Not sure what my Blue Hippo Tang Has

[panicy]

I just recently got in the salt hobby and I'm loving it so far! I've got a lot of advice from this site in my build but this is my first post.

I've got a 55 gallon tank with lots of live rock (probably somewhere around 50 lbs), live sand, wet/dry sump filtration, coralife super skimmer 65 and the tank cycled completely in around 3-4 weeks with the help of yellow tail damsels. Since then I've added snails, blue hermit crabs, two clown fish and a blue hippo tang. Each addition was separated by at least a week.

I haven't added anything in awhile but my tang seems to have gotten some sort of parasite I believe. It looked white at first so I began treatment of ich. It seemed to get better, but then relapsed and was as bad as it was when I first discovered it if not worse. Last night I did a fresh water dip and that seems to have helped as well but I'm confused as to what I'm dealing with. I'm starting to wonder if its hole-in-the-head. I do frequent 25% water changes (at least 1 /wk) and all tests come out ok (ammonia, nitrite and nitrate). All other fish look great and his eating and temperament seem fine also.

He has grown a little since I've gotten him and I'm starting to wonder if he just needs to be relocated to a larger tank. Check out the pic and let me know what you think it is and/or any helpful suggestions. He is really hard to get a good pic of but this one shows it the best.


Thanks for reading!

 

[bobamike]

its hard to see in the pic,but I am willing to bet,its gill flukes.I had a issue with them when I first got fish in my tank and one of the fish was a blue tang and he didnt make it. I didnt find out what it was until after I lost 3 of my 5 fish.here is a link to the thread that enlightened me.
http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1260067&highlight=fish+mysteriously+dying

 

[panicy]

Thanks for the post bobamike. I hadn't even heard of flukes yet so that was a good read. As I went through his six top symptoms none of them seem too applicable to my tang. In during further research (googling and trying to compare that to google image searches) I'm starting to wonder if it is black ich. Some of the spots seem to be black and the 'grain of salt' size, but its strange as they tend to start off more white. It's frustrating and confusing but I'm reading to try more (and longer) FW dips. I've still only done one and that was 45 seconds to 1 minute. Other posts that I've read say 5-10 minutes as long as the fish isn't showing extreme signs of stress.

 

[DragKnee]

Thanks for the post bobamike. I hadn't even heard of flukes yet so that was a good read. As I went through his six top symptoms none of them seem too applicable to my tang. In during further research (googling and trying to compare that to google image searches) I'm starting to wonder if it is black ich. Some of the spots seem to be black and the 'grain of salt' size, but its strange as they tend to start off more white. It's frustrating and confusing but I'm reading to try more (and longer) FW dips. I've still only done one and that was 45 seconds to 1 minute. Other posts that I've read say 5-10 minutes as long as the fish isn't showing extreme signs of stress.

You should put it in a QT, and not keep doing FW dips.

 

[panicy]

I'm not big on about.com, but this seemed like a good set of instructions:

http://saltaquarium.about.com/od/ichparasiticdiseases/ht/treatbrooklynel.htm

agree/disagree?

 

[MrTuskfish]

^^^^^^^I Agree^^^^^
Were all of these fish quarantined? Could you tell us what we should be looking at on the tang? I don't see anything really out of the ordinary. What are you treating with? There isn't anything that you can use on ich that won't kill inverts. FW dips do nothing for ich (the parasite is buried too deep). Flukes may be there, no easy way of telling. But I think all fish should be treated with Prazi-Pro, a very safe med that kills worms , including flukes. Its the only med I would ever use in a reef tank. Black ich is a worm and will respond to PP too. We're just playing footsie here; I simply don't know what symptoms the fish has or what we should be looking at. You mentioned a bigger tank, that is a gimme. A 55 is way too small for a hippo, but that shouldn't bother him much now.

Are the damsels bothering him? I'll bet a LFS sold you the damsels as "cycle fish", a cruel, outdated and unesessary practice. Most damsels are nasty little monsters that most people get rid of sooner or later. They will kill each other off too. I'm really rambling, trying to find something that makes sense, but I don't really know what the problem is. Sorry for the confusing reply, I'm just trying to escape a house full of teenagers right now.

