Looking for volunteers to clean this tank?

[smellzlikefish]

Please help!!. I am new to the hobby, and becoming over whelmed and frustrated with the amount of research required, specifically conflicting points of view or opinions about compatible tank mates. I apologize if this is another compatability posting. I promise I have done a lot of research before posting this. The reason why I am posting this is because, I hope to hear peoples personal experiences keeping fish on this list.

Just to be clear to everyone, I am not interested to know at this time, what size the different species should be when I introduce them to the tank or in what order I should put them in the tank or what specific aquascaping each fish requires. I will start a differnt post when that time comes. Right now I am only trying to finalize my wish list so I hae a goal to work towards. For the purpose of this list lets assume its a perfect world and all the fish are an appropiate size / well fed / etc.

I also realize that some of these fish are not recommended for beginners. For the record, I choose this hobby because it's time consuming, and can be difficult. I will have a fish guy from my lfs make a weekly home visit, for extensive cleaning and water changes and to continiously advise me.

If you know of any specific reasons why any of these are fish more difficult than others, please share that info ( I'm not looking for obvious things like "the trigger will bite or the scorpion fish are poisinious ). Also, please give me tips on ways I can improve the odds of keeping these fish healthy and happy and less aggressive to other fish.

The reason I choose the fish on this list is because they are native to the Philippines. I am currently living here for the past 10 years, and would like all the fish in the tank to be native to the Philippines. I own a dive shop here and have personally seen all of these fish before with the exception of a black lionfish. But many of the local boatmen / fisheran have seen them before.

If you can suggest any other species that would be a good match for my tank please let me know. The uglier, creepier, weirder the better

My tank is still being built at this time, and then I still have the cyling time, so it will be awhile before I am ready for any of the fish. I think ( and have read ) the better prepared you are the better chances of sucess I will have.

My tank is 72" long x 30" height x 36" wide. Approx 350gallons, maybe bigger, because I'm still pushing the builder to go 40" wide. FOWLR will have approx 350 pounds of live rock. I am not interested in corals at this time. If I want a reef tank in the future I will build a differnt tank.

Wish list: ( Scorpion Fish / 4 species / 6 fish ), ( Lionfish / 1 fish ), ( Puffer / 1 fish ), ( Box Fish / 1 fish ), ( Trigger Fish / 1 0r 2 ), ( Eels / 2 species / 2 eels ), ( Shark / 1 shark ), ( Angelfish / 2 fish ), ( Moorish idol / 2 fish ), ( Butterflyfish / 6 fish ), ( Grouper / 2 fish ), ( Giant Hawk Fish / 1 fish ), ( Bat Fish / 2 fish ).
Total number of fish: 29 ( Including 6 meyers butterflyfish ) Total number of differnt species: 16

Do you think the tank is big enough to house all of those fish? I realize that I may not be able to house all of these in the same tank, but the more the better.

In addition to the specif questions I'm asking please make general comments or concerns that will help me to make more of an educated decision.

Please keep in mind when forming your opinion about the feasibility of this tank that I'm paying a fraction of the cost for fish than anyone in North America or Europe. For example, I checked with someone who supplies fish stores that export the fish from here in the Philippines. He will charge me $50 USD for a weedy scorpionfish. $10 USD for a leaf scorpion. $0 USD (free) for angels / groupers / bat fish / triggers /. $2.50 per kilo / USD Giant hawk fish ( at the local market ). What I will probably do is put the word out to the divers and fisherman here and try to buy direct from them. My point is, all of these fish are within a stones throw my front door or ironically where their tank is going to be. I can live with loosing a few fish ( even if the fish can not ) until i can find good tank mates.



