Low nutrient systems and sand beds

[msuzuki126]

MrPike, don't we want our systems detritus free? I change my filter socks daily and it's incredible how my socks turn from white to brown in just one day. Filter socks satisfy me and if I'm removing all the junk daily I'm happy. Also, I have no more microbubbles going through my sump.

 

[jcr6479]

I agree that you might have a nutrient problem if you have to scrape daily but once is week is normal imo and healthy for the system as long as nutrient export is sufficient.

 

[jcr6479]

I also use a filter sock. Nutrient accumulation in the fiter sock is okay with me becuase withhout it it would be on my sump bottom and I much rather change a fiter sock every few days than vaccum the sump bottom. I don't think there is a single skimmer that will prevent detris accumulation unless it is fed from the overflow and that is just not practical with most in sump skimmers.

 

[msuzuki126]

Also, there's no way the overflow fed skimmer would take out everything like a filter sock would. The filter socks take out both large and small particles. When I didn't have filter socks, I even had detritus build up in the bottom of my skimmer.

 

[gcarroll]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9310042#post9310042 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by jcr6479
I also use a filter sock. Nutrient accumulation in the fiter sock is okay with me becuase withhout it it would be on my sump bottom and I much rather change a fiter sock every few days than vaccum the sump bottom. I don't think there is a single skimmer that will prevent detris accumulation unless it is fed from the overflow and that is just not practical with most in sump skimmers.

I run a filter sock regularly. I change it every 2-3 days. I have not had any nutrient issues related to this filtration method.

 

[reefkoi]

well I dont use ozone because I use Prodibio, and its not part of the method to use ozone. I never have an yellow water, it is merely the floaties that I am trying to pull out of the tank with the socks.

I can respect the idea that a skimmer is a better way, really on paper that is 100% true. But is it realistic? I dont think it is. Unless somebody out there has a sump designed to allow the skimmer to pull out 100% of the detritus, leftover food, e.t.c. as it passes by the skimmer I'd love to see it, that would be the ultimate I think.

 

[Gary Majchrzak]

after years of experimenting on and off with mechanical filtration I think it's a good idea to employ it (no matter what your substrate choice is) to help acheive a low nutrient system.

 

[JER-Z]

i use a diamond goby to stir up the SSB with about 50x turnover of flow...Heavy Skimming and Ultralith System.

the sand is as white as the day i dumped the bag in.

 

[reefmatenate]

another controversy LOL

I run a ssb on my 65 gallon with no filter socks at all I also run a euroreef rs80 protein skimmer when I feed I notice that no sooner than five minutes after I do so that bristle worms, starfish and every other little critters hidden in the rocks come out and devour what food is uneaten by the fish my phosphates have always been at zero and unless I stir the sand bed so are my trates so for me I will go out on a limb instead of arguing and say DO WHAT WORKS BEST FOR YOU AND WHAT YOUR HEART SAYS. if your having success with it and things are growing and thriving then I would say your doing well and keep it up. if not then change something.

THERE I SETTLED THE FIGHT

back to your corners boys

 

[chrisd1009]

Design it as though it were a BB system... and then toss some sand in, hopefully some will stay in place

From my stand point, this was probably my favorite comment. It's exactly what I do. I also don't treat my bed as "plug and play". I change some sand out every year.
PO4 reactors are a great tool for nutrient removal from any tank. I swear by them.
FWIW, just because I've seen it brought up here quite a bit, I too use filter socks and I'll never run a system again without them. I change them out as frequently as possible.
180 DSB w/ 60 gallon sump
PO4: 0.01 on Hanna
NO3: undetectable on Seachem kit (I know it's not the best kit and the reading is possibly wrong)

 

[250G]

Well I like my filter bags and I'm sticking to it!!!

Other approaches I use incorporate include only putting flake food and spirulina tablets in the tank for the animals (and sometimes GP and/or cyclopeze). No brine, mysis, krill ect.

Other than that I use a use good becket skimmer with good contact time, and a pump that give me 4x's+ tank turnover). I am not using carbon, phosphate remover, ozone ect. in the system, and my water is crystal clear. I do only have about 10 fish in a 275.

I clean the glass proactively every day (or from time to time every other day) and have not had to scrape coraline from the 3 viewable side in a year. There is always a light film after 24 hours and a film after 48 hours, yet, my tank looks like one of those "zeo" tanks I am told...I have also only done 1 water change in the last 2 years...great hobby when everyone can do things differently and still achieve great results isn't it?

 

[chrisd1009]

great hobby when everyone can do things differently and still achieve great results isn't it?

so true

 

[MrPike]

I think the term "detritus" gets a bad name. I think its bad depending on its location. Sitting under some rocks and rotting, or in the bottom of my sump, then its a problem. But if its suspended in my water column, then its good. Corals eat very fine particles, such as pulvurized fish poop, bacteria, mucous, ect. This is all that detritus is. It just seems silly to me that we feed our corals, trap it out with socks, clean the socks. Why not feed, and try and keep the particles in suspension to be exported via coral growth/bio mass.

Just my opinion, I agree socks can probably help export stuff from your water if regularly maintained.

 

[Gary Majchrzak]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9324080#post9324080 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by MrPike
I think the term "detritus" gets a bad name. I think its bad depending on its location. Sitting under some rocks and rotting, or in the bottom of my sump, then its a problem. But if its suspended in my water column, then its good. Corals eat very fine particles, such as pulvurized fish poop, bacteria, mucous, ect. This is all that detritus is. It just seems silly to me that we feed our corals, trap it out with socks, clean the socks. Why not feed, and try and keep the particles in suspension to be exported via coral growth/bio mass.

Detritus is more than fish poo, bacteria and mucous. Orthophosphates can inhibit calcification.
The average reef aquarium probably contains more than enough detritus to feed the corals in it- even when using mechanical filtration. Now if you're trying to maintain a clean SPS type environment, I'd imagine you'd want to keep nutrients lower than the average reef aquarium.