Marine Velvet?

[cas1069]

i have a 220gal dt and had the bad luck of a marine velvet outbreak that killed off all but two of my fish around the first week of august. ive been doing water changes about every 2 weeks and running a uv 24/7. the 2 fish that survived are a yellow corris wrasse and a sailfin tang of the desjardinii type. the tang was looking very bad and was written off as a lost but for two weeks now has fully healed up and shows none of the velvet. my question is how long should i wait before trying to add any new fish. i'm in no real hurry as the last thing i want to do is give the velvet a chance to comeback and kill off one of my favorite fish but i also want to restock my tank at some point and was looking for ideas of how long i should be waiting as ive never had to deal with this before

 

[ThRoewer]

Did the fish survive due to being treated or did they "beat it" on their own.

In the latter case I would remove them from the display tank and treat them for 3 weeks with Chloroquine diphosphate (CP, NLS Ick-Shield Powder) to make sure they are not partially immune carriers of the disease.

The display tank needs to stay fallow for at least 6 weeks.

 

[snorvich]

Did the fish survive due to being treated or did they "beat it" on their own.

In the latter case I would remove them from the display tank and treat them for 3 weeks with Chloroquine diphosphate (CP, NLS Ick-Shield Powder) to make sure they are not partially immune carriers of the disease.

The display tank needs to stay fallow for at least 6 weeks.

This.

 

[curtcherry]

This.

What is going on with marine velvet!? It seems to be hitting in a lot of places.

 

[cas1069]

Did the fish survive due to being treated or did they "beat it" on their own.

In the latter case I would remove them from the display tank and treat them for 3 weeks with Chloroquine diphosphate (CP, NLS Ick-Shield Powder) to make sure they are not partially immune carriers of the disease.

The display tank needs to stay fallow for at least 6 weeks.

the only thing i was able to due was feed good food loaded with selcon, i didn't see a point in stressing out a fish that was all ready sick by trying to catch it.

and thanks for the 6week window ill give it a bit longer just to be safeish, as far as why everyone is getting velvet i don't have an answer but from what i've seen at one of the lfs it is coming direct from the wholesalers....

 

[Taahirs]

Your tank needs to be fishless for 6 weeks. So you need to take your two fish out. Then treat them as advised by @ThRoewer

 

[curtcherry]

My local LFS is where o got my marine velvet from. Come to find out he doesn't have a QT system. He puts everything straight into DTs. All his systems are hooked together. Don't do business with him anymore. Tried keeping 4 fish in QT with meds and couldn't. They all died they were so far infected when I got them.

 

[Deinonych]

My local LFS is where o got my marine velvet from. Come to find out he doesn't have a QT system. He puts everything straight into DTs. All his systems are hooked together. Don't do business with him anymore. Tried keeping 4 fish in QT with meds and couldn't. They all died they were so far infected when I got them.

For what it's worth, no LFS can provide adequate QT due to the nature of the business (high livestock turnover, connected systems etc.)

 

[curtcherry]

Agreed. This LFS doesn't even have a QT system. Regardless, anything he now sells is dying. Even in the DTs in the store.

 

[cas1069]

Your tank needs to be fishless for 6 weeks. So you need to take your two fish out. Then treat them as advised by @ThRoewer

ok ill give them a week or 2 more b4 i stress them out and move them to my qt tank and than start the clock for my dt

thanks again for the help

 

[curtcherry]

If it is marine velvet, you won't have two weeks. You might have 2 days. I had a run in with marine velvet last month. In 5 days everything was gone...

 

[ThRoewer]

If it is marine velvet, you won't have two weeks. You might have 2 days. I had a run in with marine velvet last month. In 5 days everything was gone...

These are survivors of an outbreak. They are either naturally immune or acquired enough immunity due to a previous, non-lethal contact to survive. The planned treatment is just a precaution in case they still carry the parasite without being sick and symptomatic.

