new 55g bulletproof reef tank by GARF

[customanimalart]

Hi all!
I have my 55g reef tank up and running., it has a hang on the back refugium with established sand and live rock rubble from my 12g nano.
The main tank has been set up with help from GARF.org about setting up a bullet proof reef.

I made the plenum (undergravel-like filter) which is operated by a maxi jet 1200 pump.
We covered it in 80 lbs of Caribsea Arag-Alive. I also took all of the live rock (15 lbs) from the nano tank and put it into the tank with alot of dry, cured base rock.

I use Seachem Reef Builder, Seachem Reef Advantage Calcium, Seachem Reef Calcium, Seachem Reef Plus, Seachem Reef Complete. (Certain directions on certain days for certain supplements)

Instant Ocean Sea Salt and 4 stage RO/DI 75gpd unit.

I have a wavemaker using 2 maxi jet 1200 powerheads (making total of three in use)

I added 8lbs of Garf Grunge to my substrate as well as 3lbs of Super Plus Grunge for my refugium.

Inhabitants are:
2 clowns,
male mandarin (he loves his Ocean Nutrition I pellets)
six line wrasse
Coral Beauty and 3 damsels.
Also, 82 tank janitors of snails and hermits.

Lighting is a t-5 Nova Extreme (216 watt total) swapped one white light for an additional blue actinic to encourage coralline growth.

My few mushroom corals that came from the nano tank are not very happy at the moment. They have shrivled up a bit and don't look too happy. In the nano they were over an inch in diameter looking pretty chipper. I have 4 shrooms and all 4 look like they want to go back to the old home. My group of small mushrooms are all shriveled up too. My zoa's don't care. Thery like where they are so far. How long does it usually take before the mushrooms perk back up?

This tank has been set up for 3 days. I noticed that my pH is LOW! It is at 7.2ish. I need to raise it to at least 8.2-3
Ammonia O
Nitrite O
Nitrate O
Salinity 1.025
Temp 79.8*
Alkalinity 125mg/L (7dKH---2.5 meq/L

What is the simplest/safest method for raising pH and stabilizing it there? Do I need to raise the alkalinity as well? Chemistry is not my forte. I just don't want to shock or stress my fish.

Is this low ph caused by the RO/DI unit? Just so I know???

Any help is deeply appreciated as the nano was all I have had and the clown, mandarin and shrooms thrived in there. They are doing good now, but this low ph worrries me.

 

[Icefire]

raise alk to 10dkh

Baking soda will do.

 

[customanimalart]

How much baking soda and how often? Will the pH stabilize using baking soda?

 

[davidryder]

the tank has been set up for 3 days and you already have your corals in it?

 

[davidryder]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9441601#post9441601 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by customanimalart
How much baking soda and how often? Will the pH stabilize using baking soda?

baking soda temporarily increases the buffering capacity of water. as the tank matures it will 'naturally' increase it's buffering capacity, becoming more stable.

 

[xcreonx]

"I made the plenum (undergravel-like filter) which is operated by a maxi jet 1200 pump."

I thought a plenum didn't have a powerhead attached to it like an undergravel filter would.... I would think that defeats the purpose of the low-oxygen zone below the sand? The point of a plenum is no water exchange. I've read the garf bulletproof reef instructions and it's as confusing as always.

 

[Peter Eichler]

A few things jump out here...

A plenum is not like an undergravel filter and should not be operated by anything. You're defeating the whole purpose of a plenum by running water through it and you're just setting yourself up a nitrate factory.

A deep sandbed without at least some live sand isn't the best of ideas, especially if you're not using much live rock. You're going to lack the small organisms that can make or break tanks with a DSB. You had better hope that the grunge has a lot of those organisms in it...

Be careful with the Seachem products you're using. I count 3 different calcium supplements yet I don't see you listing your calcium levels. If you don't already have a calcium test kit you should get one. Also, some of their products contain boron/borate and it will interfere with most alkalinity test kits and can make you believe your alkalinity is fine despite it being low. Here's an article to help you learn a little more about boron in reef aquaria.

http://www.advancedaquarist.com/issues/dec2002/chem.htm

7.2 PH in a reef aquarium is VERY low. So low that I doubt that level is even correct. What PH test kit are you using?

The mushrooms are most likely not happy due to the T5s being much brighter than what I assume was PCs on your nano. Also new tank conditions won't help... Do you have them on the bottom and maybe even slightly shaded? With all of your livestock you should acclimate them slowly to brighters lights and start even more light loving corals on the bottom of the tank and slowly move them up. The shrooms will most likely do best near the bottom of the tank even after they're used to the new lights.

I hope that helps, and goodluck!

 

[swamprat]

I think GARF talks about running a powerhead on the UGF for a few months then removing it.

 

[Frick-n-Frags]

i think the mushrooms are freaking out at the water chemistry

I also have to sit and think for a minute even how to address this.

I guess, if GARF guarantees this technique, and you are doing it EXACTLY like many successful startups have been done in the past, then hey, good for you, sounds like you are rocking.


However, if you are doing things your way here, several things make me wonder how much background research you have done into this.

