New to SPS, need some advice
- Thread starter Shark.Bait
- Start date
Shark.Bait
New member
Ok, misunderstood sorry. I doubt it's salinity but I will get it checked at an lfs today and buy some calibration solution and report back.
Any other ideas?
BigJohnny
Active member
I mean if your phosphate is .25-.5 thats atleast 10x higher than what I have and what is recommended for sps (in a tank with alk 7.7-9.5 dkH. You have higher dkH so more nutrients are ok but not that much) Phosphate wouldn't make it bleach like that, but it can stress the coral making it more prone to other issues.
After seeing your additional photos and hearing you say that you have been unable to find any nudibranch on your monti(keep looking [emoji6]) , I am fairly confident the culprit is alk burn. That's not hard to do when your monitoring with API and keeping it so high. Montis can get alk burn in spots like that, unlike acros where it is usually focused on the tips. To prevent this in the future, gradually bring your alk down to 8.5-9.5 and keep it there, testing regularly with a quality test kit.
Now as far as the eggs are concerned, I have no idea what has yellow eggs like that, but it doesn't sound good. Whatever has that 100% needs to be qtd and dipped if possible, or at least dipped weekly until the eggs have hatched and everything dies.
P.S. I would also invest in a new Nitrate test kit if that's api as well. Although it is possible, I doubt you have 0 Nitrate with .25-.5 phosphate (but since that's an api test as well who knows ha).
So in summary:
1. Invest in good tests and use them regularly.
2. Gradually bring down your alk and phosphate and keep it there.
3. Dip and quarantine (or at least dip weekly until gone) any pest infested corals.
Good luck!
I'm pretty sure that yellow growth under his monti is a small sponge and not an egg mass. But like bigjohnny said, invest in good test kits. Any change you make should be made slowly. Stability is key with sps, and if you have to make a change in a parameter, the slower you do it the better off you are. Dipping any qt'ing any addition is also important.
Shark.Bait
New member
Thanks for the advice. Just to update, refractometer has been re-calibrated and the salinity is the same (35 PPT). I've been testing alk and calcium with salifert test kits and it has been very stable, very often its the same numbers daily. However, I have only been testing with them for 3 weeks, so the damage may have been done before that. I will focus on lowering the phosphates and alk. Right now the only api test kit I have is for phosphate, which I am replacing with a hanna meter on Thursday.
One reason I am doubting the monti eating nudibranch is because the birdnest is dying quickly as well. It looks as if the flesh is peeling off (RTN?). I'll keep observing for pests as well. I am also planning to do a large water change today.
Thanks for the continuing help.
BigJohnny
Active member
No problem bud.
Don't doubt monti nudibranch just because of another corals behavior. You could have alk burn in the tank and nudis on the monti. Just keep looking at night to rule them out while also tending to the overall issue. [emoji106] I agree though it's likely just tank issues. Nudis work and reproduce extremely quickly so if you've been looking you would have likely seen them by now. I'd keep looking just incase though
Shark.Bait
New member
There's a bunch of these on the moniporas, they move quickly and look like pods to me. I'm almost certain they are, but on the off chance they're not...
Pife
Active member
How long has this tank been set up? How long have you been in reef keeping? Have you had other successful reef tanks? I don't see any coralline in any of your pictures. Do you have coralline growing? How do you keep your tank parameters stable? Dosing pumps? Dosing by hand? What products do you use? And FYI if your tank isn't fallow there isn't really a point of removing all but one fish to treat for ick. It will still be in your tank when you put the other fish back in. The answers to these questions will help us determine the possible causes of your declining sps.
Shark.Bait
New member
Thanks for the reply. The tank was set up in December of last year. However, the seam split a few months back and I have used the same rock, sand, etc. and rebuilt the tank (essentially starting new). It's been in this current state for about 3 months, maybe longer.
I've been reef keeping for several years and have kept successful and thriving reefs in the past. I've kept mixed reefs though, no sps whatsoever. In this tank I'm seeing moderate coralline growth in little patches along the rock. Nothing to brag about.
As I was rebuilding I was given some sps frags that healed and continued to grow in my tank. The tank was just supplemented by Kalk in the ato. I was NOT testing calcium, alkalinity, or phosphate at this time (big mistake, I know) so I really don't have a baseline for this bit of "success". Since the tank and sps were doing well, I decided to take the mother colonies. Around this time I realized I needed to get serious, get some salifert test kits, and upgrade my lighting.
Around that time, I noticed my sps start to decline (bleach). I brought up my calcium by dosing over several days manually. The kalk top off has kept alk and calcium stable daily since then. I wanted to lower my alk to get it closer to NSW and I've read that higher alk levels can cause montipora bleaching, regardless of stability. I have been adding less and less kalk to my ato to achieve this effect over several weeks.
