Picking up a used setup, need advice.

[rjinct]

Hi Guys --

New to the hobby and looking for some advice.

I was planning on piecing together a system from used/new equipment over the next few weeks/months, but found a great deal on a lot of the stuff I need equipment-wise and some livestock (couple fish, ls, and lr -- no coral) and decided to go with that setup for now. Needless to say, I'm getting into the game sooner than I thought. I'm picking it up tomorrow so need some advice...

I took a look at the tank tonight and here are a few observations (and questions).

Fish:
The only fish were a shrimp, clown, and a purple fish which the owner did not know the specific species. My plan is to temporarily put the fish in a tank I have clean (but was originally going to use as my display) and set it up with one of the big pieces of rock, heater, lights etc. for the next week while I clean up the display tank and equipment.

Rock:
The rock looks OK...there are a few pieces of non-porous rock in the tank (presumably from a freshwater tank, but sitting in the system for a long while) so I'm taking those out and won't be reusing. There are a few large pieces with some nice coralline growth on them, but I did notice there was some "live growth" on some of the rocks. Based on research, it looks like Apistsea (sp?). The existing owner said that he uses some stuff from the fish store to kill them, but he hasn't been keeping up the last few months. The tank wasn't overrun with it, but I did notice it on the rock when I looked for it. My question here is whether I should bother using this rock at all or try to "clean" it first and take more direct action on removing these "pests". Any recommendations? I've seen a variety of treatments from the "non-natural" methods to using some various types of fish (peppermint shrimp or bergia). The system has been established for over 4 years, so I'm guessing there is some good bacteria in this rock I don't want to get rid of. Also, there is a fair amount of algae on the rocks. Would you recommend using a brush to remove or picking up a CUC to take care of? From what I saw, there was no visible clean up crew. Lastly, because the rock is in an existing system, I'm guessing there should not really be any cycle to speak of...since all the rock will be transferred in buckets. Do you all agree? My plan was just to leave it in the buckets of salt water while I clean out the tank, etc. over the next week, does that sound reasonable?

Sand:
For the most part the sand looks good. Noticed some brown areas of growth (presumably algae), but other than that it looked OK. Should I reuse the sand, or go to LFS and pick up some "fresh stuff" or just let the CUC take care of it?

Equipment:
Equipment, to my untrained eye, looked good. Nice HOB skimmer, a canister filter, and 1 powerhead. The canister filter looked nice, but from everything I've been reading, may be unnecessary. I'll eventually run a sump with a fuge, but am going to have to roll with a hang on back overflow. If I'm daring enough, I may attempt to drill it from the setup from glass-holes.com. Anyone have any experience with their setup? Lights and powerhead are ok -- will definitely be replacing them once I start to into the corals...

Sorry for the length, but trying to put it all out there. If you have any advice on transferring a tank/livestock, please let me know.

I'll try to post some pictures of the setup after I pick it up.

Thanks! Excited to be joining the rest of you in this hobby.

 

[Wheel of Time]

Congrats on getting the reef addiction! It may be sooner than you wanted, but its a great ride!!

Sounds like the set-up you are gettign was mostly a fresh water canister system, then changed to salt water. Its nice to get it all in one package, but like most of us -- you will upgrade many times in the coming years. Sometimes patience and really researching exactly what fits your budget / is best is worth the wait.

First off, sand is rather inexpensive and after 4 yrs, when you go to move the tank will find it is filled with detritus on the bottom-- Id keep just a bit of the sand (the top layer of it only) and thro the rest out -- start over with fresh substrate (it can be the cheap stuff from Lowes at a few bucks a bag , but will contain some silica) or you can pay up for some nice aragonite. Regardless -- Id throw most of the sand in the tank out as a personal choice.

Canister filter: use it for now, but making a sump is very very easy and is far far preferable. You can make it out of a rubbermaid water trough/bin that you can buy locally and then put in a better bulkhead, or buy a used breeder tank drill a few holes for bulkheads and silicone in some baffles (pretty easy as well) and costs very little.