1) what consideration have you made regarding the impending nitrogen cycle from those 8 well fed fish in the 3-day old tank.

2)have you decided whether you are having a reef or a fishtank?

If you answer reef, I recommend more studying to get a feel for the generally accepted successful pace of setting of a reeftank, which is much slower, and much more conscious of water column nutrient levels.

 

[davidryder]

yeah in the first month you are going to see all sorts of fluctuations in all sorts of levels. you will probably see bad results if you start tampering with parameters as soon as you get it filled up. it takes upwards of two months before things really begin to stabalize. i didn't read what sort of losses the authors of GARF experience, but i would venture to say they would have many many less losses if they moved at quite a slower pace.

there are too many things out of your control during the initial 'break-in' period of a saltwater tank. as the water establishes a nitrogen cycle, certain levels (nitrites, ammonia) can, and usually does, raise to toxic levels, potentially destroying your corals.

does that site mention anything on the nitrogen cycle?

 

[customanimalart]

Sorry, I forgot to put the calcium reading down. It is at 380.

As far as the plenum, the powerhead is TEMPORARY and it is taken out when the nitrates fall to zero. (If they even go up) It apparrently gets rid of nitrate when it is established.

There isn't 1 ouce of sand in this tank that isn't alive. There is 80lbs of Arag-alive, and another 15lbs that came from my nano that is in the refugium. The garf grunge is loaded with all sorts of good stuff.

Here is the link. www.garf.org http://garf.org/GRUNGEPLUS1/SHOW/index.html

The grunge plus (3lbs) is in my refugium along with 15 lbs of established nano-tank sand and about 1 lb of live rock rubble from my nano.

There is 8 lbs of grunge also added to the 80lbs of live sand. Also there is about 15 lbs of live rock that came from my nano.

According to garf, corals can be added right away as the "grunge" has all the good stuff needed and corralline spreads rapidly if given the proper growing conditions. (Blue actinic for the first 2 weeks, then regular day/night lighting)

They don't talk about the nitrogen cycle "per se" only that therre is no need to wait weeks or months to add corals and fish to your tank. They can be added right away. The minimum amount of fish is not to exceed 1" of fish per 1 gallon of water within the first 3 weeks. All my fish are very small. My biggest is my Mandarin at around 3".

I am not new to having fish tanks as I had this nano for a year with not a single problem as well as currently 180g freshwater (Rainbowfish and Clown loaches) and several other 55g freshies in the past.

I am one of those types that if it isn't broke, don't fix it. I don't ever fuss with water params as the added stress on the fish can make it worse than the original issue. I never had ph issues either. The nano began with good ph and never changed from that. My only difference now is that I used a RO/DI unit for the water this time and didn't realize that I should have check the ph on the water from the start. Stupid on my part.

I am headed out to get a liquid test kit for ph as right now all I have are the test strips, which I tend not to trust completely.
All of my fish are active and healthy and I do believe that the lighting has my mushrooms a little angry. They are mid level as they are on large rocks and I would have to cut them off to move them any lower. I have them so they are not getting direct lighting.

The ph reading was low, and that had me a little worried. Thus far the only thing noticible for now.

I have followed this "bulletproff reef" instruction to the letter (except the lighting is a bit stronger than they suggest for start up--I have two 54watt blue actinics running to their recommended two 40watts)

I knew that if I was to do this, I had to follow it completely or else it defeats the whole thing. Hopefully this works. They promise it does, so I trust them on this. You should see their photos and do some reading. It is VERY interesting.

PS-I have amquel + on hand at all times around here incase of emergencies.


Any other thoughts and questions are welcome, don't be shy. Just don't confuse me ....

I think I will post a couple of pics for you. One will be right after the initial set-up and the other will be after all the grunge was added. The difference is immediate. This grunge is amazing. The coralline in it is awesome. I hope to get some growing soon!

 

[xcreonx]

Just be cautious. GARF makes alot of claims. I've used that grunge crap before and it wasn't anything more than gravel. Others share my experience. Just be observant and test your water regularly. The main concern here is the speed at which they say you can add coral and fish.... I mean 3 days after setting up?! That's insane. I don't understand how the nitrogen cycle has even started yet, especially with oly 15lbs of live rock.

Anyways, it's up and running so take care of it. Do water changes when necessary and take your time.

 

[davidryder]

It's definitely an interesting idea. I'm sure you will learn a lot as you go. I would say this is a more heuristic approach to reefkeeping, and probably not generally recommended here at reefcentral, but that doesn't mean it doesn't work. I have faith that you will have a very nice reef running in a couple of months. Keep us posted!

 

[Peter Eichler]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9443248#post9443248 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by customanimalart
Sorry, I forgot to put the calcium reading down. It is at 380.

As far as the plenum, the powerhead is TEMPORARY and it is taken out when the nitrates fall to zero. (If they even go up) It apparrently gets rid of nitrate when it is established.

There isn't 1 ouce of sand in this tank that isn't alive. There is 80lbs of Arag-alive, and another 15lbs that came from my nano that is in the refugium. The garf grunge is loaded with all sorts of good stuff.