 

[panicy]

wow lots of stuff here. Great questions/ideas. The last line made me laugh as this afternoon when I posted back the first time I was escaping a house of toddlers (1 and 3 yrs). Love them to death, but everyone needs a break at times.

Anyway piece by piece:

Were all of these fish quarantined? Could you tell us what we should be looking at on the tang?

For better or worse (lets just say worse) I do not have a QT yet. I just got started in this hobby and in this 45 gallon tank I've literally got a grand in it so far. Even another $50 is hard to justify right now. I've got every intention of doing so but a 20 gallon just hasn't popped up yet on craigs list yet.

I don't see anything really out of the ordinary. What are you treating with?

I've been using Kordan's ich treatment, which is supposedly reef safe (even though I have no coral yet I still prefer it). If you look at the bottom right hand side of his body you should see little black dots.

There isn't anything that you can use on ich that won't kill inverts.

Crap. I didn't know that. My snails seem ok from the treatment, but I do see less movement from the blue hermit crabs. The bottle said nothing about removing/cause harm to inverts. Too late??

FW dips do nothing for ich (the parasite is buried too deep). Flukes may be there, no easy way of telling. But I think all fish should be treated with Prazi-Pro, a very safe med that kills worms , including flukes. Its the only med I would ever use in a reef tank. Black ich is a worm and will respond to PP too.

Awesome, I'll give it a shot!

You mentioned a bigger tank, that is a gimme. A 55 is way too small for a hippo, but that shouldn't bother him much now.

I know that I'll have to get rid of him, but I thought it was a little too soon for it. I'm actually hoping to get a bigger tank (don't tell my wife I haven't started the selling process yet) before that needs to happen and that way I'm able to keep him. He is such an awesome and fun fish to watch. His personality is really goofy.

Are the damsels bothering him? I'll bet a LFS sold you the damsels as "cycle fish", a cruel, outdated and unesessary practice. Most damsels are nasty little monsters that most people get rid of sooner or later. They will kill each other off too. I'm really rambling, trying to find something that makes sense, but I don't really know what the problem is. Sorry for the confusing reply, I'm just trying to escape a house full of teenagers right now.

This part was the most interesting of all of it. There are two yellow tail damsels, one is significantly larger than the other and he does pick on the hippo a little and the other damsel, but strangely not on the clowns at all. Its less than what it used to be but I still see it on an every other day (at least) basis. Using them to cycle the tank is EXACTLY what I was told. I thought live rock and sand where enough and the LFS guy laughed and mildly rudely told me I couldn't cycle without it. My ignorance lead me to believe that I was wrong and that I should use fish. Since then I've discovered further evidence to support my claim, but they lived through it which is what I was most worried about not happening. I guess its possible that they are bit marks from the big damsel as everything else really seems ok. He doesn't act funny, he eats well, he doesn't hang out in front of the circ pump, he doesn't skim at the top, he doesn't twitch his head, etc, etc. The only other thing that I occasionally see is that he will swim by and scratch himself on a rock. This doesn't seem frequent however. Maybe I should separate the damsels into a QT and see if the tang heals. The yellow tails are really pretty, but I do agree at the "little monsters" statement.

Guess it was my turn to ramble. Good talk...

 

[MrTuskfish]

Your LFS guy is either greedy or an idiot. A cycle needs a source of ammonia and fish waste, etc rots essentially and turns to ammonia. Ammonia, at any level, will burn fishes gills. Damsels are cheap and handle ammonia better than most fish. So the store gets a sale of is living in ignorance. Most hobbyists a whole, raw shrimp from the grocery store. Pure ammonia will work too. I'd let the lfs guy know about this stunning development that the hobby has been using for years. BTW; "how to catch damsels" is a very common topic on our forum,. The problem often is often not the damage a damsel does, its the constant harassment that drives fish nuts. This can compromise their immune system and make them more vulnerable to diseases and parasites. Also, I would get some advice from the forum before buying meds. Many/most are worthless and some actually dangerous. Of course, there are some that work. They all should only be used in a QT/HT.