FISHES

SCORPION FISH

- Leaf Scorpion Fish ( 3 FISH, ALL COLOR PINK )
http://ns2.underwaterserver.com/image.php/id/8325/

- Weedy Scorpion Fish (1 FISH, COLOR GREEN)
http://www.chertan.com/Gallery/22WeedyScorpionfish.html

- Bearded Ghoul Scorpion Fish (1 FISH, COLOR ORANGE OR RED)
http://www.diverosa.com/categories/...4b-245 Bearded ghoul, Inimicus didactylus.jpg

- Sea goblin / Spiny Devil Fish ( popeye sea goblin? )(1 FISH, WITH YELLOW ON WINGS )
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7DXm_tekNXw&feature=related

Questions about scorpionfish:

- Are those 4 species compatible with eachother? If not what species are more likely to eat what species within the scorpion fish family? It's surprisingly hard to find that answer in any of the research thus far.
- What fish on this list will eat / harass any of the scorpion fish and vice versa?
- I've read that leaf scorpion fish do well in groups of 3. Is there any rule regarding what sexes to keep together?
- Any tips how to keep these fish from changing their color? keeping in mind that there will be no corals in the tank.
- Will they all change to a rocky color? I don't want then to look brown or dull if I can help it. Any personal experiences?
- How much of a sand bed does the sea goblin need? Does this fish negatively effect any of the other fish on this list? ( what fish on this list are impossible to keep with a sea goblin and why? )
- Please tell me about your previous experience with these fish. Have you had any of the same tank mates I have on this list, If so, What happened?
- Can you recommend any other weird or creepy looking fish similar to these ones also native to the Philippines? ( I was thinking about a nice big stone fish until I seen a you tube video of one eating a lionfish )
- Would a cuttle fish be appropriate tankmates for scorpion fish?
LIONFISH

- Lionfish (1 FISH, BLACK PEACOCK)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aNe7_5PXzck

Questions about Lionfish:

- Are these fish really rare?
- Is the fish in the video actually a black peacock?
- I know that sometimes triggers and angelfish will nip and harass the lionfish. When a fish nips another fish, does it physically harm the fish that was nipped?
- Will the shark or any of the scorpionfish harass or eat the lionfish. ( I know size matters, what are other factors?)
- The lionfish is not my most desirable fish in the tank. But if I put the effort into finding a black one, I'd hate to see it get eaten.
- Has anyone had good or bad experience keeping any of the fish on this list with a lionfish.
- If I had one of these fish would you be jealous?
- Will / could the lionfish kill any of the fish in this list?

PUFFER FISH

- Puffer Fish (1 FISH, BLUE SPOTTED)
http://www.flickr.com/photos/yoyothesheep/2082918876/

Questions about Puffer fish:

- Can anyone confirm that blue spotted puffers are native to the Philippines?
- Feel free to recommend another species of puffer? Must be colorful. I do not like yellow or green color.
- Do these have any toxins that can wipe out a full tank, like the box fish?
- Has anyone had good or bad experiences keeping any of the fish on this list with a puffer?
- what are the problem fish on this list for a puffer?

BOX FISH

- Box Fish (1 FISH, BLACK SPOTTED)
http://www.seahorseaquariums.com/store/product/131/Black-Boxfish/

Questions about Box Fish:

- Whats the chance they will let off their poison in a tank full of predators, such as the fish on this list?
- Can anyone confirm that the Box fish in the link is native to the Philippines?
- Feel free to recommend another species of box fish. I do not like the yellow box fish.
- Has anyone had good or bad experiences keeping any of the fish on this list with a box fish?

TRIGGER FISH

- Clown Trigger Fish ( 1 FISH, MAYBE 2 OR MAYBE 1 CLOWN AND 1 PICASSO )

Questions about Triggers:

- If I was going to keep 2 triggers, would it be better / they would be less aggressive towards eachother and different fish if there was 2 clowns or 1 clown and 1 piasso?
- Will / could any of the fish on this list eat and or kill the triggers?
- What's your opinion about swapping out the trigger(s) for differnt trigger(s) if when I introduce them into the tank or eventually they turn out to be too aggressive?
- I'm concerned with keeping the scorpionfish and triggers together. When the triggers nip the scorpionfish, will it harm the scorpionfish?
- Is it better to have 2 males or 1 male and 1 female or 2 females? I mean less aggressive towards eachother and to other fish is better.