Here is the link. www.garf.org http://garf.org/GRUNGEPLUS1/SHOW/index.html

The grunge plus (3lbs) is in my refugium along with 15 lbs of established nano-tank sand and about 1 lb of live rock rubble from my nano.

There is 8 lbs of grunge also added to the 80lbs of live sand. Also there is about 15 lbs of live rock that came from my nano.

According to garf, corals can be added right away as the "grunge" has all the good stuff needed and corralline spreads rapidly if given the proper growing conditions. (Blue actinic for the first 2 weeks, then regular day/night lighting)

They don't talk about the nitrogen cycle "per se" only that therre is no need to wait weeks or months to add corals and fish to your tank. They can be added right away. The minimum amount of fish is not to exceed 1" of fish per 1 gallon of water within the first 3 weeks. All my fish are very small. My biggest is my Mandarin at around 3".

I am not new to having fish tanks as I had this nano for a year with not a single problem as well as currently 180g freshwater (Rainbowfish and Clown loaches) and several other 55g freshies in the past.

I am one of those types that if it isn't broke, don't fix it. I don't ever fuss with water params as the added stress on the fish can make it worse than the original issue. I never had ph issues either. The nano began with good ph and never changed from that. My only difference now is that I used a RO/DI unit for the water this time and didn't realize that I should have check the ph on the water from the start. Stupid on my part.

I am headed out to get a liquid test kit for ph as right now all I have are the test strips, which I tend not to trust completely.
All of my fish are active and healthy and I do believe that the lighting has my mushrooms a little angry. They are mid level as they are on large rocks and I would have to cut them off to move them any lower. I have them so they are not getting direct lighting.

The ph reading was low, and that had me a little worried. Thus far the only thing noticible for now.

I have followed this "bulletproff reef" instruction to the letter (except the lighting is a bit stronger than they suggest for start up--I have two 54watt blue actinics running to their recommended two 40watts)

I knew that if I was to do this, I had to follow it completely or else it defeats the whole thing. Hopefully this works. They promise it does, so I trust them on this. You should see their photos and do some reading. It is VERY interesting.

PS-I have amquel + on hand at all times around here incase of emergencies.


Any other thoughts and questions are welcome, don't be shy. Just don't confuse me ....

I think I will post a couple of pics for you. One will be right after the initial set-up and the other will be after all the grunge was added. The difference is immediate. This grunge is amazing. The coralline in it is awesome. I hope to get some growing soon!

What you have is not live sand, it's a gimmick in a bag and has nothing more than some bacteria that would occur anyhow in a short amount of time. Like I said, hope that the grunge has some of the microfauna you'll want for you sandbed and that it's not just some gravel and dirt in a bag like many have reported. The "scud shrimp" they list is just an amphipod and their little slide show doesn't show anything that wouldn't happen with seeding your tank with a little live rock.


The powerhead thing makes no sense and all you're really doing is setting up an undergravel filter. I'd like to see why they suggest thing but I can't find it since their info and their website is painfully dated. I mean c'mom, they've had 2 updates on their systems in the last 7+ years...

From what I can tell most of their systems have mostly lower light low maintenance corals that can do well in higher nutrient systems. They're acting like it's a miracle these tanks have done well for as long as they have. In actuality you could set up a tank with the corals they're keeping in dozens of ways and have success. In my eyes they're doing little more than hyping up some dirt, gravel, and typical reeftank organisms in a bag so they can make money.

Most of their photos show nothing more than tanks like many of us had set up 15+ years ago. Hell, one of my first reefs was a 55 gallon lit by shoplights with 40 watt actinic and daylight bulbs. It did quite well and looked a heck of a lot like the soft coral tanks they show.

I see the garf site and how they suggest one keep s a reef tank and it's like the hobby being set back 10+ years. We've made advances since then and have figured out "better" ways of doing things.

I'm absolutely not saying you can't have a great reef by following their steps for the bulletproof reef. But take some of what they say with a grain of salt and realize that we have learned a lot in this hobby in the last 10 years.

Lastly, don't skimp on test kits. The strips are pretty bad, the cheap liquid test kist aren't a whole lot better. Invest in some quality test kits from Salifert. Also consider adding a 2 part calcium and alk supplement to save yourself some hassle and money.

 

[willj]

Did we ever get a follow up on his experience with this method?

 

[Crystal Sea TX]

Argghhhh

Argghhhh

The power head AND THE TUBE are temporary ... I wished that GARF would make a video on how to set these up correctly.

Also all of those additions are making a mess of your chemistry. Get rid of them all, (throw them in the garbage) the plenum will do the work.

Also do several massive water changes because you have absolutely screwed up your chemistry with those additions. A quick note: a "calcium" supplement is not just calcium it is Ca+ (note the positive symbol) and usually CL- (note the negative symbol) Every aqueous solution this is the case. Manufactures don't like to list the Anion (the negative symboled ion) because it would scare off their customers (rightfully)

Be careful with the use of corals there are many types of coral, I wouldn't hesitate to had zoas to a relatively new reef tank but for stonies I would wait for the plenum to kick in which in my experience is around 4 months.