need help fast anyone please

[reefD]

okay water parameters are on.


all three at zero. salinity is at 1.023-24. temp is at 72. ph is at 8.2 . the female is eating just as before...eating mysis enriched. the male isnt eating. i tried live brine mysis and even daphnia. he used to eat mysis. the female only eats mysis now and also ignores the other foods. the male will rush up on a mysis piece and when it looks like he is gonna eat it up he backs away. again the femal is doing great. what gives. its been three days and he is looking bad (really thin) but still rushes up on food (mysis only) and when it looks like he is gonbna eat it he doesnt. did it today. please help he is gonna starve!

 

[NanoLurker]

see if you can get your hands on small FW ghost shrimp - getting them small enough is the hard part. try feeding him that. it's good that he's tracking and showing hunting behavior. don't know how your finances are but i would also see if you can get some live mysid or white shrimp. i order the mysid from reed mariculture, white shrimp from seawaterexpress.com.

how long have you had the horses? what species? were they CB? anything new to the tank?

 

[sarahbab]

You know, sounds a lot like the symptoms that my seahorses had. I lost both of mine just recently. I had tried quarentine and many different types of meds including anti fungals and antibiotics. Mine would'nt eat ghost shrimp or the live brine that I put into my tank. I had to tube feed mine, but you can't do that forever. I really hope that someone posts who can help you. Good luck to you!!

 

[pledosophy]

Have you added anything to the tank in the last six weeks?

Is there any history of disease in the tank?

Is he making a snick at food and not able to form enough suction to eat it, or does he make no attempt at all?

Is there any discoloration on his snout, tail, or sides?

Are all of your seahorses from the same source? Where? The same species?

If you can get freshwater ghosts try it. They need to be small. If you want to go the saltwater feeder route then order from seawaterexpress.com so you are certain you are not intorudcing parasites into your system. Slat water feeders can be dangerous especially to an ailling horse, but seawater's are pathogen free.

If you can get him to eat supplement his food with beta glucan, and your other horses as well for that matter. You can find it at your local health food store. It is an immunostimulant and will help them fight off any form of disease naturally. Good for the healthy horse who has been exposed, good for the other horse, especially if he needs antibiotics.


Usually to me annorexia is a sign of a bacterial infection. I would treat with Neo 3 if the time comes for that. Do you have any? If not order from seahorsesource.com. You can buy the meds seperately and treat, however the dosage on Neo3 is formulated just for seahorses, and the meds by themselves seem to be much more expensive. Seahorses need a higher dose of most antibiotics because the bacteria they carry (usually and hopefully a strain of vibrio) is vey resilant to antibiotic medications. Many people ahve tried various antibiotics at the incorrect dosages and lost there horses. this is not a concern with Neo3. If your going to make an order from seahorsessource.com, might want to throw in a tube feeding tube incase it comes to that.

I would treat in a barebottom 10g tank with no filter and no biomedia. You will need to perform daily 50% WC's. Slowly drop the hospital tank temperature down to at least 68F, a little lower is O.K.

Sorry your going through this. I would post your story on seahorse.org in the emergency forum and see if one of the experts like DianeB can chime in. There are a few good people over there who really know alot about this. What I know I learned from them.

Good Luck. Be strong. Sorry you have to go through this.

 

[DanU]

I would get your quarantine tank and medications lined up in case you have to treat with antibiotics. In the interim, if the seahorse doesn't have any external signs of illness I would consider a FW Dip. Parasites in the snout can stop them from eating. A FW Dip needs to be done in temp and ph matched water for 8 to 10 minutes. Quite often they will thrash about. This is a sign that it is working. Unless the horse stops breathing, go the full 8 to 10 minutes. When this works, they usually begin eating within 24 hours. If it works you will also want to follow it up with either a course of formalin treatment or a 6 week hyposalinity treatment.

Dan

 

[reefD]

thanks guys. ok a few weeks ago i had a small goby in there with them that showed ich. i removed him since. other than that the sick horse doesnt have any signs odf desease. he doesnty appear to have an issue with his snick as he doesnt even attemp to use it. all of my foods are soaked in selcon. the horses are CB from the same place. the have been in this tank for about 10 weeks. i will try a freshwater dip today. i can get some freshwater shrimp but it might be hard getting them small. again the female is doing great. the male will go after food but as soon as he gets close to it ...as if he might eat it...he backs away. he shows no signs of anything on his body. no patches on it or tail. ill keep everyone updated. thank youooo sooo much!

 

[sloshesv]

Good luck, buddy.

 

[reefD]

i cant get any freshwatre shrimp small enough! agrr im gonna do the freshwater dip right now. i hope this works! ok i did it for 4 minutes 25 secondsi know i should of gone longer but he looked like he was super stressed. never stopped breathing though. again now he is stressed out! he did thrash about at times. female is as happy as can be swiming lovely and looking for food everytime i go near the tank. gonna feed her now. any other info please. ill keep the update going.

 

[DanU]

They will look super stressed if they have a high parasite load. The osmotic difference drives the parasites nuts and makes them burst. If these are imbedded in the gills or snout it will be an immediate irritation. 4 minutes may help, but it may not be long enough to thoroughly wipe out the little buggers.

Dan

 

[reefD]

ok dan ill try it again in a few hours. he was also shooting out small particles through his mouth and gills is this a good sign of the infestation of parasites? also how low should i bring down the salinity in the tank? its just for the horses so i can treat it like a qt tank.

