Need help for my weird situation
- Thread starter Iam
- Start date
kraze3
New member
drsfostersmith.com has a coralife super skimmer 125 for 114 n change. Ive heard great things about them heres a thread
http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=563298&perpage=25&pagenumber=1
http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=563298&perpage=25&pagenumber=1
Randall_James
Premium Member
Nitrites are converted to nitrates that are converted to nitrogen gas, the ammonia was converted to nitrites if I recall my nitrogen cycle correctly
Hi Iam
To answer your question about nitrates lets start at the beginning. The nitrogen cycle begins with the presents of ammonium. Ammonium is introduced into your system in several ways. Feed remnants, feces, and die off. If PH levels are 8.4+ part of the ammonium is present as more toxic ammonia. So it is important to monitor PH levels when ammonium is present.
There are bacteria in your tank that convert ammonium into harmless compounds. There are two different types of bacteria that complete this process in two distinct stages. The process is called nitrification. The first bacteria consumes the ammonium and the byproduct is nitrite. Hence the nitrite level begins to rise. Another bacteria then begins converting the nitrite into nitrate. The final stage in the nitrogen cycle is called denitrification (removal of nitrate). This being a cycle, the presents of nitrate can only exist as a result of the presents of nitrite which can only exist as a result of the presents of ammonium.
To answer your question about nitrates lets start at the beginning. The nitrogen cycle begins with the presents of ammonium. Ammonium is introduced into your system in several ways. Feed remnants, feces, and die off. If PH levels are 8.4+ part of the ammonium is present as more toxic ammonia. So it is important to monitor PH levels when ammonium is present.
There are bacteria in your tank that convert ammonium into harmless compounds. There are two different types of bacteria that complete this process in two distinct stages. The process is called nitrification. The first bacteria consumes the ammonium and the byproduct is nitrite. Hence the nitrite level begins to rise. Another bacteria then begins converting the nitrite into nitrate. The final stage in the nitrogen cycle is called denitrification (removal of nitrate). This being a cycle, the presents of nitrate can only exist as a result of the presents of nitrite which can only exist as a result of the presents of ammonium.
Randall_James
Premium Member
You forgot about the anoxic regions of the live rock /and / or dsb that now convert the nitrates to nitrogen gas
ammonia > nitrites > nitrates > nitrogen
ammonia > nitrites > nitrates > nitrogen
Kurt03
Active member
ammonia was converted to nitrite, then your nitrite was converted to nitrate, its just nothing is converting your nitrate to anything else. To lower your nitrates people do water changes with rodi water to dilute the trates, or use macro algae to consume the trates, also a DSB turns your nitrates into nitrogen gas that disipates out of the water. If this is a fish only tank 20 trates is ok, of course still shoot for near 0 though.
ammonia is the most deadly to your fish, then nitrite then nitrate.
-edit-
When first starting your cycle you will get a build up of ammonia until your nitrite bacteria is buildup, then you will get a build up of nitrite untill your nitrate bactera is built up. Then your nitrates are stuck unless you use one of the above methods, im sure theres other methods as well.
ammonia is the most deadly to your fish, then nitrite then nitrate.
-edit-
When first starting your cycle you will get a build up of ammonia until your nitrite bacteria is buildup, then you will get a build up of nitrite untill your nitrate bactera is built up. Then your nitrates are stuck unless you use one of the above methods, im sure theres other methods as well.
What your not understanding Iam is that the ammonia that is created ( think pee ) is always in the tank as long as you have critters in there. Imagine a billion tiny bacteria that only feed on one thing, ammonia.. They sit there in stasis waiting, once an ammonia molecule floats by its grabed and eaten. Same thing for Nitrite.
So the end result is that your test kits never read ammonia or Nitrite because those substances are almost instantly converted into NitrATE. From your inital post this is what concerned me, you said you had elevated level of NitrITE, this would seem to indicate that your biological filter was off-balance. This is usally do to a sudden spike in ammonia due to the introduction of too much livestock, or the death and subsequent rotting of livestock...
If you biological filter is healthy and working you should never see Nitrite or ammonia, they are consumed by the bacteria before the levels reach high enough for your tests to measure it.