EELS

- 2 Eels. ( 1 Zebra eel / 1 white ribbon eel )

Questions about Eels:

- I originally wanted a tessalata eel. I changed my plan to a zebra eel and a white ribbon eel in lieu of a tessalata eel for the safety of everyone else in the tank. Was that a good idea?
- Would a tessalata eel really eat everything in the tank after a few years? guaranteed? has anyone ever had a passive large tessalata?
- Is there going to be any problems with either the Zebra or the white / ghost ribbon and the scorpionfish?
- Are there any fish on this list that would probably kill either eel? or vice versa? Espically the white ribbon because of its small size?
- I'm concerned about the eels rubbing up against any of the scorpionfish and getting stung? any thoughts?
- Is the snowflake eel more or less aggressive than the zebra? Any other suggestions? Can anyone recommend another species of eel? I don't really like the snow flake eel.

SHARK

- BAMBOO SHARK (1 FISH, COLOR GREY OR BROWN)

Questions about Bamboo shark:

- I'm thinking about a cat shark, probably grey color. I do not like the black and white banded one. Any other suggestions about a suitable shark for this tank?
- Has anyone had sucess or bad experiences keeping a shark in a tank with any of the fish on this list? What kind of shark did you have?
- How is the shark and the scorpionfish deal with eachother? I can't find any info about this. I am concerned about the sea goblin and the lionfish.
- When the triggers or angelfish nip at the shark, does it physically harm the shark?
- Whats the best shark for living with scorpionfish / triggers / lionfish / etc?
- I choose the shark because it is active, and some of the fish on this list are not that active. Feel free to recomend any other active predatory fish or sharks that would work well in this tank.

FISHIES ( hopefully not food )

- KORAN ANGELFISH (2 FISH, COLOR BLUE)
http://www.copyright-free-pictures.org.uk/tropical-marine-fish/16-koran-angelfish.htm

Questions:

- What fish on this list will / could eat and or kill them?
- What fish on this list will / could the angelfishes kill or injure?
- I want two of these fish. Would they be less aggressive in a male / male or male / female or female / female pair? or does it matter?
- Can you recommend any other angelfish that would be better suited for this tank?
- If they really disturbed the other fish, I would replace the aggressive one or both for a non aggressive one. Any thoughts?
- I can get these in any size.

- MOORISH IDOL (2 FISH, YELLOW AND BLACK)

Questions:

- What fish on this list will / could eat and or kill them?
- What fish on this list will / could the Moorish idols kill or injure?
- I want twoof these fish. Would they be less aggressive in a male / male or male / female or female / female pair? or does it matter?
- If they really disturbed the other fish, I would replace the aggressive one or both for a non aggressive one. Any thoughts?


- MEYERI / MEYERS BUTTERFLYFISH (6 FISH, WHITE, BLACK, YELLOW)
http://www.bluezooaquatics.com/productDetail.asp?did=1&pid=605&cid=26

Questions:

- Because of their small size, do they stand a chance in this tank?
- If I had 6 of these, would they school together?
- Does having more of the same type of fish together offer more defence for them?
- Has anyone kept these fish with any of the fish on this list before? what happened?
- Any other suggestions about smaller fish that I could try? I wanted these just to add some additional movement to the tank.


- PANTHER GROUPER (2 FISH, WHITE, BLACK DOTS)

Questions:

- What fish on this list will / could eat and or kill them?
- What fish on this list will / could the groupers kill or injure?
- I want two of these fish. Would they be less aggressive in a male / male or male / female or female / female pair? or does it matter?
- These are the only groupers I've seen that I like. Can you recommend any other cool looking groupers that are native to the Philippines?
- If they really disturbed the other fish, I would replace the aggressive one both for a non aggressive one. Any thoughts?

- GIANT HAWKFISH (1 FISH, BLUE, GREEN)
http://www.flickr.com/photos/herfjonez/5304776656/

Questions:

- What fish on this list would / could eat / kill this fish?
- Has anyone had experience keeping this fish with any of the other fish on this list?
- Is this an active fish?

- BATFISH (2 fish, black, orange)
http://www.livingreefs.com/orange-and-black-batfish-t31054.html

Questions:

- What fish on this list will / could eat and or kill them?
- What fish on this list will / could the batfish kill or injure?
- I want two of these fish. Would they be less aggressive in a male / male or male / female or female / female pair? or does it matter?
- These are the only batfish I've seen that I like. Can you recommend any other cool looking batfish that are native to the Philippines?
- Will these fish nip at other fish like the angels or triggers?
- Has anyone ever had experience keeping these fish with any of the other fish on this list?



