Low nutrient systems and sand beds

[DMK]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9239304#post9239304 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by RichConley
Every few days isnt enough. You'd have to change out a filtersock every 20 minutes to keep stuff from breaking down in it. It happens that fast.

every 20 minutes, really... where do u get that number from? i have a 4 year old DSB w/ undetectable NO2 and PO4 and i only change my sock once a week, twice the most. i couldn't imagine ever setting up another tank without a sock.

main thing for success when 1 has a DSB is to have as much flow as possible without creating sandstorm, keeping detritus suspended and getting taken care of by skimmer. also to keep inport and export of nutrients fairly even, more so on the side of export. religious WC and obsessive husbandry will also keep a DSB healthy for long time.

 

[PUGroyale]

Re: Low nutrient systems and sand beds

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9232065#post9232065 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by FoothillCorals
What are the key factors in achieving and maintaining a low nutrient SPS system with out going BB?

Design it as though it were a BB system... and then toss some sand in, hopefully some will stay in place

 

[meschaefer]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9235832#post9235832 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by shelburn61


I now have 7 fish in a 40g and color has never been better. I do run a remote sandbed and chaeto in the fuge however... [/B]

What fish do you keep in your 40g?

I have a 65 with a DSB, and ever since I upgraded my skimmer my corals have gotten lighter in color and I think I need to add some fish. Just can't decide what I should add. I am still in the mind set I was for the previous five years of keeping my fish load low as I didn't have an appropriate skimmer.

 

[Reefer Steve]

I personaly think bare bottomed tanks are very ugly. I would do a thin layer of sand and lots of dispersed flow. Very strong protein skimming, filter floss (swapped out very frequently!), and maybe even play around with some Purigen or GAC. Frequent water changes are nice too

 

[Serioussnaps]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9299599#post9299599 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by meschaefer
What fish do you keep in your 40g?

I have a 65 with a DSB, and ever since I upgraded my skimmer my corals have gotten lighter in color and I think I need to add some fish. Just can't decide what I should add. I am still in the mind set I was for the previous five years of keeping my fish load low as I didn't have an appropriate skimmer.

yellow/blue assessor
blue streak/threadfin cardinals
flasher/fairy/mystery/wrasses


If you have 10 ppm nitrates in a BB....your skimmer is A)not enough or B) your skimmer just sucks or C) you arent doing WC's very often

 

[Serioussnaps]

oh and that last comment wasnt addressed to mesch.....it was to Denedai

 

[Denadai]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9299967#post9299967 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Serioussnaps



If you have 10 ppm nitrates in a BB....your skimmer is A)not enough or B) your skimmer just sucks or C) you arent doing WC's very often

I have a becket skimmer for 300G and my reef has only 160G and I do 10% WC every week with RO+DI water and tropic marin salt

But I used to have 6 tangs...now I have just 3.....let´s see if now works...and also I´m using ultralith system

Regards

 

[eskymick]

Perhaps a denitrator is the best "insurance policy" for a bb system?

 

[fishfanatic06]

I have a dsb. I run prodibio with it. The probiotic bacterias interact with the DSB to keep nutrients at a minimum. Zeovit tanks are typically bare bottom. How do they keep nutrients super low? The zeorocks. The zeobacterias interact with these rocks similar to the probiotic bacterias interaction with a dsb. This interaction helps keep nutrients low. If you went barebottom, I would suggest having a dsb in the sump for denitrification.
JMO

 

[fishfanatic06]

Isn't the ultralith system suppose to keep your nitrates low? BTW, how do you like it? Have your colors improved at all?

 

[Denadai]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9301254#post9301254 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by fishfanatic06
Isn't the ultralith system suppose to keep your nitrates low? BTW, how do you like it? Have your colors improved at all?

In theory yes...but after a month my nitrate is still 10 ppm......I didn´t notice any change in my colors.....

 

[Leonardo_]

I have BB tank, and very low nitrates... (unmeasurable with Salifert) The only thing I do is the basics of BB, heavy flow, heavy skimming.

I do feed a lot, have many fish too. I think a BB tank with high nitrates is not setup well. (underrated skimmer etc.)

Leonardo

 

[reefkoi]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9239304#post9239304 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by RichConley
Every few days isnt enough. You'd have to change out a filtersock every 20 minutes to keep stuff from breaking down in it. It happens that fast.

o.k. what exactly do you mean by "breaking down" and why is that bad?
Is'nt everything broke down by natural process in a reef tank?

I mean I know your talking the perfect world utopia theory here but really is it that significant?

Chris

 

[foshizzle]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9305043#post9305043 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by reefkoi
o.k. what exactly do you mean by "breaking down" and why is that bad?
Is'nt everything broke down by natural process in a reef tank?

I mean I know your talking the perfect world utopia theory here but really is it that significant?

Chris

The trapped particulates are broken down into NO3 and PO4 rather than being completely removed from the system by a skimmer

 

[reefkoi]

o.k. so if the NO3 and PO4 are undetectable by testing then I guess its o.k. to use a sock? Or are socks a complete waste of time and money?
what other means do you suggest for clear water then? I mean with an internal skimmer I cant have the water feed direct from the tank, in a sense it already does via the overflow but most will go right on by the skimmer and head to the return pump.
Maybe my whole system is junk and I need to match the flow from the tank to exactly the same as what the skimmer processes do you think?

If so I'd be pretty low through there I think but maybe this is the best way to achieve clear water?

Thanks,
Chris

 

[reefkoi]

BTW I do seem to have clear water now with the socks but I guess I need to get on the ball and do some testing.

 

[MrPike]

Socks are not going to improve the clarity of your water. Not to the extent that ozone will by removing yellowing.

What rich was getting at is that socks will take particles, trap them, and those particles will break down into nitrate and phosphate in your aquarium. Instead, you can just skim them out where they will break down into nitrate and phosphate again, but this time in your skimmer cup that you empty out.

Personally, I see no reason for filter socks. They remove perfectly good plankton, detritus, and other things that feed corals. Testing your water and finding out that you have zero nitrates and phosphates is not good enough. Algae can easily consume these elements before they build up in your water to a high enough degree to be testable. I have never had testable levels of nitrate or phosphate, but I know when my nutrients are getting out of control by how frequently I have to scrape my front glass. If its every day or every other day, thats way to much. Time for a water change or time to skim a little wetter then normal, time to replace my carbon and rowa, whatever I need to do.

 

[reefkoi]

hmm interesting, I have no problem algae, I only clean the glass once a week and I change 10% water per week. Maybe its the high amount of water changes that are doing the trick. well thanks anyway for the info, I guess if I have problems in the future I'll know what to do then.
Chris

 

[jcr6479]

And why is it everyone's goal to not clean the front glass more that once per week. Once scraped, does this not serve as food for sps and other filter feeding inverts?

 

[reefkoi]

not my goal at all, I fiddle with the tank daily, I was merely responding to MR Pikes comment that seeing algae build up daily or everyother is an indication of nutrients. I simply dont see it accumulate sooner than 5-7 days. If you had a 600 gallon tank with 3 sides viewable you'd understand why I dont want to scrape it daily