So the end result is that your test kits never read ammonia or Nitrite because those substances are almost instantly converted into NitrATE. From your inital post this is what concerned me, you said you had elevated level of NitrITE, this would seem to indicate that your biological filter was off-balance. This is usally do to a sudden spike in ammonia due to the introduction of too much livestock, or the death and subsequent rotting of livestock...
If you biological filter is healthy and working you should never see Nitrite or ammonia, they are consumed by the bacteria before the levels reach high enough for your tests to measure it.
Thank you all... now i am beginning to learn... thank you ...thank you... did I say thank you..
Now here is what i am planning to do..
Since i have only one damsel left..
50% water change...
add another powerhead...
add a protein skimmer
wait for another 6-7 weeks before adding any fish..
how does this sound????
thank you so muchh
Now here is what i am planning to do..
Since i have only one damsel left..
50% water change...
add another powerhead...
add a protein skimmer
wait for another 6-7 weeks before adding any fish..
how does this sound????
thank you so muchh
angelsj247
New member
yes sounds good and raise your salinity its to low.
Hi,
The water that your lfs sells for $0.50 is probably RO/DI. The saltwater (SW) they sell should be made with that water and a synthetic sea salt. Around here some grocery and discount stores sell RO water from those big water dispensing machines and that is OK too. The kind of water you get delivered may be spring water, it tastes good but may have compounds that are not good for your tank. I usually make my SW because it is cheaper than buying SW from the lfs. I usually use RO/DI water but have used RO water from the dispensing machine at Wal-Mart. I recently had surgery and have been buying SW at the lfs because it is easier.
I think that you are waiting too long to add top off water. It is better for your tank if you add a smaller volume more frequently. I add a gallon or so to my 54 gallon tank every couple of days.
There are a variety of opinions on how often to do water changes and what volume to change. I personally do a 10% change in my tank every week.
The TalkingReef has a couple of podcasts on cycling your tank. You can find them at www.talkingreef.com or the iTunes music store. If you don't have an iPod or MP3 player you still can download iTunes to your computer and listen there. Both the podcasts and iTunes are free. I like to listen in my car
The water that your lfs sells for $0.50 is probably RO/DI. The saltwater (SW) they sell should be made with that water and a synthetic sea salt. Around here some grocery and discount stores sell RO water from those big water dispensing machines and that is OK too. The kind of water you get delivered may be spring water, it tastes good but may have compounds that are not good for your tank. I usually make my SW because it is cheaper than buying SW from the lfs. I usually use RO/DI water but have used RO water from the dispensing machine at Wal-Mart. I recently had surgery and have been buying SW at the lfs because it is easier.
I think that you are waiting too long to add top off water. It is better for your tank if you add a smaller volume more frequently. I add a gallon or so to my 54 gallon tank every couple of days.
There are a variety of opinions on how often to do water changes and what volume to change. I personally do a 10% change in my tank every week.
The TalkingReef has a couple of podcasts on cycling your tank. You can find them at www.talkingreef.com or the iTunes music store. If you don't have an iPod or MP3 player you still can download iTunes to your computer and listen there. Both the podcasts and iTunes are free. I like to listen in my car
Randall_James
Premium Member
actually waiting that long to add fish again could backfire. You have induced the cycle and the bacteria are now working away at reproducing in order to consume the ammonia. If you wait 6 or 7 weeks to reintroduce fish again, you will in fact induce another cycle as the bacteria that grew to consume the ammonia will starve out and die.
So I would let things settle down (ammonia 0) and add 1 fish, that will add some more ammonia to the mix and keep the bacteria going.
As far as the nitrate levels go, it was said that there was nothing to consume them and convert them to nitrogen and that is not exactly true. The live rock in your system is there to do just that. As long as the bacteria levels are maintained, you will be good. Just keep in mind when ever you add any bio matter (fish, fish food or any other waste) it will produce ammonia as it decomposes.
As a tank ages and gets more stuff in it, the capacity to consume the fatal ammonia and convert it becomes better as the bacteria becomes better established.
So I would let things settle down (ammonia 0) and add 1 fish, that will add some more ammonia to the mix and keep the bacteria going.
