Looking for 10W LED Help.

[zachts]

Where are the wire nuts being used and why? I don't have any is why I am asking. I look at those things as a weak point.

You know.......all the wires in you home (a few hundred connections or so) are held together with wire nuts (and maybe if your lucky a little electrical tape) :lolspin:

I use wire nuts all the time, they hold very well, better than cheap screw terminals in most cases. Just not as pretty.

Here mounting with the end caps. This will be a temp setup until I get the canopy going.

I said it before but will say it again after seeing the pic. BEST IDEA EVER for reuse of the now obsolete VHO endcaps most of us probably have laying around. I think you just solved my "how to mount LED actinics in the meantime" issue on my display. While I continue to figure out my ideal replacement for the white tubes.

I am unsure on the Violets, I was hoping Ben or Zachts would chime in for me.

Ding!

Depends on how much of that "actinic pop" you like. I'm absolutely in love with the nuclear effect of green and many red and blue corals under the T12 VHO actinics. Soooooo, on my builds I favor a very heavy ratio of violet to Royal Blue and Blue, figured in mW of blue radiation it works out in the ball park of (2-3 mW) Violet: 1 mW Royal Blue: (0.5-1 mW) Blue.

The blue often depends on other factors like white source, red and green components etc and I go on the low end when dimming is not used.

So on the Violets to notice anything you need A LOT of them! Nearly 1 to 1 in mW output with both on to see a major difference. 0.5 to 1 ratio depending on corals is noticable.

You really have a lot of choices on violets these days In both of your cases I'd look at chips in the 410-420nm range, so it will depend on what you want to spend.

ReefLEDlab is selling some very powerful chips with same form (basically) as the Luxeon M so same reflector would work(with a few mods for screws and solders likely).

Otherwise Steve's LED is clearing out of their current stock and their V2 violets are pretty decent if you run them under 500mA and keep them cool (350mA if they will be getting hot like on the same heatsinks as your M's) But you can run a ton of them and parallel wiring would be just fine (three strings on a 1000mA LDD I'd not worry about too much, just do some balancing and install 500mA fuses on each string) That would let you run in the ball park of 3 or so of them off a single additional LDD using a 36v PSU)

Low current is the key in most of the violets available to ensure long life span, at least when you look at the less expensive versions out there. RapidLEDs can run all day long at full power and get just as hot as my other chips with no issue, though but that is the exception to most of what is available right now, (Can't wait for the violet Luxeon Z to get affordable and readily available) So I would also expect the same results from the chips sold by ReefLEDlab (same chips but better bins, I've got no experience with their stuff yet though)


:beer:

 

[Poseidon]

Thanks Zachts! I do like that POP, I was a huge fan of VHO Actinic, it took me a long time to accept the blue of T5 from that violet color we had.

Looking up that Reef LED Lab Violet, that puppy is pricey!

$29.00 each.

I *think* I could run 2 of those from an LDD700 on my current heatsinks, with my current power supply. Adding 1 to each tube, not sure I would see anything for my $100 spent though. If I added 4, I would need them to be on 2 LDD700s, which would be more noticeable, but then I don't think my simple tubes would keep them cool. I would have to add active cooling at that point.

Sound like I have the basics?

 

[zachts]

The "sinkpads" are a very effective way of cooling those at full current so you might be able to add a pair to each heatsink, though on my end I don't mind soldering and have pretty much all my builds enclosed to hide wires so I tend to favor the 10 or so smaller violets run at lower power for the same cost as one of those monsters.

I can't say one approach is better than the other, too many factors unique to each build that have to get figured in by the individual.

SemiLED makes an even bigger violet chip by the way, but I've never seen it offered anywhere............ http://www.semileds.com/system/files/N9SL-U-A.pdf

You could always build a little aluminum "skirt" around your fixture base to house a couple fans......all you'd need then is some of that spiffy braided wire cover to make your build look very sexy!

Choices, Choices right. :beer:

 

[Stlouphil]

So on the Violets to notice anything you need A LOT of them! Nearly 1 to 1 in mW output with both on to see a major difference. 0.5 to 1 ratio depending on corals is noticable.

You really have a lot of choices on violets these days In both of your cases I'd look at chips in the 410-420nm range, so it will depend on what you want to spend.

ReefLEDlab is selling some very powerful chips with same form (basically) as the Luxeon M so same reflector would work(with a few mods for screws and solders likely).