Thanks again for the taking the time to read this and share your first hand hard earned knowledge with someone new to the hobby.

I will be posting differnt posts in the future about other topics, such as live rock, aquascaping, diet, filteration, and any other topics that I need specific answers about.

I will be compling all of the links, with all the answers everybody leaves, in hopes that this may also be helpful to other people in the future.

I will be posting lots of pics, as soon as I have something to take pics of.

I thank you, and my fish thank you!!!

Shawn

 

[stangd1909]

The Clown trigger/Puffer is going to pick on the Lions and Shark....your are going to have to leave the shark off your list IMO.

 

[stangd1909]

Oh and my Puffer ate a bat fish...so that wouldn't be a good combo either.

 

[smellzlikefish]

Thanks for the reply Stan.

Thanks for the reply Stan.

Do all triggers have that instinct to harass?

Is it possible to find one that is less likely to harass the other fish?

I only choose the shark because it is more active. Can you recommend any other predatory fish that is not on this list?

As far as the Lion fish is concerned, I am not even certain that I can find the species I want. If by the time I find I find the lion fish there is already triggers in the tank and the triggers have shown aggression to other fish, I will probably keep the lion in another tank.

Will the triggers harass the scorpion fish or would they have the sense to avoid them?

Thanks again for the advice!!

 

[smellzlikefish]

Thanks again stan,,

Sorry to hear about your batfish? haha

Thats exactly the kind of first hand feedback I am hoping to get from this posting.

How big was the puffer, and how big was the batfish?

The kind of batfish I want can reach up to 15", so I was planning to get full grown batfish right from the start. Would that help?

Also if there is more than 1 batfish? ( I was hoping for two ), does that offer more defense for them?

I mean, would the puffer be less likely to attack them if there are more tan 1?

Sorry again for the obvious kind of questions?

I really appreciate the help

 

[Stumped]

A couple of things. Hopefully I don't come off the wrong way, but you are going to end up way, way overstocked on your tank. Especially considering everything you want to add is a fairly large fish.

I'm definitely not a scorp expert, but from everything I've read do not expect them to keep the color that you purchase them as. Also as far as I know they do not make the best tankmates for triggers, puffers, tangs and angels (basically anything that will graze or pick on them). Ambush predators that rely on camouflage tend to get harassed by more active fish that naturally graze. Plus in a tank of aggressive feeders, you're going to have some difficulty feeding things like leaf fish (which tend to be difficult to wean off live foods supposedly).

The other thing I wanted to mention that sticks out is the Meyers Butterflyfish. I looked into one a while back and was told they do horrible in captivity. Apparently there is an extremely low success rate with them and they are best left in the wild. I would guess that the fact you want to add 6 of them with such an aggressive stocking list pretty much guarantees they will not survive.

Also worth mentioning is, if I remember correctly there was a thread on giant hawkfish a while back and I remember people saying they have a voracious appetite. So much so that they are not suitable to house with other fish. You should do a quick search of the forums for that thread (as I don't think there are a ton of threads regarding this fish).

Anyway, best of luck with the tank, whatever you end up doing it sounds like it will be pretty exciting.

 

[smellzlikefish]

thanks for the reply stumped

thanks for the reply stumped

Thanks for the advice, Obviously I need it!!, That's why I am asking the questions.

Good point about "GRAZERS", just goes to show you that even after weeks of research and reading posts, some of the most obvious points can be overlooked, if you don't know any better.

Regarding the feeding needs, I have lots of staff and people around that I can train to help me with the feeding.

That's too bad to hear about the meyers butterfly. They are my favorite looking butterfly.

I wonder if that's why its hard to find info about keeping these fish.

I was thinking to have 6 of them because of their small size, I was thinking that they would add move movement to the tank.

When you mentioned that because there was six of them, their chances decrease even more, is that because there is simply more of them for the other fish to eat?

Can you recommend any other smaller / medium sized fish, that I could consider for this tank? again, im looking for movement with-in the tank.