As far as the nitrate levels go, it was said that there was nothing to consume them and convert them to nitrogen and that is not exactly true. The live rock in your system is there to do just that. As long as the bacteria levels are maintained, you will be good. Just keep in mind when ever you add any bio matter (fish, fish food or any other waste) it will produce ammonia as it decomposes.
As a tank ages and gets more stuff in it, the capacity to consume the fatal ammonia and convert it becomes better as the bacteria becomes better established.
I recommend a topoff system, to keep that salinity more even: I got one from autotopoff. com, the deluxe kit, which is under a hundred, and runs from a bucket with pump to deliver fresh water to a pre-set fill line 24/7. I have an old salt bucket with a pump and hose, and a hole in the hose to break the siphon set up by the pump. That's one.
A skimmer is really a good thing, too. I use an Urchin, which is pretty economical as skimmers go: fits in the sump, very small footprint. A sump can be as simple as a Rubbermaid tub with a water entry, a barrier of some sort, be it only a plastic box to quiet the flow, and a return pump.
With those three items, you're a lot more automated and your tank will be less prone to spikes and fluctuations in conditions.
A skimmer is really a good thing, too. I use an Urchin, which is pretty economical as skimmers go: fits in the sump, very small footprint. A sump can be as simple as a Rubbermaid tub with a water entry, a barrier of some sort, be it only a plastic box to quiet the flow, and a return pump.
With those three items, you're a lot more automated and your tank will be less prone to spikes and fluctuations in conditions.
thank you all
Sk8r, Randall_James, lfjewett (and all others)
I started understanding the saltwater better now.. I understood that there is a looootttt to understand..
I came back home and started my new bakpak 2... the container started collecting the bubbles..
Anybody know how high the container should be?
Has anybody used bakpak 2? ..how long will it take before I see that mud/coffee loking liquid in the container????
And Randall James.. I am keeping one damsel in the tank right know.. besides that I have one seastar.. several hermit crabs..
Sk8r, Randall_James, lfjewett (and all others)
I started understanding the saltwater better now.. I understood that there is a looootttt to understand..
I came back home and started my new bakpak 2... the container started collecting the bubbles..
Anybody know how high the container should be?
Has anybody used bakpak 2? ..how long will it take before I see that mud/coffee loking liquid in the container????
And Randall James.. I am keeping one damsel in the tank right know.. besides that I have one seastar.. several hermit crabs..
Randall_James
Premium Member
Pretty steep learning curve huh? 
Good Luck
Good Luck
Below is taken from this link
Feeding: It likes to eat Eats meathy bits of seafood and detritus. Also will eat corals, anemones, urchins, crustaceans, small fish and anything else it can catch..
General notes: The Chocolate Chip Sea Stars have dull spines, bumps or knobs on their dorsal surface often in contrasting colors. This species is hardy but is an aggressive feeder and will be more than happy to mount and consume sessile invertebrates including clams, urchins, oysters, anemones, and all manner of corals (soft and stony). Is also known to prey on sleeping, slow or weak fish. If it can catch it, it will eat it.
I wouldn't blame it for your floating fish deaths.. But this should serve as a very good lesson. Don't buy anything for your tank until you know what it is and research it first. I sware after a year and a 1/2 of reading ReefCentral I still don't know 10% of some people, this is a good resource for information.
Feeding: It likes to eat Eats meathy bits of seafood and detritus. Also will eat corals, anemones, urchins, crustaceans, small fish and anything else it can catch..
General notes: The Chocolate Chip Sea Stars have dull spines, bumps or knobs on their dorsal surface often in contrasting colors. This species is hardy but is an aggressive feeder and will be more than happy to mount and consume sessile invertebrates including clams, urchins, oysters, anemones, and all manner of corals (soft and stony). Is also known to prey on sleeping, slow or weak fish. If it can catch it, it will eat it.
I wouldn't blame it for your floating fish deaths.. But this should serve as a very good lesson. Don't buy anything for your tank until you know what it is and research it first. I sware after a year and a 1/2 of reading ReefCentral I still don't know 10% of some people, this is a good resource for information.