Also, I QT all fish but only dip corals before adding them. I suspect ich got in the tank through coral or the addition of a cleaner crew. My plan is to fallow the tank for 72 days, six line still won't go in the fish trap yet. I realize he needs to come out though.
My equipment includes:
3 Chinese black boxes for lighting ( power at ~25% white and 50% actinic)
Bermuda 8c skimmer (rated for 500 gallons heavily stocked)
Filter socks bleached and rinsed 3x in washer
Gfo and activated carbon reactors
90w and 55w uv sterilizers
Flow return w/ penductors, rw-20 and rw-15.
Sorry about the wall of text! That should bring everyone up to date! Let me know if you need any other info. Thanks.
Pife
Active member
What section of your sump is your ato pumping into? Did the corals you have come from a tank lit by leds?
I've never been been a fan of uv sterilization but regardless that won't have deal the negative effects that you're suffering. I think you might be dealing with light shock and alk spikes. You are relatively new to keeping sps and it is quite finicky. I think you may be just experiencing the pains of learning how to keep hard corals.
I've never been been a fan of uv sterilization but regardless that won't have deal the negative effects that you're suffering. I think you might be dealing with light shock and alk spikes. You are relatively new to keeping sps and it is quite finicky. I think you may be just experiencing the pains of learning how to keep hard corals.
Shark.Bait
New member
Some came from led's, the montipora came from a 8 bulb t-5 lit tank. The ato goes into refugium via dosing pump, then into the skimmer chamber, baffles and finally return. I think it's well diluted before hitting the display. I can't really tell if my led's are too bright or not bright enough. They're barely on.
I agree with you about growing pains. I just can't seem to dial it in. I assumed my alk was stable enough but it may not be. Would a lack of flow cause something like this?
Shark.Bait
New member
Just to update. Dipped the montipora and found these guys. The red dots, about 10 of them fell off after dipping in coral rx. Red bugs? Flatworms?
Shark.Bait
New member
Just got my Hanna meter today. Measuring .06 phosphate, so my previous estimate of .25 was way off.
Shark.Bait
New member
They look like acro eating flatworms, they shouldn't be causing problems for your montipora though. Do you have any acropora left in the tank? Red bugs are actually yellow with a red head.
I do have one very large acro left, but it seems unaffected. Possibly a lack of PE. AEFW or redbugs usually wouldn't have an effect on montipora, right? These definitely don't look like nudibranch to me.
Montipora eatin nudi's are sort of an off white color and have lots of ruffles to them. Those definitely are not what's in that picture. AEFW will cause a decrease in polyp extension, you generally start to see tissue loss in shaded areas first. With brownish colored egg masses on the newly cleared skeleton. They eventually work their way into more noticible locations. If you can pull your acro out of the tank, I'd suggest dipping it a bayer insecticide dip. Maybe start off at 5 ml per 250 ml of tank water. Let is sit for about 5 minutes and see what's left behind. Make sure you have a couple of extra cups/buckets/bowls of tank water to rinse the coral in before adding it back to the tank. If it's encrusted on the rocks, remove as much of the coral as you can from the rock. You don't want to dip your rock in it.
BigJohnny
Active member
Those are definitely flatworms, not nudis or red bugs. Nudis are mostly white and not shaped like that. Red bugs wouldn't be on a monti, nor would aefw. That doesn't mean you don't have flatworms on your acros however. I'd dip and inspect everything. I think you can treat your whole tank with salifert flatworm x but I have no experience with it and don't know what effect it has on other inhabitants.Just to update. Dipped the montipora and found these guys. The red dots, about 10 of them fell off after dipping in coral rx. Red bugs? Flatworms?
BigJohnny
Active member
Well that's good! Still a tad high for sps but not likely the cause of your problems.
Shark.Bait
New member
Thanks for the help everyone. I guess it's good that the sixline wrasse is in there for now, hopefully it will help a bit. I'll just leave him in there until my flatworm problem can be dealt with, then start fallow.
Are these definitely AEFW or is it possible they may be another type of flatworm? I've also heard that flatworm x doesn't work on AEFW, so hopefully it isn't those.
I've also increase the intensity of my leds. The blue channel was about 30% not 50%, and the white channel was probably <10%. It may be in my head, but I think bumping them up just a little bit has brought out some color in the montipora.
Are these definitely AEFW or is it possible they may be another type of flatworm? I've also heard that flatworm x doesn't work on AEFW, so hopefully it isn't those.
I've also increase the intensity of my leds. The blue channel was about 30% not 50%, and the white channel was probably <10%. It may be in my head, but I think bumping them up just a little bit has brought out some color in the montipora.
