Led Lighting, really reef adequate?

[Johnseye]

My point exactly.

An ATI fixture with Blue Plus and Coral Plus removes lighting as a variable.

250w Radiums remove lighting as a variable.

When you show me an LED setup that comes with that certainty out of the box at a reasonable price point, I'll buy you one.

Variety is the spice of life. Some people like plug and play. Some people like to tweak. Just like Scott Walker putting American cheese on his Philly cheese steak. Some like wiz, some like American and some like provolone.

We could also get into a discussion about T5 spectrums like ABS, PP, actinic or if Geismann makes better target spectrum bulbs than ATI. Or we could talk about 20k vs 14k MH. These conversations have been had.

 

[jminick2]

But half the reason people buy LEDs is the customisation, not for plug and play. Being able to set your lights to ramp up and down, switching between colour spectrums etc, all benefits of LED.
I used to run my Hydra 52s at 10k in the early morning, moving into 14k during the day and 20k late afternoon, then ramping down into moonlights.
When you show me a MH fixture that can do that I'll buy you one

u know, a ramp up/down does diddly squat for corals. if you are buying lights for that you are going about it the wrong way.
there's a reason the ecotech template labeled "high growth" has all the lights coming on and going directly to 100% within like 10 min.

I know this is a personal preference and I respect that but it does nothing for corals. the only legit reason I have seen for a ramp up was someone stated their mandrin was able to feed more successfully because pods start to come out early.

 

[TylerHaworth]

I buy my equipment to grow colorful coral and/or make my life easier...

None of the features you mentioned do either, while adding complexity and room for error.

This is why there are a thousand threads just like this... There is no template for LED use that removes lighting from the discussion if a hobbiest is having X,Y, or Z problem.

 

[Perth_reefer]

u know, a ramp up/down does diddly squat for corals. if you are buying lights for that you are going about it the wrong way.

Of course it does nothing for corals, it's purely for aesthetics. But thats why we keep reef tanks right? We don't pull coral and fish out of their natural habitat to improve their lives do we! It's for our own pleasure. Running LEDs at a sufficient level for coral growth during the day is obviously necessary, outside of that photoperiod it doesn't matter if the lights go straight off or ramp down/up to mimic sunset/sunrise. Personally I really like that time, my MP40s ramp down, the lights dim to moonlights over a couple of hours, it's very peaceful and my favourite time to view my tank. I'm not sure why someone wanting that feature for their tank is going about it the wrong way?

I buy my equipment to grow colorful coral and/or make my life easier...

So replacing T5 tubes every 9 months is less work than spending an hour setting up your LEDs when you first get them?

 

[TylerHaworth]

Variety is the spice of life. Some people like plug and play. Some people like to tweak. Just like Scott Walker putting American cheese on his Philly cheese steak. Some like wiz, some like American and some like provolone.

We could also get into a discussion about T5 spectrums like ABS, PP, actinic or if Geismann makes better target spectrum bulbs than ATI. Or we could talk about 20k vs 14k MH. These conversations have been had.

Variety is awesome, until it causes you trouble... I could have two girlfriends and flirt with disaster or just have one and still get the job done without (most of) the stress.

The difference is that 14k halides or 20k halides or giesemann bulbs or ATI bulbs all grow and color coral...

 

[jminick2]

Of course it does nothing for corals, it's purely for aesthetics. But thats why we keep reef tanks right? We don't pull coral and fish out of their natural habitat to improve their lives do we! It's for our own pleasure. Running LEDs at a sufficient level for coral growth during the day is obviously necessary, outside of that photoperiod it doesn't matter if the lights go straight off or ramp down/up to mimic sunset/sunrise. Personally I really like that time, my MP40s ramp down, the lights dim to moonlights over a couple of hours, it's very peaceful and my favourite time to view my tank. I'm not sure why someone wanting that feature for their tank is going about it the wrong way?



So replacing T5 tubes every 9 months is less work than spending an hour setting up your LEDs when you first get them?

it's the wrong way because people think that because they are mimicking sunrise sunset that they are doing it right. when in reality the corals benefit more from just straight 10k light for X amount of hours a day. LIKE I SAID tho if it's your personal preference that's fine by me, you aren't hurting anything.

 

[TylerHaworth]

So replacing T5 tubes every 9 months is less work than spending an hour setting up your LEDs when you first get them?

What settings on a Radion(or whatever fixture) do I use that a consensus agrees will work so well that when I have burnt tips, or browning, or bleaching... That nobody looks at the lights as a potential cause for the malady?

And I mean exact, specific numbers.

 

[Johnseye]

Variety is awesome, until it causes you trouble... I could have two girlfriends and flirt with disaster or just have one and still get the job done without (most of) the stress.

The difference is that 14k halides or 20k halides or giesemann bulbs or ATI bulbs all grow and color coral...

So you would never run T5 with MH or LED with T5? Do you eat the same thing for every meal every day? Sounds like prison. Comparing lighting to multiple girlfriends is interesting. Those questions are rhetorical. No need to respond.

 

[Perth_reefer]

it's the wrong way because people think that because they are mimicking sunrise sunset think they are doing it right. when in reality the corals benefit more from just straight 10k light for X amount of hours a day. LIKE I SAID tho if it's your personal preference that's fine by me, you aren't hurting anything.

