs. all T5. Kessils either require too many for full coverage or supplemental T5's. Which for me, is a budget killer. However, the Chinese LED's and others like the photon V2 are much more affordable, but I agree that I would not like seeing separate colors on the sand bed. I have observed the A360, A160, and AI prime HD @ my local LFS, and I liked the looks of the 360 and HD26. One A160 had soooo much disco ball/shimmer effect on a 20g cube. It was way too distracting for my liking, and was much more obvious than two 360's on a 75g which had the shimmer, but not so extreme and distracting. Two a160's may not be as bad perhaps? Seems like a trade off b/t the photon and kessil. If you go with 3w LED's that are spread out, you get better coverage, but have color separation issues maybe. Go with a pendant style where the LED's are packed together with less spectrum variation, and you get good color blending, but more distracting shimmer (matter of opinion and taste) and less flexibility on what the overall color looks like? Does this seem to be the case?

 

[crazycolt42]

I know we are all very passionate about lighting, but am I the only one that thinks going with a ReefBreeders on a 35.4" x 8.3" x 9.4" 12 gallon tank extreme overkill!?! Now if the OP were looking to upgrade tanks soon, I'd go ReefBreeders no question. But if not, then the Orbit Marine is fine, maybe the Orbit Pro...

I am wondering the same. The OP hasn't ever really said why the change? Wondering what their dissatisfaction is with current Orbit marine?

 

[Harbour]

Crazycolt42 and others,

Reason for potential change... Just hear and see good things from the Kessils and reefbreeders. I think the orbit marine is only good for softies and LPS but not for SPS, due to the LED's only being 3 watts. Or at least I haven't seen an orbit marine tank with heavy SPS populations.

Would like to add SPS.

No upgrade in mind - did the 55 - twice, 20 long etc. Love nano's WAY better - for me. The nano was an upgrade!

Harbour

 

[LQT]

In most cases, I'd agree that the Orbit Marine is only suited for less light demanding corals. However, this is most often the case when people use them on tanks that are waaaay deeper and waaaay wider than what you're currently running. Because of the unique dimensions of your tank, specifically the 8.3" width and 9.4" depth, I don't think that growing SPS will be a problem for you at all. In addition, if you notice, most hardcore SPS keepers will end up supplementing their Kessils with T5s because of eventual shadowing, as their colonies mature. I'm not knocking Kessils at all, it's just the nature of LED point source lighting.

Again, in most cases, I don't often think Orbit Marines are suitable for SPS, but in your case, because of your specific tank dimensions, provided you keep a good environment with stable parameters, I think what you currently have could be very successful growing SPS. Also with the diode layout of that fixture and your tank dimensions, you won't have the shadowing issues that plague many puck style or single point source lighting SPS keepsers. I'd hate to see you waste your money on a new fixture that you could only run at less than 15% intensity when you'd be better served buying a dosing system or ATO (if you don't already have one) that will go further in helping you promotes stability in order to grow a successful SPS tank.

 

[Ron Reefman]

A couple of points.

The Kessil, and any point light source (like led fixtures that use pucks), have much better shimmer and much more serious shadowing under ledges and over hangs. Fixtures that have the leds in a spread out array like the Photon have less shimmer (I still have all I want though) and much less shadowing because the spread the light out similar (but not as good as t5 fluorescent fixtures).

As for the disco from the Photon and bad color at the LFS. The color is 100% adjustable with 6 channels of color control, so if the color looks bad at the LFS, that's on the LFS and not the fixture!

IMHO the red and green leds in most fixtures (especially arrays like the Photon) cause the disco and that's why I wanted more channels of color control. I don't even use the red or green channels. In a fixture like a Kessil or any 'puck' fixture, the reds and greens are so close to all the other leds they don't cause nearly as much 'disco effect'.

Personally, I like the led array spread out rather than single point source like a Kessil or a puck. That's why I have Reef Breeders Photon V2 fixtures. But that's just my aesthetic taste. Yours may be completely different. But neither one is 'better' for the coral. They all grow coral just fine.

 

[crazycolt42]

A couple of points.

The Kessil, and any point light source (like led fixtures that use pucks), have much better shimmer and much more serious shadowing under ledges and over hangs. Fixtures that have the leds in a spread out array like the Photon have less shimmer (I still have all I want though) and much less shadowing because the spread the light out similar (but not as good as t5 fluorescent fixtures).

As for the disco from the Photon and bad color at the LFS. The color is 100% adjustable with 6 channels of color control, so if the color looks bad at the LFS, that's on the LFS and not the fixture!

IMHO the red and green leds in most fixtures (especially arrays like the Photon) cause the disco and that's why I wanted more channels of color control. I don't even use the red or green channels. In a fixture like a Kessil or any 'puck' fixture, the reds and greens are so close to all the other leds they don't cause nearly as much 'disco effect'.

Personally, I like the led array spread out rather than single point source like a Kessil or a puck. That's why I have Reef Breeders Photon V2 fixtures. But that's just my aesthetic taste. Yours may be completely different. But neither one is 'better' for the coral. They all grow coral just fine.

Hey Ron, thanks for all you provide on here. I have read many of your post's and it has been very helpful. By not using the red and green, are you able to avoid color separation on the sand bed?

Harbour, good to know. I could see being proactive and addressing the light source before adding SPS. Smart! What you think You might do? I can tell you that the A160 had crazy amounts of shimmer @ the LFS. It was unnatural looking, but it was only one on a 20g cube. I have a 60x24x24 with plans to do a mixed reef. If I can avoid the color separation, I will go with the Photon and T5's. Your thread here has been helpful!

 

[Ssteve]

Also take a look at some of Adams sticks over at battlecorals. He uses the photon v2's(and even some v1's) and has killer results.

I think the biggest thing with leds is coverage. I've run kessils before and loved them but I double suggested fixtures. I ran two 350's with four bulbs of t5's over a 36x18x22 and had great results.

My current 120g tank will be getting two a150's, a photon v2 48 and two bulbs of t5's.

If you plan to run kessils I would maybe throw a a80 between the two 160's

 

[Harbour]

Great info! Now I'm thinking about trying an easy SPS and with my orbit first. From coral placement to light could be as little as 4 inches. Then consider other light options if things get dicey.

Harbour

 

[Ssteve]

I recommend getting any equipment that has a direct affect on the carols as soon as you can. If you keep swapping lights, flow, salts, two part etc it will slow your progress down substantially. Ideally you want to get it dialed in and leave it alone.