I read some posts about giant hawkfish and their appetite. I thought that would be better for this tank. Having a fish that could defend itself. I would hate to loose some of the more exotic fish to the hawkfish, hopefully someone will tell me their personal experiences with these fish.

Thanks again for your advice, I am already excited, and my tank hasn't even been built yet. haha.

 

[rayn]

I currently have a lion in with puffers and they seem good together, but I do keep them well fed and a eye on them. Any pickig and they will be separated.
Leaf fish are tricky. Most never go to frozen food and as I learned recently don't live that long in captivity. I tried one, but it died at the lfs before I could get it home.
Scorpions need to be in their own tank atleast till they are weened. I tried adding one and he didn't eat for two weeks. Moved to its own tank and eating live and finally switching over to frozen.

 

[smellzlikefish]

thanks rayn

thanks rayn

how many kinds of puffers do you have?

When you say they would be separated if they were picking, do you mean that one would be put into a different tank?

That's sad to hear that leaf fish are tricky in captivity. I hope to hear some peoples positive experiences?

What kinds of scorpions do you have?

Have you ever had positive experience keeping tank mates with your scorpions? besides your puffer lion combo.

Thanks again. It's nice to hear personal experiences.

 

[rayn]

Currently I have a small striped puffer and a small to medium yellow belly dog face. Lion is my first volitan and so gar so good. No other fish with it yet beside a wolf eel, or dottyback.
My scorpian is a popeye sea goblin, can't ever remember the scientific name. I have tried a leaf fish only to watch it starve, then the second at the lfs. I have also tried a ghoul to watch it starve. Key to them, I learned, is their own tank for special attention before adding to DT. Mine wouldn't eat in the DT, but in its own tank has finally cone around.

As for seperating, yeah another tank. I currently have three sitting empty and would buy a bigger one if needed. Predatory fish, sometimes we get lucky and are able to mix them, sometimes not. I don't really want to see my 20,30,40,100 dollar fish get eaten or picked to death.

 

[smellzlikefish]

Thanks again Rayn.

Can you confirm that the video in my posting is for a popeye sea goblin? I just want to make sure, That is one of the fish I am most concerned with. I am worried about that fish harming some of the fish on this list.

That sucks that your ghoul didn't survive and also the leaf.

I wonder because I can get the exact food they are used to if that would hel the chance of them eating?

Sorry to ask another question, what does dt mean? I'm very keen to learn more about these fish. They are the reason I want to make the tank, The rest of the fish are just there to add movement to the tank, and to amuse friends during feeding time.

What fish have you kept with the popeye?

Thanks about the advice to keep them in their own tank until they are weened. Even though I will more than likely be getting these fish from the sea instead of paying hundreds of dollars, I also do not want to see the fish die because I didnt prepare properly.

Thanks again,,

By the way,,, how much did you pay for the leaf / popeye / ghoul?

 

[sacremon]

Okay, let's try to take this in the order it was written...

1) Scorpions of various sorts. Scorpions (including lions) tend to eat anything that will fit in their mouth, including other scorpions, and leave everything else alone. There are some species that are picky about other members of their species/genus, but none that you list are like that, to my knowledge. They are also fairly inactive fish (the volitans lion excepted), as they are ambush predators, who sit and wait for a meal to come by rather than hunting it down.

2) Lionfish - See above

3) Puffer. General wisdom is that puffers will pick on scorps. Some have success in keeping them together, but you can find people who have kept X and Y together without issue for almost any two fish.

4) Boxfish. All boxfish can secrete a toxin when stressed, which can result in killing off the entire tank, including themselves. This is particularly the case if they have aggressive tankmates, like triggers.

5) Triggers, in particular the Clown Trigger. Triggers are amongst the most aggressive of the large fish that are commonly kept (I still consider damsels/clowns to be more aggressive). Clown triggers in particular have a reputation of being fine for months, then overnight a switch is thrown and they kill everything else in the tank, and will continue to do so.

6) Eels. The Zebra moray is most community-friendly moray eel. I have one and it actually refuses to eat fish flesh, only accepting shellfish. Ribbon eels are a lot trickier. They are traditionally harder to get to accept frozen/prepared foods and they are master escape artists.