Otherwise Steve's LED is clearing out of their current stock and their V2 violets are pretty decent if you run them under 500mA and keep them cool (350mA if they will be getting hot like on the same heatsinks as your M's) But you can run a ton of them and parallel wiring would be just fine (three strings on a 1000mA LDD I'd not worry about too much, just do some balancing and install 500mA fuses on each string) That would let you run in the ball park of 3 or so of them off a single additional LDD using a 36v PSU)

Low current is the key in most of the violets available to ensure long life span, at least when you look at the less expensive versions out there. RapidLEDs can run all day long at full power and get just as hot as my other chips with no issue, though but that is the exception to most of what is available right now, (Can't wait for the violet Luxeon Z to get affordable and readily available) So I would also expect the same results from the chips sold by ReefLEDlab (same chips but better bins, I've got no experience with their stuff yet though)


:beer:

So here is the question for my build. The radiums just about wash the blue out from 6 - Luxeons although the coral still fluoresce pretty nicely. I have room for 4 more royal blue Luxeons which I'm sure will add additional blue and pop to the tank. Should I add additional royal blues o violets? How many violets would I need to add significant additional pop or even be noticed?

 

[Poseidon]

Have you left the halides on, and turned off the LED's yet? You won't believe how different it looks.

 

[Stlouphil]

LOL! These Luxeon's will have that effect on you! They really are bad a** to look at.

I am unsure on the Violets, I was hoping Ben or Zachts would chime in for me.

Not my best work by any means, but here is a pretty down and dirty pic of my reef with the PAR numbers measured. The readings were bouncing all over as I had all the circulation pumps on while taking these readings, so there is a fudge factor for sure.

You can see the SHADOW zone that I get with the Spider reflector, I wish I could have found those Lumenarcs that you have.


Hopefully you can read my writing, is Silver Sharpie marker. LOL

I'm surprised your par reading were as low as they were with the Radiums only. Looking at Sanjai's number with Radiums on electronic ballasts he was getting in the 350 range towards the top of the tank. I had that number in mind. The LED's raised your PAR almost 50%. I'm thinking it would be almost more economical to upgrade your reflector.

 

[Poseidon]

I think you are right on the reflector, but then my really cool custom heatsinks might not fit...

If I add the Violet, it won't be for PAR, but for color. The corals are growing very well since I added the halide, and since adding the LED's, my GARF has really gotten its purple back.

 

[Stlouphil]

I think you are right on the reflector, but then my really cool custom heatsinks might not fit...

If I add the Violet, it won't be for PAR, but for color. The corals are growing very well since I added the halide, and since adding the LED's, my GARF has really gotten its purple back.

Well, awesome. I just picked up a GARF and was a little disappointed in the color. Hopefully, the LED's will bring out that DEEP PURPLE. I am just debating timing on the LED's. I wish I had a dimmer. I would just keep my timer the same as the T5's and just ramp up the intensity. Or, I could live life on the edge keep my lighting schedule the way it is and keep a close eye on things or I can run the LED's for a few hours in the morning and a few in the evening and gradually meet in the middle. I going to post some photos in a few minutes.

 

[zachts]

So here is the question for my build. The radiums just about wash the blue out from 6 - Luxeons although the coral still fluoresce pretty nicely. I have room for 4 more royal blue Luxeons which I'm sure will add additional blue and pop to the tank. Should I add additional royal blues o violets? How many violets would I need to add significant additional pop or even be noticed?

First a question.

How hot does your LED heatsink get when the halide is on? you may want a small fan in there to negate the effect of the radiant heat from the halide raising the heatsink temp. with all the open air in your setup might not be an issue but keep an eye on it.

On violets it will depend a lot on the corals you have. You will notice the addition first in green corals like neon acro's, torch, frogspawn, leathers, and the like, also makes a massive difference in the appearance of the turquise torches, bubble coral and such. I forgot the polyps but I don't keep many anymore.

In the presence of the halide I really don't know how much you'll need to add, but in my builds I start to see the improvement in color at about 50% relative power compared to my combined royalblue and blue LEDs. (thats the initial on/off comparison) Long term effects are different though and any violet added will improve some of the fluorescent pigment development over time.

Add as much as is practical for you, any is better than none. Like I said I love it, but in LEDs it's pricey still.

The LedReefLab 3up violets don't look too bad in price and performance for both of your builds to save soldering. But I have no first hand experience with them. The specs on the SemiLEDs look great and Rapids have always lived up to the hype, they also have been quite adamant about the quality and performance (though so did "that one led place that can't be mentioned", as well as Steve's LED on his old version 1.0 chips, all burned up pretty darn fast under currents anywhere near their rating, cool to the touch heat sinks or not)

I had a nice research/review/rant thread going on the violet leds out about a year ago, but have since gotten busy with work and not gotten around to updating with my latest results, or had time to get a hold of newer version chips to test out...........