 

[reefD]

also dan would parasites make him go after food...aproach it really close...then just not eat it? i was under the impression that he wouldnt even go near food if he had parasites? its been 5 days now and he hasnt eaten nothing! but still chases it as if he wants to eat it....

 

[NanoLurker]

if his parasite load is so high that you see them coming out his snout and his gills, then it's quite possible that while he wants to eat - it is uncomfortable for him to do so. i'll tell you that i've battled my share of parasites lately and the horses would not touch tiny 1/4" - 1/2" white feeder shrimp. they would track and follow the feeder shrimp but would not snick. fortunately, i had live mysid on hand and they ate that. my theory, and it's only that, is that they choose the smallest, softest, food to eat because that caused the least discomfort.

dan - do you think a formalin bath is in order here as well? i'm a little concerned about the amount of material coming off the horse.

reefD - do you have any antibiotics on hand? not to treat at this moment, but anytime you have high parasite loads secondary bacterial infections can occur and it's better to have some stuff on hand as a "just in case". also, do you have access to a microscope?

 

[reefD]

HA HA! im sooo happy. ok dan i did the frshwater dip for only 4 minutes but it must of been enough to releave the issue. cause after 24hrs he is eating again! now dan should i do another full 8 minute fresh water bath today to ensure all parasites are gone. also should i be worried about the other female horse being infected? should i give her a fresh water dip? also you said that if this works i should lower the salinity in the tank. what should i lower it to?
nano lurker. i tried everything to feed him whi;le he wasnt eating. all even very very small/baby brine. so it wasnt an issue of getting smaller food. anyways he is now eating the stuff he always used to eat. i will keep an eye for a secondary infection but i really think that these capitive breed seahorses are very hardy and wont get a secondary infection.
man i can believe how just over night he has inproved!
dan please let me know if i should do another freshwater dip....on the female that has been eating?...and how low should i put the salinity and how long. thanks! you saved my seahorse!

 

[reefD]

If it works you will also want to follow it up with either a course of formalin treatment or a 6 week hyposalinity treatment

this is qouted from you dan. so if i do hyposalinity i dont need to use formalin dip? or if i use formalin dip i dont need to use hyposalinity?

 

[DanU]

he was also shooting out small particles through his mouth and gills is this a good sign of the infestation of parasites?

Most likely.

would parasites make him go after food...aproach it really close...then just not eat it?

Quite possibly.

i was under the impression that he wouldnt even go near food if he had parasites?

Not necessarily true IME.

do you think a formalin bath is in order here as well?

I would consider that or a Hyposalinity Treatment.

i can believe how just over night he has inproved!

Usually the improvement is within 24 hours post dip.

let me know if i should do another freshwater dip....on the female that has been eating?...and how low should i put the salinity and how long.

so if i do hyposalinity i dont need to use formalin dip? or if i use formalin dip i dont need to use hyposalinity?

My personal preference is to do a long term formalin bath. Formalin bath takes 6 days of therapy where hyposalinity takes 6 weeks. Besides the time frame issue, some parasites can withstand hyposalinty treatments and I don't trust must inexpensive refractometers. If you are off on the salinity reading, it prove useless if it is too high and too low is not good for the horses.

I would consider treating both the horses.

Depending upon what is in the tank, you will most likely need to do the formalin treatment in a hospital tank. Formalin is given at 25 mg/L or 1 ml per 10 gallons every other day for 3 doses.

Hyposalinity is done by lowering the salinity to 1.010 to 1.011 for 6 weeks. After the course of treatment, the salinity is gradually (over several days) increased back to normal.

Hope that helps.

Dan

 

[sloshesv]

This is great news!

 

[reefD]

ok dan i really dont want to set up a hospital tank. so im gonna try the hyposalinity. by the way cheap hydrometers have been out of my vocabulary for years. i only use a temperature compensation refractometer that is also able to be calerbrated with solutioncost me about 100$. i check the calibrations often. anyways maybe it will be better to set up a hospital tank as i do have shrimp and hermits in the tank with the horses. they probably wont tolerate the hyposalinity right? or wrong? i mean if the pepermint shrimp and hermits can handle the salinity then ill do it there. one last question should i do another freshwater dip on the male? how about the female? is it worth it as i only did it for 4 minutes before remember. let me know dan. thanks again. im so happy to see the male aka seabiscuit eating again after 5 days!

 

[reefD]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=7429154#post7429154 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by sloshesv
This is great news!

your telling me! yesterday and for the previouse 4 days he would swim up to the frozen mysis get really close and not eat it. today! the first piece of mysis that came close to him he tracked it...got close to it and snicked it up. after that first taste he began snicking up other bits. im soo happy ......five days this guy didnt eat and now i im about 85% sure he is gonna make a turn around.

 

[reefD]

ok dan i just spoke to a buddy and he said i could also consider doing daily formalin dips for about 45 minutes at a time. i have formalin 3 product by kordon. can i use that? anyways if i do these dips daily for 40 minutes or so do you think it would be more effective than the hyposalinity? i know it wouldnt be better than the QT tank and keeping them in there for 6 days but would it be more effective than the hyposalinity idea. ? thanks alot.

 

[DanU]

David, I answered the pm. Formalin 3 by Kordon should be fine.

Dan