LA selling "Hawaiian Harlequin Shrimp" scam

[Calappidae]

I get diver's den alerts in my email, and one alert i overlooked was one for a pair of hawaiian harlequin shrimp.

The hawaiian harlequin shrimp were priced for exactly $299.99.. but here's the kicker,

These are not even hawaiian harlequins.. LA just sold regular H. Elegans for $300 dollars to some guy who didn't know otherwise.

http://www.liveaquaria.com/diversde...ref=4282&subref=AI&cmpid=E-_-TR-_-DDN-_-PRDCT

"Ok, so how do we know those are not infact hawaiian?"

There are numerous characteristics that Hawaiians have over regulars in terms of color. H. Elegans, and common H. Pictas can be very color polymorphic based on environment, usually remaining at a pink/blue tint, however Hawaiian H. Picta are not are all. Infact all Hawaiian .pictas are infact the same color pattern. This color pattern is purplish dots, purple lines on their legs darker than usual harlies, with orange tinted antenna, basically this:

This is what LA tried selling instead.

Comparing them, there is no simularity. Hawaiians do not have this color morph, nor is there any odds of both specimens in a pair sharing it. These were not collected in hawaii, and whoever labeled them needs to double check who their collector is cause somebody clearly had no idea who they ordered from.

A Hawaiian Harlequin is infact at the adverage market value of $300 (pair), but for regular harlequins anything over $110 is a rip off. Whoever spent $300 dollars on this pair should ask for a refund and aware LA of their misidentifaction.

The only reason I'm posting this here is because A) I don't want other people here falling for scams like these, I'd like people to know how to properly identify species and select wisely, and B) the LA threads are closed for public posting here so i can't really write feeback to them personally to let them know. I hope that guy eventually realizes and gets the refund he deserves as scams like these are just pitiful and just emphasize how little knowledge a big chain company knows on their lifestock.

You can click the link above to see the actual page listed on March 9th 2016. If the image fails to load just click view larger image.

 

[Dkuhlmann]

I think you calling LA a very well respected seller of aquatic animals a scam or anything even remotely similar is just plain WRONG! LA would not risk their reputation on something as trivial as a $300 item being intentionally misidentified on their site.

If you have concerns that this was sold as something it's not then by all means bring it to their attention, but to say the things you said in your post is in my opinion just not cool :hammer: There are better ways to get your point across.

 

[Calappidae]

I think you calling LA a very well respected seller of aquatic animals a scam or anything even remotely similar is just plain WRONG! LA would not risk their reputation on something as trivial as a $300 item being intentionally misidentified on their site.

If you have concerns that this was sold as something it's not then by all means bring it to their attention, but to say the things you said in your post is in my opinion just not cool :hammer: There are better ways to get your point across.

I haven't called the company a scam (although truth be told there are numerous cases reported on RC with misidentifaction and false info), however when it comes to the case of purchasing "hawaiian harlequin shrimp", a very expensive and rare specimen to search for, LA is not exactly the most reliable company to trust with getting them in.

Whoever purchased this pair was indeed scammed of atleast $200 due to misidentifaction, and one that is very easy to identify in the first place.

I'm not that concerned about LA's reputation considering it's already down the drain around here in general. I don't think it could get worse to be honest, people compare them to petco often.

The only compliment I can say is that they definitely have light hearted customer service and they'll handle the issue, but whether it's LA or DD they still need to be a little more knowledgable when it comes to stuff like this. (I can understand misidentifaction on fish but hawaiian harlequin? They can just look at where they were imported from and there you go! Just looking at them and they're not from hawaii unless there's some weird migration but i doubt that possibility.)

 

[Bongo Shrimp]

Ok so theres one big problem with your argument- H. elegans is an outdated synonym of H. picta and H. picta is the only species of Harlequin Shrimp.

The genus Hymenocera now only contains one species (Hymenocera picta) after long being suspected that the "two" species were in fact one with different color variations. Furthermore, if you search sealifebase, eol, and BOLD, you will see that there simply is no listing for Hymenocera elegans because it is no longer an excepted subtaxon of the genus.

It's true that the different color variety is usually found in Hawaii and advertised specifically as "Hawaiian Harlequin Shrimp", but it's possible that both morphs are found there. The shrimp sold on diver's den were most likely harvested in Hawaii, are indeed H. picta and since they are from Hawaii, inherently cost more due to the costs added to all Hawaiian marine life (much higher shipping, less are collected overall...).