The rock -- unless it has a lot of turnicates /sponges etc Id scub the heck out of the rock. Dealing with an aiptasia outbreak is no fun at all...not worth the hassle. Maybe a couple of the rocks can be cherry picked and put right back in use, but Id probably let most of them dry out for a bit and then scrub the heck out of them and restart them in the tank (you could use a weak bleach solution then hose them down well). You shold certainly buy a clean up crew soon, but Id take your idea of direct action on the rocks before setting up the whole tank. You dont have any corals yet by the sounds of it -- so will have a cycle process, but Im sure that would have happened anyway to be honest. Anytime you break a whole tank down it releases all kinds of nasty stuff. If you arent going to use the rock right away and want to keep it 'live' -- make sure its in a big trash can over buckets and have a small power head circulatingwater....Id do water chages as well to be honest...but my preference would be to clean the heck/scub it all down.

Good luck setting it all up and please ask for help -- there are many many opinions on how do it all-- no single correct answer.

And what kind of light do you plan on getting as well? What kind of lights come with the set-up? No reason to buy new in my mind, but just make sure they will be good for corals, and ask how old the bulbs are (when do they need to be replaced).

 

[RTMA]

Re: Picking up a used setup, need advice.

Hello and welcome.

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=15554329#post15554329 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by rjinct
If I'm daring enough, I may attempt to drill it from the setup from glass-holes.com. Anyone have any experience with their setup?

I do, I do! I found it very anti-climatic actually. Glassholes makes it very easy. I have the 700 and it was a breeze to install. Drilling it was no big deal, just tape the included template onto your tank, fill with water and drill. If you have an drill with adjustable clutch it helps a bit, but the key was to let the drill do the work and exert little to no pressure on the hole. You just need to make sure you are not drilling tempered galss.

How big is the tank?

If you did decide to build the sump asap, you could throw that aptasia rock and some sand in there untouched and use it to colonize new sand in the tank. Of course that would require some expense, as an overflow and return pump wouldn't be cheap. Although I think you could use the empty canister as a temp return.


You can take a look at my thread and check out the overflow. In fact here is a pic of the back of my glass-holes kit.

Good Luck.

 

[tank o tang]

I agree with Wheel that this was most likely a fresh setup then converted. You may want to have a little patience and can find something to fit your final goal unless you are getting a killer deal. If you are going to use a sump you will probably toss the hob skimmer, canister, and freshwater rock which dosen't leave much left. I'm right around the corner if you would like someone to look at it before you buy it or need help with the transfer. Also I have a bit for 1-1/2" bulkhead and you can make your own overflow out of glass or a large pvc pipe quatered, with the return coming up the back and over the top. Just lmk. What size tank?

 

[rjinct]

Thanks for the advice everyone.

Can't believe I forgot to put what size it was. It's a 46g bowfront with oak stand.

Well, I picked it up today... Figured I would spend the same amt of money and this setup came with all the little things I need, salt, test kid, rodi filter, buckets, nets, cleaners, etc. The light will likely be replaced, but I was prepping myself to spend a decent amount on a nice light. Hopefully at that Aquatctnics tent sale in New Haven at the end of the month. Anyone going to that? Everything else, I'll be keeping for a while. Is a year "a while" in this hobby in terms of equipment/tank upgrades? My wife just saw me type that...she said, "no"...

So the skimmer is a Marineland...not the best, but it'll do for a while as far as I'm concerned, I've seen mixed reviews on it. Apparently, it can be used as an HOB or in sump according to the directions. Since it can be used in the sump, I'm drilling this thing...as long as Tank O Tank is willing to swing by, bring his bit, and provide some guidance. I'll just send the return over the back and maybe use the cannister as a temporary return pump. -- RTMA, thanks for that idea.

Transfer went well, the fish are sitting in their temporary home in the basement. Been making new water with the RODI unit since I came home and storing it in buckets...damn, those things are slow. The live rock is in a big plastic bin with a power head. The sand is all out and in buckets. It's actually a lot nicer that I was expecting. Seems very clean. I don't think the previous owner had any CUC. I found a few empty shells in there...maybe 5 or so. I may end up reusing it...still up in the air. Apparently it's some bahamian aragonite stuff. It's not too fine, and was pretty soft when I was pulling taking it out....filled up 1.5 5g buckets with it. When it was in the tank, it was about a 2-3 inch bed. Tank...if you come over, maybe you can give me your opinion on it. Will stop at LFS and see how much they want for new sand since I need to buy these fish some food. Forgot to take the frozen food from previous owner.