Sent from my XT1254 using Tapatalk

 

[curtcherry]

Everything I have read and what I know about infectious diseases is that exposure and survival to parasites will give an immunity for a period of time. Reading says 6 months or so... However, their is a good chance that the host will be susceptible to the parasite again down the road due to diminished immunity. Makes sense to me. Once we/you get a cold/flu, you often don't get the same strain again for a period of time, but bound to get it again in the future. Concur?

 

[microlady]

Everything I have read and what I know about infectious diseases is that exposure and survival to parasites will give an immunity for a period of time. Reading says 6 months or so... However, their is a good chance that the host will be susceptible to the parasite again down the road due to diminished immunity. Makes sense to me. Once we/you get a cold/flu, you often don't get the same strain again for a period of time, but bound to get it again in the future. Concur?

I don't concur, because parasites differ in their ability to cause infection, and our immune response varies depending on which type of parasite is contracted. It is very hard to make a blanket comparison. Influenza is a virus, and C. irritans and Oodinum are eukaryotes. They have completely different life cycles and hosts. Viruses even behave differently too. HIV is completely different than Influenza. Studies have shown some partial immunity can be obtained to marine velvet, but not enough studies have been done to show exactly for how long and in which strains. A strict quarantine protocol is the best strategy for handling this parasite. If it does get into your tank, then a 6-8 week fishless period is necessary or it could come back.

 

[curtcherry]

Good point. I overlooked parasite vs virus.

 

[snorvich]

I don't concur, because parasites differ in their ability to cause infection, and our immune response varies depending on which type of parasite is contracted. It is very hard to make a blanket comparison. Influenza is a virus, and C. irritans and Oodinum are eukaryotes. They have completely different life cycles and hosts. Viruses even behave differently too. HIV is completely different than Influenza. Studies have shown some partial immunity can be obtained to marine velvet, but not enough studies have been done to show exactly for how long and in which strains. A strict quarantine protocol is the best strategy for handling this parasite. If it does get into your tank, then a 6-8 week fishless period is necessary or it could come back.

Good advice.

 

[microlady]

Thanks! I learned the most about proper quarantine from you guys here on RC!

 

[ThRoewer]

The immune responses to viruses are different than those against protozoans, monogeneans and all the other small skin parasites.

The immune response against viruses is like in humans with antibodies.

The response against protozoan and parasitic flatworms may be more complex but nevertheless effective as well in many cases. I collected a couple of links to research articles that go more into detail if you are interested to understand it better: http://reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2544292

In theory you can immunize fish against a fairly large number of parasites by just exposing them and then cleaning them up. Though there is hardly ever a guarantee that the immunization will result in a full immunity.

This means one should never take a gamble and trust on a fish's immunity with such virulent parasites as Amyloodinium, Brooklynella, Monoganeans,...

But it is important to consider that a new fish who looks perfectly healthy after even months in QT can still harbor parasites that may be dangerous to other fish. This is often behind sudden outbreaks of certain parasites, especially Brooklynella which is less "airborne" but primarily transmitted by direct contact.

Alone for that reason it is often better to QT several fish together. One fish may be immune enough to stay symptom free for months, but with several it is rather unlikely.
I now also stress test new fish to decrease the likelihood of an occult infection slipping through.

The only parasite I do not worry too much about and actually calculate on immunity to is Cryptocaryon.

 

[SeaTila]

My Desjardin also survived [with a hogfish] a very bad outbreak 4 months ago. Before I knew how bad it would be there was no time to treat. I was going to try to make my DT fallow but didnt want to move my large Desjardin to a 29g. She definity got it but then it cleared up. Some it took 2 days...my black and white clown lived 7 days before he succumbed and he was sugar coated. When I first saw it I hought it was fine sand after moving rock. Anyway I waited about a month in DT without changes...no med in DT...and didnt fallow the tank. I was very nervous about adding fish. I was QTing new fish when heater in QT wasnt turning off as it should...not wanting to risk cooked fish overnight I aclimated them to the DT a coupld of months ago and so far it has not come back...fingers crossed and knocking on wood. I would aggressively treat cupramine if I saw it come back in early stage.

 

[cas1069]

Im happy this has helped others with this good info