7) Shark. Sharks generate a lot of waste, so be prepared to have a very good filtration system.

8) Koran Angel. Will likely pick on the scorpions/lion.

9) Moorish Idols. Hard to keep, even if you get them eating they seem to require something that not many are able to supply and no one really knows what it is, as they will often starve to death within a year. Ick magnets.

10) Meyers Butterfly. Again, hard to keep.

11) Panther grouper. Adults can reach over 2' in length. They are commercially raised as a food fish. Like lions, they will eat anything that fits in their mouth.

12) Giant Hawkfish. Another ambush predator. Hawkfish lack a swim bladder, so you won't see them swimming in the water column, unless it is essentially a hopping glide from one place on the substrate to another.

13) Batfish. Disease prone, picky eaters, get to roughly 2' in diameter as adults as they lose the juvenile coloration and elongated form.


That said, even if you took out the most aggressive species (the triggers and the angel) you would probably be looking at maybe a 4000g tank, at least, to keep that list of fish in anyway approaching an appropriate environment. Think about the fish you most want, the fish that will be the centerpiece of the tank, and plan for maybe 6-7 other fish at most. You could get away with more if you center on the scorpions, who don't need much space, but the ones you have selected would more likely get lost in that much space.

 

[rayn]

The popeye was in with the puffers, lion, and eel. Most likely why it stressed and didn't eat. Their food would help, but if stressed they probably still won't eat in my experience.
DT is display tank as opposed to QT for quarantine.
Check out my thread popeye sea goblin and it is my experience with mine.

 

[smellzlikefish]

hello sacremon, thanks for reading my post and the reply.

Just to be clear to everyone reading this, I don't expect to be able to keep all these fish together. These are just the fish that I like the most, now I am trying to figure out will actually work with out having a 4000 gallon tank

I for sure like the scorpions and am more inclined to develop the tank for that species. However as you realized my tank is pretty big to have a few inactive fish. That would be kind of boring.

"1) Scorpions of various sorts. Scorpions (including lions) tend to eat anything that will fit in their mouth, including other scorpions, and leave everything else alone. There are some species that are picky about other members of their species/genus, but none that you list are like that, to my knowledge."

So there are chances that some of the species on my list will eat the leafs? due to their small size.

Regarding the fish on my list not being picky towards other scorpions, does that mean that I could have 4, 5, 6, weedys for example, plus the other species on the list?

Is there any obvious reason why I can't fill the tank with scorpions?

Thanks for confirming the species I choose may tolerate each other, can you recommend any other species of scorpions I could consider adding to the list to make it more of a species only tank?

I'm not really expecting to keep a box fish?

Regarding puffers, I was only interested in one specific color, and I am not even certain if it's native to the Philippines. One more none scorp friendly fish off the list?

Triggers,,,, yeah I'm fully aware of their personality. It's the only fish that has ever attacked me while diving. Part of the reason why I wanna keep one of the little bastards. I'm starting to realize what I've known all along and that is,, I should probably remove the triggers off the list?

Triggers are very iconic fish here in the Philippines, everyone that seen my tank would reconize the clown right away. I will have to think of a better alternative.

Eels to me are the creepiest things in the tank,,, thanks for the advice about the white ribbon. I'd hate to spend all my time specifically looking for a little ribbon in the tank, just to make sure its still there. haha

Keeping in mind the scorpions, would you recommend a tessalata instead of a zebra? Personally I think the tessalata is super cool, and also the reason I selected the panther groupers ( matching colors )

I didnt realize that the groupers were that problematic? They were supposed to be one of the easy fish on the list. Choosen because of their size, so they wouldn't be easy food. Same thing for the angels, batfish, butterfly, moorish idols,,,, all of these fish I'm not that picky about,, I just don't know what else I can put in the tank.

you mentioned if i focused on the scorpions, the fish may get lost in such a large tank,, what are some species I could research that would be better in a 350 gallon, more species only kind of tank, keeping in mind I would like to see some movement.

It sucks to learn that the angels are such a pain in the ***,,, I really love the blue colors and design on them. I'm a little bit disappointed to have to give them up.