...........yikes! Sorry, this post got unintentionally long really fast

 

[zachts]

Well, awesome. I just picked up a GARF and was a little disappointed in the color. Hopefully, the LED's will bring out that DEEP PURPLE. I am just debating timing on the LED's. I wish I had a dimmer. I would just keep my timer the same as the T5's and just ramp up the intensity. Or, I could live life on the edge keep my lighting schedule the way it is and keep a close eye on things or I can run the LED's for a few hours in the morning and a few in the evening and gradually meet in the middle. I going to post some photos in a few minutes.

Either way I'd acclimate in one form or another, even if you had the same PAR after LED your spectrum is different and it will take the coral a number of weeks to adapt.

 

[Stlouphil]

Here are some photos of the tank:

Radiums Only 2 - 250watt on electronic ballast (yes i know that's not the ballast they are speced for!)



Radiums with 72 watts of Royal Blue LED's



Oh, my new favorite coral!

 

[Stlouphil]

Either way I'd acclimate in one form or another, even if you had the same PAR after LED your spectrum is different and it will take the coral a number of weeks to adapt.

I think I'm going to run the Lights as follows:

Led's 11:00 am to 2:00 pm
Halides 1:00 pm to 8 pm
Leds 7:00pm to 10:00 pm

Add 30 minutes in the morning and afternoon a week until we meet in the middle. A bit creative, but it acclimates them.:lmao:

 

[Poseidon]

That is a pretty substantial difference, plus you probably have a bit more shimmer lines now. How does the tank look with all 6 LEDs only?

I as poking around on Rapid, it sure would be nice to have the multi emitter, and some LDD's with a board all on the same site.

 

[Poseidon]

I started out at 4 hours of LED time, you are starting at 7, what did you take off, T5 wise?

 

[Stlouphil]

That is a pretty substantial difference, plus you probably have a bit more shimmer lines now. How does the tank look with all 6 LEDs only?

I as poking around on Rapid, it sure would be nice to have the multi emitter, and some LDD's with a board all on the same site.

BLUE! I can not figure out how to get a decent picture with all LED'd. Love the blue shimmer. The light is more focused. Because I don't have a canopy yet the T5's made my whole basement blue at night. I have very little bleed with the LED's. Some around the tank. We live on 4 acre lot on top of a hill in our subdivision. You could see our house from 3/4" mile away with the T5's. It looked like we were being invaded by aliens because the entire back of the house glowed blue. :crazy1:

 

[Stlouphil]

I started out at 4 hours of LED time, you are starting at 7, what did you take off, T5 wise?

Well, starting at six. Taking off 2 - 54w T5s. ATI Blue Plus are suppose to have a lot of PAR. They are bright, but not as focused as LED's. I'm hoping I can get away with by breaking the time up during the day.

 

[Poseidon]

LOL! I have seen that in person, it is funny. I live in a 2nd floor apartment, I drove around back to see what my apartment looks like from the road, it is BLUE. I stick out like a s oar thumb that is for sure.

So... 2 of the $21 LED's from Rapid, or 8 of the 3W from Steve's? In either case, I am ordering the LDD and 2 up board from Coral Lux again I guess, as no one else seems to have all the parts. I see the LDD's with Wires, but since I have the board, and a box that fits now, I would keep it the same for this build I think.

 

[Poseidon]

Oh, did you pop on those reflectors? Might make a difference in the "wash out" from the halide.

 

[Stlouphil]

Oh, did you pop on those reflectors? Might make a difference in the "wash out" from the halide.

I decided against the reflectors. They basically reduce the spread from 90 to 60 degrees. My LED's are much closer to the water than your. I think the reflectors would basically give the tank the look of having 6 blue spot lights on the tank. If the were higher the spread would be better. Maybe I'm over this. What I have now BLOWS AWAY the T5's both in intensity and look.

 

[Stlouphil]

LOL! I have seen that in person, it is funny. I live in a 2nd floor apartment, I drove around back to see what my apartment looks like from the road, it is BLUE. I stick out like a s oar thumb that is for sure.

So... 2 of the $21 LED's from Rapid, or 8 of the 3W from Steve's? In either case, I am ordering the LDD and 2 up board from Coral Lux again I guess, as no one else seems to have all the parts. I see the LDD's with Wires, but since I have the board, and a box that fits now, I would keep it the same for this build I think.

I am in good shape I got a 5UP board. Partly because of my personality. I new once this was done I would not be satisfied. :lolspin: Now those you have to add optics. I assume by default they are 120 degrees, but if you are only going with 2, going without the optics might be a better choice. More spread and they appear dimmer to the eye so they will not blow you out of the room like royal blues.