I'm not sure anyone thinks just because they ramp up and down their lighting is perfect. You still obviously need to hit the coral with enough light during the day. Not everyone likes the look of 10K either, personally I don't like it and it's not the only spectrum that grows coral. If it wasn't for the ramp up/down feature I'd be running plain T5s instead of an LED/T5 hybrid........maybe I'm doing it wrong though

 

[Perth_reefer]

What settings on a Radion(or whatever fixture) do I use that a consensus agrees will work so well that when I have burnt tips, or browning, or bleaching... That nobody looks at the lights as a potential cause for the malady?

And I mean exact, specific numbers.

I've never run Radions so you're asking the wrong guy! However I've run Hydra52s and I used the presets for 10k/14k/20k. was very happy with my growth and colouration. If you don't have the patience to set up LEDs correctly then MH or T5 is the way to go. However people that do spend the time setting them up correctly can grow awesome reef tanks which easily match MH or T5.

 

[jminick2]

I'm not sure anyone thinks just because they ramp up and down their lighting is perfect. You still obviously need to hit the coral with enough light during the day. Not everyone likes the look of 10K either, personally I don't like it and it's not the only spectrum that grows coral. If it wasn't for the ramp up/down feature I'd be running plain T5s instead of an LED/T5 hybrid........maybe I'm doing it wrong though

lol you of all people dont think there is people who dont think that???? you know dang well out of all the ways you could program a light wrong that this could be the thought process of a new guy starting out??

I don't like it either which is why I run 20k but I'm not gonna sit here and argue that 20k grows corals faster than 10k because it doesn't and growth represents coral health more than anything.

 

[TylerHaworth]

So you would never run T5 with MH or LED with T5? Do you eat the same thing for every meal every day? Sounds like prison. Comparing lighting to multiple girlfriends is interesting. Those questions are rhetorical. No need to respond.

I've never said I won't run LEDs ever, I'm saying I won't run them until I know they won't cause any extra problems.

I absolutely love the idea of reduced energy costs, reduced heat transfer, small size, and lack of maintenance. Those, however, are secondary to my main goal of having a beautiful reef tank. When LED's deliver the certainty that MH/T5 do, I will swap immediately.

 

[Perth_reefer]

lol you of all people dont think there is people who dont think that???? you know dang well out of all the ways you could program a light wrong that this could be the thought process of a new guy starting out??

I don't like it either which is why I run 20k but I'm not gonna sit here and argue that 20k grows corals faster than 10k because it doesn't and growth represents coral health more than anything.

There are plenty of people out there that don't set up LEDs the right way, but that is more often than not because they set them to what looks 'pretty' and not what is best for coral growth/colouration. Ramping features have nothing to do with that. Once your 8/10/12 hour, whatever you use photoperiod is done your corals have consumed as much light as they can, outside of this time ramping schedules have no affect whatsoever so can't be held accountable for poor coral health.

10K is the optimum for coral growth, however as I said before we're not honestly in the hobby for the benefit of the corals are we, otherwise they'd still be in the ocean. We set up lighting in a way that promotes coral growth and is good to look at. There is nothing wrong with that and this can be achieved with MH, T5 or LEDs (with or without ramping)

 

[Perth_reefer]

I've never said I won't run LEDs ever, I'm saying I won't run them until I know they won't cause any extra problems.

I absolutely love the idea of reduced energy costs, reduced heat transfer, small size, and lack of maintenance. Those, however, are secondary to my main goal of having a beautiful reef tank. When LED's deliver the certainty that MH/T5 do, I will swap immediately.

LEDs do deliver the certainty that MH and T5 does. I could point you to some amazing reef tanks on here running LEDs.

 

[jminick2]

how much light can a coral Consume and how many hours does that take?

 

[Hitch08]

Variety is awesome, until it causes you trouble... I could have two girlfriends and flirt with disaster or just have one and still get the job done without (most of) the stress.

Until I read that, I was following your argument. Sorry, lost all credibility.

:lolspin:

 

[Perth_reefer]

how much light can a coral Consume and how many hours does that take?

Well the achievable DLI to simulate a tropical day in our tanks is about 16mol. So working on average water surface PAR of 550 you'd have to illuminate your tank for a photoperiod of about 8 hours to achieve this. Of course every coral has different requirements so some adjustments will most likely have to be made.

 

[TylerHaworth]

LEDs do deliver the certainty that MH and T5 does. I could point you to some amazing reef tanks on here running LEDs.

I need three 250w Radiums turned on for about 8 hours per day to light my 6x2x2 and grow anything I want...

Until LED reaches that level of simplicity I'm not interested... I have enough problems to address.

Until I read that, I was following your argument. Sorry, lost all credibility.

:lolspin:

Ok

 

[Perth_reefer]

I need three 250w Radiums turned on for about 8 hours per day to light my 6x2x2 and grow anything I want...

Until LED reaches that level of simplicity I'm not interested... I have enough problems to address.

That's fine, as I said some people just don't have the patience to set up LEDs or just want to take the simple option.

LEDs have reached that level of simplicity though, you realise that right? You hang the lights, adjust the settings to what is required for your specific tank and turn them on for 8 hours a day.....

 

[TylerHaworth]

So let's say 6x2x2 SPS tank... I need like 6 Hydra 52's, plug them in, select 20k for x time of day and then I'm done?