I see what you are getting at in that usually the other color morph sells for more money, but they were certainly not scamming anyone in regards to the information provided assuming they were indeed collected in Hawaii.

I think you should try to do more research before going out and suggesting that a well respected company has no idea what they are talking about and is "scamming" their customers.

http://www.marinespecies.org/aphia.php?p=taxdetails&id=210555

 

[Dkuhlmann]

My point was, How do you know they were intentionally deceiving with the sale of that particular Harley? I seriously doubt they would do something like that. Can it happen? Sure it can and because most people myself included have no clue in the difference between them as you do. Instead of bashing them why not call them up and bring it to their attention?

I've got a better idea... Since you live in MI lets go catch some Walleye :thumbsup: Walleye fishing here in Iowa SUCKS!!!!!

 

[ThRoewer]

Well, technically not a scam, but they sell also "mated pairs" of skunk cleaners (Lysmata amboinensis) and fire shrimp (L. debelius) for more what 2 single of these would cost. Yet, two singles is pretty much all you need to get a "mated pair" of these species.
I would say that is making money off the uninformed.

 

[homer1475]

Well, technically not a scam, but they sell also "mated pairs" of skunk cleaners (Lysmata amboinensis) and fire shrimp (L. debelius) for more what 2 single of these would cost. Yet, two singles is pretty much all you need to get a "mated pair" of these species.
I would say that is making money off the uninformed.

Every LFS I've been to including online do this also. Buying an already mated pair is sometimes a lot easier then buying 2 of the same species and hoping they become mated. When in reality, if you do buy 2 of the same species, most times one will kill the other long before they become mated.

I honestly don't see how that's making money off the uninformed. Buying at a slightly higher price 2 fish that are known to be a mated pair, or buying 2(which usually end up being 3 or 4 in the long run) and hoping they become mated before one kills the other.

 

[albano]

I honestly don't see how that's making money off the uninformed. Buying at a slightly higher price 2 fish that are known to be a mated pair...

I don't believe for a second, that all the 'mated pairs' of fish that are available, anywhere, are actually mated pairs... IMO, the chance that the fish were actually caught together and kept together through out the entire 'chain of custody' is very slim at best.
I'd bet that if the shipper has 10 males and 10 females available, that they are offered as 10 MATED pairs...

 

[sde1500]

I don't believe for a second, that all the 'mated pairs' of fish that are available, anywhere, are actually mated pairs... IMO, the chance that the fish were actually caught together and kept together through out the entire 'chain of custody' is very slim at best.
I'd bet that if the shipper has 10 males and 10 females available, that they are offered as 10 MATED pairs...

LA maybe, but DD, they house the fish for a while. So I could see them being able to get some fish paired up in that time frame.

 

[ThRoewer]

Every LFS I've been to including online do this also. Buying an already mated pair is sometimes a lot easier then buying 2 of the same species and hoping they become mated. When in reality, if you do buy 2 of the same species, most times one will kill the other long before they become mated.

I honestly don't see how that's making money off the uninformed. Buying at a slightly higher price 2 fish that are known to be a mated pair, or buying 2(which usually end up being 3 or 4 in the long run) and hoping they become mated before one kills the other.

Two of these shrimp will pretty much always make a "pair" as they are hermaphrodites - there is very little risk of one killing the other. And that risk remains even with a "mated pair".

I've bought a mated pair of Stenopus shrimp where the female viciously attacked the male. It took her a few days of calming down before I could add the male back in to her.
The pairs I put together myself never did this.

But Stenopus are fixed sex shrimp with clearly defined males and females and not hermaphrodites like Lysmata shrimp, which makes all the difference.

Fish are a bit of a different story, but that's not what this is about.

 

[Jeff4777]

I seriously doubt Liveaquaria is "scamming" for 300 bucks. Common dude. Either its mislabeled on accident or it really was collected from Hawaii. That's that.

 

[ThRoewer]

I doubt that LiveAquaria intentionally mislabels the origin of animals.
But LiveAquaria isn't collecting themselves, they buy their livestock from various sources.
They may have bought these shrimp from a Hawaiian source, but that doesn't necessarily mean they were collected in Hawaiian waters. Their source may have imported them from somewhere else.