Again, I really thank you for your time and advice.

 

[smellzlikefish]

Rayn,,, Thanks again

In your opinion, was the goblin more stressed because of the puffer of the eel disturb him also?

I've seen some youtube vids of eels chasing around all kinds of scorpions.

how much did your scorpions cost? Just curious? haha

What scorpions are on your wish list? if you could step out your back door and collect any scorpions you wanted for your 350 gallon tank, what would you go after first? I'd love to hear about it? I'm becoming more and more committed to having more of a species tank, or at least a species safe dt ( check the lingo )

Thanks again

 

[rayn]

I never den it picked on, just never able to eat. Food doesn't stay in that tank long! I think he cost 70. Ghoul was 70 and leaf was 50.
My wish list right now is a goblin. If I find one it is mine. I have a tank ready for it. After that I'm still looking and researching.

 

[sacremon]

My hands-on experience with scorpions is limited to Pterois species (the full-sized lions). Other scorp info I have gleaned over the last few years from the local scorp experts on this board, FMarini, Namaxes and Seahorsedreams.

To give you an idea of how choices can sequentially limit your options, this is my tank:

1 Volitans lion (roughly 5" at present and growing quickly)
1 Radiata lion (also known as the clearfin) 3.5" and growing more slowly than the volitans
1 Zebra moray eel, roughly 22-24"
1 Male Naso Tang, about 7-8", starting to develop streamers
1 Magnificant Rabbitfish, about 5"
1 Two Spot Bristletooth Tang, 2"
1 Radiating Urchin (Astropyga radiata), test is about 3.5" in diameter
1 Derasa clam (roughly 5" along longest measurement)

I would like to add one more fish. I have my fill of tang and lions, so not another one of those. Anything that is torpedo/sardine shaped that grows to less than 8" will be volitans food - that is about 60% of the fish in the trade. Angels/puffers/triggers can potentially pick on the lions, which are my main interest in the tank. The larger wrasses feed on urchins. The rabbitfish I have is somewhat aggressive towards the Naso tang (who largely ignores the rabbit) but would never tolerate another rabbit in the tank. Anglers can eat fish up to their own size, so they are out. Groupers can be colorful, and are unlikely to eat anything else I have in the tank if I get them small enough, but they grow very quickly and many are ambush predators that hide during the day. Same with the marine betta - colorful, but hides.

What I have winnowed my list down to is either a goatfish, one that is large enough now not to be volitans food, or 3 coral catfish - and hope that they don't become outright hostile to each other when they mature. I could probably get another eel, but one is enough for me at present. I've also floated the admittedly crazy idea of a Moorish Idol to my LFS owner, who agrees it is crazy, but admits that I have a point that I have always had sponges growing well in my tank (Moorish Idols feed on sponges in the wild).

And that's about all the options I have, that are of reasonably available fish.

There are posters who have more experise than I do regarding the tesselated eel, but my impression is that while less aggressive than most eels, they will have a risk of eating something small and slow moving... which pretty well describes scorpions.

 

[smellzlikefish]

hello Sacremon, thanks again,,

Thanks so much for the names of the scorp guys, I will for sure try searching their posts.

Nice set up you have? how many gallons is your tank?

Are your urchins the black spiky ones? Why do you only have 1 of those? I would like to put lots and lots of those in my tank.

Have you ever seen the kind of lionfish in the link i have in my post?

Thanks again for the help

 

[sacremon]

My tank is 72" x 36" wide x 27" tall, 300 gallons. My urchin is red with lines of bright blue spots on it. The spines on top are red/white, the spines near the base are red/white but the last 1/3 to the tip are black. It is quite omnivorous, eating both the nori that I tie to rocks for the tangs/rabbit and will readily take a piece of fish/shellfish when I am feeding the lions and eel.


The lionfish in your linked video is a black colored Pterois volitans, much like mine.

 

[smellzlikefish]

sacremon, Thanks again

Nice tank, its more or less the same size as mine?

Thats nice to hear that the urchin does stuff, I was not expecting the urchins to do anything besides sit there and look spiky.

I will also be looking for more colorful urchins, when the time comes.

Thanks again