Now to figure out what to do for a sump. My neighbor has an old 10 gallon...will see if that fits in there...these bowfront stands dont' have a whole ton of room inside... If not, I may do the

Will post a pic of the tankd/stand soon and the unidentified purple fish if it comes out of hiding.

 

[RTMA]

If it's a bowfront most likely going to be an acrylic tank. You should be able to use a regular Holesaw or Forstner bit to drill. I've never used a glass bit on acrylic, as I think that would melt and clog the diamond glass bit.

Measure how much room you have in the cabinet and we can figure out how big of a sump you can use. Also how large of an opening you have to put the tank in. I run a 10g on my 29 and it is small. Not horrible, but small enough to wish I went with at least a 15.

Those tanks new are pretty cheap. Maybe 20 ish at Petco/ Petsmart. A new 10g at walmart is like under 10 bucks.

A year is not a while really, some people won't even consider your tank "mature" at 1 year.

I'm sure Tank can take a look and recommend something great.

Good Luck!

 

[tank o tang]

CONGRATS !!! Just lmk when.

 

[rjinct]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=15561544#post15561544 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by RTMA
If it's a bowfront most likely going to be an acrylic tank. You should be able to use a regular Holesaw or Forstner bit to drill. I've never used a glass bit on acrylic, as I think that would melt and clog the diamond glass bit.

Measure how much room you have in the cabinet and we can figure out how big of a sump you can use. Also how large of an opening you have to put the tank in. I run a 10g on my 29 and it is small. Not horrible, but small enough to wish I went with at least a 15.

Those tanks new are pretty cheap. Maybe 20 ish at Petco/ Petsmart. A new 10g at walmart is like under 10 bucks.

A year is not a while really, some people won't even consider your tank "mature" at 1 year.

I'm sure Tank can take a look and recommend something great.

Good Luck!

I'm pretty sure it's glass...there's a sticker on the bottom of the tank that says the bottom panel is tempered. Fortunately it doesn't say anything about the back panel's being tempered.

Just measured my stand, unless i go with something custom, the only thing that looks like it'll fit in there is a 10g. Oh well, I'll pick one up in the next day or so

Where do you guys buy your acrylic (in FF county)? Am looking to pick up something 1/4 inch to make the sections and hold them in place with silicone.

Here's are some pics of the visible critters that came with the purchase. Pls let me know if I id'd correctly? Thanks!

Is this:

Aipstasia?

Dottyback?

Scarlet/Skunk Shrimp?

There's a clownfish in there somewhere, but he was too quick to get a clear pic.

 

[RTMA]

Yep, that does sound like glass. Sorry for the misinformation.

As for the acrylic sheets, the only place I know that will custom cut to length is Select Plastics in Norwalk. That first pic is definately Aptasia. The second, and you are correct is a Bicolor Pseudochromis (also known as the Royal Dottyback) and a very nice cleaner shrimp.

Those shrimp are great mine has a great personality, he'll come up near the top on my frag rack and will hop onto my finger and clean my cuticles for me.

 

[tank o tang]

Off exit 2 sourhbound off rt8 across from the exit on main st in bridgeport therers a glass shop that will cut and sand glass for your baffles. Alot better for silicone as the acrylic doesn't bond to glass well with silicone. Not to mention 1/2 the price.

Tank may be fully tempered as that same sticker comes on 55gal tanks but end up meaning all 4 sides and the bottom are baked. Call the manufacturer to be sure.

 

[cortegro]

Looks like a Royal Gramma to me.

My Bicolor Pseudo has a distinct purple/yellow front and back. He is also a much more aggressive than a Gramma.
I battled aiptasia when I picked up rock from a member this year, but I think it was actually worth it after I got it in control.(about 2 months) The rock was nicely established and 'seeded' my other dry rock very well. I did have to 'nuke' them every once in while for those two months, but it helped me watch the tank even more closely. I was frustrated and ****ed at the rock purchase originally, but ended up quite happy with it.

Good luck from one newb to another. It is a blast.

-Dan

 

[patriots81]

it is a royal gramma. to get rid of the aptasia, you can buy a peppermint shrimp. they will eat it.

