LED viability question...

[SquidHC]

Ok, so I LOVE new technology for my tank just as much as anyone else. I also love lower bulb replacement costs and electric bills. Good for the wallet, and the planet. But in all the excitement over LED's, does anyone have any links to threads where people have experienced good results of coral growth and coloration over an extended period of time? All I've been able to find is "look at pics of this cool fixture I just bought". Thats great and all, but long term? I just want to see some solid results before I sell my T5 fixture and dive head first into an LED fixture.

Thanks in advance.

 

[L98-Z]

Plenty of people have had good luck with LEDs. I've seen a few on here, a search should be able to find them. The real issue is the upfront price, everything else favors the LEDs.

 

[SAZAMA]

wondering the same thing. also has anyone measured the par? or the par over an extended amount of time? until I'm absolutely sure, I'll keep droping 65$ every 6 month on new bulbs.

 

[L98-Z]

If you're comfortable dropping the $65 every 6 months it's not really an issue. Metal halides and T5s are excellent still.

Things I've noticed since switching over to LEDs:
-Practically zero water evaporation
-Almost no heat being added to the water (this is actually bad since my basement stays at around 70 degrees)
-Excellent coral polyp extension.
-The shimmering is there, but not to the level that a metal halide for some reason.
-I can adjust the brightness. I currently have it dimmed to around 30%. I realize there are dimmable ballasts out there for MH as well.

The downsides are:
-The heatsinks I used are very heavy causing the canopy to be very heavy. These are attached to the lid that I grab to reach into the tank.
-I have to keep an eye out on salt touching the barewires or heatsinks, should be cleaned routinely.
-Price... I have around $400 in a homebuilt LED system over a 75 gallon.
-There is always a fear that I may have did something wrong during my construction of this unit that could lead to an electrical problem (or worse.... fire).

 

[Uncle Salty 05]

There have been no long term studies because they are new.
I wouldn't buy them even if I could afford them (which I can't) for that very reason.
There is little question that LEDs are the future of the hobby, but I will wait until all of the bugs are worked out and the price comes down (as it does with ALL new technology) before I upgrade.

 

[L98-Z]

There have been no long term studies because they are new.
I wouldn't buy them even if I could afford them (which I can't) for that very reason.
There is little question that LEDs are the future of the hobby, but I will wait until all of the bugs are worked out and the price comes down (as it does with ALL new technology) before I upgrade.

What is long term? There are multiple people on this board who have been using them for over a year. I'd bet some are over 2 years.

 

[Uncle Salty 05]

What is long term? There are multiple people on this board who have been using them for over a year. I'd bet some are over 2 years.

To me long term is ten to twenty years.

 

[L98-Z]

To me long term is ten to twenty years.

Gotcha. What do you expect to show up in 10-20 years that hasn't shown up in 1-2? I could see the lifespan failing. Is it just a fear of the unknown?

 

[Uncle Salty 05]

Gotcha. What do you expect to show up in 10-20 years that hasn't shown up in 1-2? I could see the lifespan failing. Is it just a fear of the unknown?

Plenty.
Like their claim of lasting 50,000 hours (10-12 years of normal use) with no degradation.
If I pay over $3,000 for a lighting system and it fails or degrades in 5 years I would be really disappointed.
How well they stand up to hanging/sitting over saltwater year after year?
Can they fry and burn your house down in 10 years?
What kind of customer service will the manufacturer give 2 or 3 years after purchase etc.
Not fear of the unknown, fear of blowing cash I don't have on unproven technology.
With MH I know exactly what to expect and have never been disappointed.
Take a look at prescription drugs for example. At first they are wonderful, 10 to 20 years later it is discovered some cause worse conditions than they treated. It takes time to get the whole picture on any product.
LED lighting included.

 

[L98-Z]

I understand what you're saying, though I'd probably still classify that under fear of the unknown. I don't consider the prescription drugs example a good analogy since they human body is far more complex than LEDs. LED technology has been around for ages, we're just now using it on fish tanks... which is still far less complex than the human body.

I'm not trying to argue with you, I was just curious on why you felt the way you did. I can agree to some of that. Granted, I did my produced my own fixture as opposed to buying one. To me it seems like your worries are with the manufacturer more than the technology. I believe that's an honest issue as well, didn't The Solaris have alot of issues? One of those LED companies did at the beginning. They used various LEDs, designed the product differently based on what they learned while producing them... They also had issues with the LEDs dying.

