Part 2 easier??

hobobob

New member
Hi Folks,
A little guidance please and if any of my suppositons are incorrect, please set me straight. Thanks.

I am in the process of dealing with part 1 of Tampa Bay Saltwater's "The Package" For my 75 g. tank, it consists of 75 lbs. live sand and 75lbs of live rock which happen to be 4 big ole' chunks of great looking rock with sponges, calerpa, barnacles, and I'm sure, a whole bunch of other stuff which has not yet been seen.

Now, as I understand it, this uncured rock already has it's host Nitrosomas and Nitrobacter already in place. If there were no die-off it theoretically should be already cycled right?

Well, as been alerted to, there is die off. I guess mainly of encrusting sponges though I've seen dead bristleworms,lancelets,crabs,shrimp,and detached calerpa. This, of course, has caused quite substantial ammonia spikes and stinky water along with very stinky portions of rock. I've scraped off offending sponges and done water changes. I received my sand and rock on Saturday and I have done 25% changes 5 times already in reaction to the ammonia spikes which have been over 1.5 (forgive me if my decimals are incorrect, suffice it to say,it's high though).My skimmer is going wild also. I wonder if I should do even more substantial changes. I am really hoping that it's on it's way to stabilizing.

With that preamble said, my question: Will part 2 be any easier? Part 2, which will be sent when part 1 settles, will consist of 75 lbs. more of "decorator rock" which I expect will be even livelier along with other goodies such as gorgonians, tree sponges, condi anenomes and such along with a bunch of hermit crabs, snails, serpent stars, and cukes(the whole cleaning crew). Why wouldn't I expect the same sort of die-off that I'm experiencing with the first part and it's accompanying ammonia spikes (and nitrite, to be sure)? These spikes,if repeated, I expect would be enough to kill the livestock just introduced. I understand that the sponges are very difficult to keep under any circumstances and the stress from collection, shipping and re-introduction will inevitably cause casualties.

Would you expect the tank to go through the same trauma as it's going through now with the next step?

Any thoughts?
 
You must've gotten some excellent Part 1 rock! :D It was my experience that Part 1 was more work since the "ecosystem" and bacteria are trying to stablize and colonize. Once that happens you will have a stable system which will handle the bioload of Part 2.

Part 2 is MUCH easier even though you have more life on the decorator rocks and critters such as the clean up crew. You will still need to monitor for ammonia spikes and make water changes as necessary with Part 2 but those should be fewer (at least that was my experience).

DO watch the astea snails with Part 2. Try to drip acclimate them with air tubing. I did not and lost quite a few without realizing it. Those deaths caused a big ammonia spike making it necessary to remove and sniff each snail that was not moving or attached to the glass. That was the only time where 2 water changes in the same day were necessary with part 2.

I'm cycling a 6 g. nano cube right now and I have been doing water changes twice a day since saturday. This tiny tank has been ALOT more work than my 55 g.
 
Thanks Divemonster,

The rock is very nice and substantial. There's a bit more curing that I expected but what's life without surprises?

Stink is down a little today. I haven't been able to keep up with making water so I'm the dollar store's best friend now. (distilled for $.79 per gallon.

I would imagine a nano would be alot more work seeing how the small volume of water can affected so quickly.

I'll keep my head in the game and post pics when I feel prouder.
 
<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=13282800#post13282800 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by hobobob
Thanks Divemonster,

The rock is very nice and substantial. There's a bit more curing that I expected but what's life without surprises?

Stink is down a little today. I haven't been able to keep up with making water so I'm the dollar store's best friend now. (distilled for $.79 per gallon.

I would imagine a nano would be alot more work seeing how the small volume of water can affected so quickly.

I'll keep my head in the game and post pics when I feel prouder.

Shipping time and transit handling can make a cycle rough ...
if you could take the stuff from Richard w/o transit time it's almost a "no cycle" deal.
if the boxes get hot / cold or spend to much time they can have some issues.
just keep doing water chnages as the amo goes up.

yes the bacteria are in the rock and sand -- correct.
but a lot of the bacteria need to get established in your tank, in your pipes, in your sump etc....
and there will be a phase of getting to a "balance" as you seem to understand.

the amo should drop off soon, it just depends on what's dying, how much is dying etc...
do you have any numbers on water temp, ph, salanity / gravity ?
have you done N2 and N3 tests ? numbers?

and once it settles in yes, part 2 should mostly be puting it in.
do take time to drip aclimate the cleanup crew, snails and cukes and stuff do not take well to chnages in water params esp ph and gravity.
 
It was a smelly night last night. I did another 25% change today and things are looking, well, not quite as frightening and not as fetid.

Water temp is 78 to 79 from morn to eve

Salinity is 1.024

ph is 8.2

I haven't tested for nitrite and nitrate yet with the though that as long as the ammonia is happening, the nitrite and nitrate cycle will process it in it's due course as a product of the spike . Presently, the ammonia is my focus . It has been scary high and I've scraped and scraped some gag-inducing smelly *** sponges off the rock which is no mean feat as 2 of the pieces of rock seem to be 30+ lbs.(what a nice base it will be!) I've broken the legs on my light fixture trying to move it aside as I maneuver the boulders out to sniff and scrape. I wanted the hanging kit anyway and now it's ordered. In the meantime, it's Cambell's Chicken Noodle and Cream of Potato propping up the NEP and keeping it out of the water. Hey whatever works, right?


Franky, at this point, I've changed over 125 gallons of water in the past few days and am justing waiting to get a fresh supply with the hope that the cycle continues as I get some more H2O

I'm not putting my head in the sand as much as admitting that all I can do right now is 25% changes daily and hope it doesn't spiral away from my tenuous control.

I certainly expect to do a major change (50%?) when this cycle has run it's course to get the nitrate down If all I'm left with is the nitrates as evidence of the ordeal, I can handle it.;)

Admittedly, I'm a little stressed but I do believe it will be fine. Cliches seem suited now: One day at a time.

Expectant of saga to opus,
Hobobob
 
A drip acclimatization is basically this:

Put the organisms in a clean bucket with the water that they came in.

run a 1/4" airline tube from the tank to the bucket (I use binder clips to hold the tubing in place)

start a siphon

use a hose clamp, binder clip, or tie a knot in the airline so that water goes into the bucket at the rate of about one drip per second.

When the water in the bucket doubles, take half out.

Repeat for 1-2 hours for fish and 2-4 hours for inverts
 
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