 

[rjinct]

Thanks for the suggestions. I may just try that Aiptasia-X stuff and spot treat it for now since it's in a temp tank and I'm not ready to add any more livestock.

Well -- not much progress has been made on my setup since I'm leaving for a 10 day trip in a few days and I didn't want to test my plumbing skills to a sump in my living rom and leave for so long...so everyone is still in their temporary home in the basement (plus I was waiting for all the stuff I bought to come in).

I had missed the Aquactinics event on Sunday due to me driving to Queens and buying, ironically, a 3-mo old TX5 by said mfg (with new lights no less). I was planning on looking for this setup at the tent sale, but I don't think I would have been able to come close to what I was able to get it for. The seller also threw in a 2 month old 40g breeder and stand which was the original tank dimension I wanted to get. So now my wife is wondering why there are two complete aquarium setups in my house without any water/fish/coral in them. Somehow I have managed to collect 4 tanks and not officially "start" my DT.

I think I'm going to stick with the 40g breeder and pass on the 46g bow to a co-worker that was thinking of getting into the hobby or outright sell it. if you know anyone that is looking, please let me know. Picture is below...comes with a HOB overflow kit that I got with the 40g breeder the guy gave me (looks really nice, but I'm not going to use it and just drill the breeder). I even had glass replaced for the top of the tank to make a cover. May also just throw in the 10g sump I am in process of making (that's all that would fit in the bow stand) and go with a larger sump since that would now fit much better in the 40BR stand. BTW Tank, that glass place you recommended is great...cheap and the guys there are nice. I love supporting small "mom and pop" places like that.

What do you all think? 40 BR > 46 Bow? I can't wait to finally get this thing going...

Bow

Breeder

 

[Wheel of Time]

Hmmm, that is a tough one. I have always felt more volume is better, but in this case its only 6gal. No big deal. The light looks sweet on the breeder -- matches better than it will on the bow, but I prefer the bow front tank.

If your co-worker decides not to take-up the hobby, I may be interested.

 

[tank o tang]

lol I like the dims of the 40 but the solid wood stand and oak trim of the bow. Although once in this hobby, I'm sure it won't be long till another one.

 

[RTMA]

imho, I'd go with whichever one gives you the most room for the sump. 40 br or 46 bow is pretty much a wash. A 20 Long tank looks like it would fit well under that 40br. I'm also a fan of the all black look.

Tank is so right its not funny...I went from a 7 gallon mini bow nano to a 29 to a 75 in under 10 months...

 

[Wheel of Time]

LOL that is a ton of upgrading of tanks. At this pace you will have a 1000 gallon tank come 2011!!!

 

[RTMA]

Yeah the Wife gives me the "look" when I stare aimlessly at the kiddie pool.

 

[rjinct]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=15631466#post15631466 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by RTMA
Yeah the Wife gives me the "look" when I stare aimlessly at the kiddie pool.

Ha...I got that look earlier this week when I brought home my 5th, yes 5th, tank. Did I mention I still don't have my DT setup. Bought a 20g long to setup as a sump for the 40g breeder since its stand can can hold more than the 10g sump I was making. I'm going to need to get rid of this bowfront and sump I made for it someday.

In any case, now that I'm back home for a while, I was able to get moving on this again. I drilled the tank and put in an overflow from glass-holes. It was super easy and it's a great product. Also painted the back of the tank and cut the pipe for the plumbing to drain to the sump...haven't glued anything together yet until I get the sump built....hopefully done this w/e.

Have a question on the return... I bought a used eheim 1260 and it will be hooked up to a return that just hangs over the back...its connector is a barbed fitting. Do most of use just use some flexible tubing from HD/Lowes to connect the two? Looks like a 1" flex tube with some zip ties might do the job. Or is it better/safer to use pvc? If pvc, i'm kind of at a lost of how to do that. Any advice appreciated. Thanks!

 

[Wheel of Time]

5 tanks!!! Your wife must think youve lost without the display tank even up yet! LOL

I like the spa-flex tubing myself (and it can be glued using pvc glue as well), but I also use some pvc on straight runs. Id use the spa-flex with the barbed fitting and instead of zip ties, Id use the stainless steel hose clamps (they are pretty inexpensive -- just buy a bag of 10 at lowes)