 

[Uncle Salty 05]

No worries, I didn't think you were being argumentative.
I guess you could call it fear of the unknown.
I just can't justify an investment of over $3,000 on something that is not "tried and true".
And like I said the $3,000 sytems you see today may be $800 in 10 years.
I can wait, I am happy with my MHs for now.:thumbsup:

 

[L98-Z]

Good to hear, I wasn't sure if I was coming off as argumnetative or not.

I enjoyed my MHs as well. In fact, I've had T8s, T5s, MHs, and now LEDs....

I still prefer MH bulbs for their easy to use nature. One reflector, one bulb, one ballast. Makes a great shimmer, very good color, strong intense light. The only downside was the heat and the new bulb every 6 months. I built this LED setup with the intentions of having a 92 gallon seahorse tank, so I obviously wanted the tank to run cooler. Plus as an electrical engineer, I liked designing my own stuff and an LED fixture sounded fun.

 

[Uncle Salty 05]

Are going to have corals in with the seahorses?
Seahorses are not fond of intense lighting.

 

[L98-Z]

Yes, I plan to have corals. No SPS or stinging LPS though. Mainly rics, softies, and a few LPS that aren't known of their stinging abilities. That's the plan atleast, the seahorse tank is still around a year away. I have house modifications that need to be completed first.

I can dim the LEDs, so intense light won't be an issue. If I find it to be an issue, I have another tank that will be up and running with T5s on it. I could always convert the 92 to the reef and the 75 to the seahorse, but that's not what I'm aiming for.

 

[poolkeeper1]

You can cover a 180 with LED's for way less than 3,000.00 and be no where near setting
your house on fire. They do have standards that any Mfg has to meet to get UL approved for a product. That being said there are many Tanks running LED's that have great success and no Issues with the LED's. The first Mfg that is now out of business was the one's that had Issues, As far as I can see they are the way to go. The longer you wait the longer you keep spending on Power, Bulbs, Ballast, Etc. JMO
Bill

 

[Uncle Salty 05]

Normally just standard flourescents are what is reommended for seahorses.
Even T-5s might be too much.
http://seahorsesource.com/ is a great place to buy from and/or gather information. Dan and Abby are very helpful and know their seahorses.
I recommend asking their advice before setting up a seahorse tank.

 

[Uncle Salty 05]

You can cover a 180 with LED's for way less than 3,000.00 and be no where near setting
your house on fire. They do have standards that any Mfg has to meet to get UL approved for a product. That being said there are many Tanks running LED's that have great success and no Issues with the LED's. The first Mfg that is now out of business was the one's that had Issues, As far as I can see they are the way to go. The longer you wait the longer you keep spending on Power, Bulbs, Ballast, Etc. JMO
Bill

I have not seen an LED system for a 72" tank that will rival MH for under $3K.
Stealth heaters are UL approved and how many of those have blown up lately?
Power and bulbs yes, I have never had a MH ballast fail. $3K will buy a lot of power and bulbs.
The longer I wait the lower the price will be and the technology will have probably improved, just like computers, flat screen TVs, cellphones etc.
If you want to be a pioneer that's great.
I have never been one to jump on bandwagons until I'm sure of what I'm getting. With MHs I know what I'm getting.

 

[powdr_dayz]

I have not seen an LED system for a 72" tank that will rival MH for under $3K.
Stealth heaters are UL approved and how many of those have blown up lately?
Power and bulbs yes, I have never had a MH ballast fail. $3K will buy a lot of power and bulbs.
The longer I wait the lower the price will be and the technology will have probably improved, just like computers, flat screen TVs, cellphones etc.
If you want to be a pioneer that's great.
I have never been one to jump on bandwagons until I'm sure of what I'm getting. With MHs I know what I'm getting.

You can easily build a DIY LED system to cover a 72" tank for under a $1000. But you have to be willing to put forth the time and effort required to design, build, and test it yourself. If something goes wrong, you only have yourself to blame.

I finished my DIY LED fixture for my 72 Gallon 2 months ago, and have not had a problem since and absolutely love the light it puts off. Now if I could only get my water parameters right, I am positive that I would see amazing growth of all my corals.

 

[Uncle Salty 05]

I am a DIYer and when the time comes I will likely build my own but even $1K is over my budget right now
What is the problem with your parameters?
How can you be sure the lack of growth is not a result of the lighting?

 

[ludnix]

There are a ton of threads with PAR measurements of their LED setups. I'd love to compare it to my MH setup but the PAR meters are a little pricey for something I would use so infrequently.

Personally I have seen amazing coral growth in my frag tank with 12 LEDs replacing my 150w MH. I was not expecting my corals to do better under it but it's been a welcome surprise.