RichConley
New member
Please provide scientifically credible research papers proving otherwise.
Protein Skimmer
- Thread starter Fishguy13
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Please provide scientifically credible research papers proving otherwise.
RichConley
New member
And I've seen GBD horses test positive for myco.
Please provide documentation that myco can not present itself in the form of pouch swelling.
RichConley
New member
I havent seen you do anything other than make claims of "research has been done"
Lets see some published papers here.
RichConley
New member
I asked on Seahorse.org whether I should run a skimmer a while back. The overwhelming response was "NO!"
Please provide links proving that skimmers are encouraged on Seahorse.org.
RichConley
New member
I called/ IMed all the people in my local club wiht seahorses that I knew of. 19 Used skimmers, 1 didnt.
Even with the limited sample size, my data is still more valid than yours because it was a properly conducted survey, and shows an accurate reflection of the population distribution.
Please show links that tell how my survey violates the scientific method, and yours doesnt.
RichConley
New member
Pledosophy, the problem is, that accustation has more, and better data backing it up than your survey. The assumption has a higher corrolation, and runs into the same issue as your survey: A lack of consideration of the population sample.
It is actually a better assumption than yours. Higher corrolation, same error chances.
RichConley
New member
Please post a link to a scientific paper discussing how protien skimmers effect this enzyme.
I've seen plenty of claims saying
Skimmer -> Enzyme -> GBD, but absolutely no explanation of how the skimmer could effect this enzyme. They are all just stabs in the dark, no better. I want a concise explanation of the mechanism involved in the Skimmer->Enzyme step.
Also, please give evidence as to how running a skimmer in sump is ANY different than running it HOB.
RichConley
New member
Please post a link to one place I have attacked you personally, and not the validity of your data, or the assumptions you are making from said data.
Please post a link to a spot I cried foul.
panmanmatt
New member
Rich,
I do not want to get into a ****ing match with you, but I have a few things to point out.
The article you have linked to is over 4 years old. Yes it is hosted in the Org library but was not writen by the Org but rather by a member. It is highyl possible that it was missed during editing. Sorry for the mistake. But instead of say how wrong it was, maybe a little note to say, "hey there is a discrepency in such and such article, can it be corrected?" would have been a better approach.
Can you provide a link to your post where you were told this? From what I can tell, you just signed up to Seahorse.Org on June 27, 2006 and have not made a single post to date.
Old school thinking is "No skimmer on a SH tank", but in the last year or so that has changed. Yes there are still a few members that are dead set against protein skimmers on a SH tank, but the majority now are letting people know of the possible pros and cons of running one and letting folks make their own descision.
Again, I don't want to argue this, but it seems that everybody is real quick to point out how wrong each other is.
I personally think all this arguing and finger pointing is total non-sense and am really surprised that this thread has not been locked yet. I personally wouldn't be the least bit bothered if it where locked though. I think threads like this take away from the reall meaning of this hobby, the betterment and enjoyment of these wonderful animals.
RichConley
New member
Matt, I agree that this thread is a negative.
The issue is that people are using this survey to make claims, when the survey doesnt actually support those claims.
Basically, because its incomplete, its misleading.
The scientific method is there for a reason. This survey is akin to doing experiments without a control. Not only does it not prove anything, but its a net negative to science. It doesnt tell anything, and leads people to make decisions based on false "findings"
The issue is that people are using this survey to make claims, when the survey doesnt actually support those claims.
Basically, because its incomplete, its misleading.
The scientific method is there for a reason. This survey is akin to doing experiments without a control. Not only does it not prove anything, but its a net negative to science. It doesnt tell anything, and leads people to make decisions based on false "findings"
"Originally posted by RichConley"
If CO2 is the issue, skimmers should HELP
"Originally posted by Pledosophy"
Research has shown this to be false. Please provide a link backing your statements.
"Originally posted by RichConley"
Please provide scientifically credible research papers proving otherwise.
But then RichConley provides the information and states it is a scientifically accepted concept. So he is arguing both sides of the fence?
If you have poor air circulation, such as in an airconditioned house, you will get a higher concentration of CO2 than in a naturally ventilated house. So a skimmer will then increase the CO2 in the tank in this circumstance.
If CO2 is the issue, skimmers should HELP
"Originally posted by Pledosophy"
Research has shown this to be false. Please provide a link backing your statements.
"Originally posted by RichConley"
Please provide scientifically credible research papers proving otherwise.
But then RichConley provides the information and states it is a scientifically accepted concept. So he is arguing both sides of the fence?
If you have poor air circulation, such as in an airconditioned house, you will get a higher concentration of CO2 than in a naturally ventilated house. So a skimmer will then increase the CO2 in the tank in this circumstance.
So the overwhelming response of the forum members of seahorse.org was 'NO' dont use a skimmer in your seahorse tank. So this defines seahorse.org as having an evil mantra about skimmers.
Interestingly there is a high number of people in FishGrill's survey that dont use a skimmer in their seahorse tank, so ReefCentral must now also have an Evil Mantra about skimmers.
RichConley
New member
Right, but thats not a skimmer issue. THats a CO2 issue. A tank in that house is going to have High CO2 (and low PH) whether or not you use a skimmer.
The skimmer isnt making the CO2 higher, it just pulls it towards the local environment. It negates any effect things in the tank are having. IE if the macro is pulling out more CO2 than the livestock are adding, the skimmer will net be adding CO2. If the macro is pulling out less CO2 than the livestock is putting in, then the skimmer will net reduce CO2.
It does exactly the same thing pointing a powerhead at the surface does. It WILL NOT cause supersaturation of CO2 like someone claimed earlier.
RichConley
New member
Mal, you missed my point.
It doesnt matter at this point. What matters is that the distribution of people using skimmers NOW on seahorse tanks is not the same as when that survey was started, so the data cant really be compared.
RichConley
New member
DanU, point above ^^^
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