QT System loosing fish like flies

[tkeracer619]

A few weeks ago I purchased a couple fish. 10 lyrtail anthias, 5 bicolor anthias, a mated pair of watanabe angelfish, and a blue jaw trigger.

They are in a 100G QT that tests 0 for ammonia and <10 nitrate.

Over the last week I have lost 1 fish per day. 3 Bicolor anthias, 1 lyrtail, and the female watanabe.

None of the dead fish show any signs the day prior or after they are dead. A few of the lyrtail anthias look as if there scales have slothed or turn white in little areas. I tried to take pictures but none of them showed anything.

Please help before I loose the rest of these beautiful and expensive fish...... I am at a loss for words already.

 

[Neptune777]

Here are some possible causes:

Flukes
Cyanide
Unknown pathogen spreading from fish to fish (which is why you QT)

Was the tank cycled before adding all those fish?
What are you using for filtration and what is in the tank for hiding spots?

Any meds or treatments used? Hyposalinity, copper?

 

[tkeracer619]

The QT was set up with the cured LR out of my sump in my display. Probably about 50-60lbs of it. It has a CSS running for a skimmer and plenty of flow.

I also forgot to mention that all fish are eating frozen except for the trigger.

One of my buddies purchased 5 lyrtails in the same order and dumped them strait into his tank. His fish are still doing fine.

I recieved the anthias and trigger a week prior to the angels. One bicolor and one lyrtail died over the first night, I assumed it was from shipment. Did not have another death until I added the angels. The female was dead in the morning and I have lost a fish each day since.

If it is flukes do they kill that fast? Any suggestions for a broad treatment? I have a canister filter running and can pull the rock out and replace with a bunch of pvc caves and pipes.

 

[Neptune777]

Prazipro is good for Flukes.

Perhaps the Angels introduced something. Or one of your fish was carrying something that your buddies fish were not exposed to...

 

[kevin2000]

My 02

In the future I would suggest you limit the number of fish you purchase for QTing. Diagnosing a disease is tough by itself and you will find that having multiple diseases within a QT is something that even an expert may find difficult if not impossible to handle. Qting 18 fish at a time is at least 15 more than I would suggest to the ave. aquarist.

 

[Neptune777]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=11695998#post11695998 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by kevin2000
My 02

In the future I would suggest you limit the number of fish you purchase for QTing. Diagnosing a disease is tough by itself and you will find that having multiple diseases within a QT is something that even an expert may find difficult if not impossible to handle. Qting 18 fish at a time is at least 15 more than I would suggest to the ave. aquarist.

Solid Advice!

 

[Freed]

If you are seeing white patches on the fish prior to them dying then you might have velvet.

 

[tkeracer619]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=11695998#post11695998 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by kevin2000
My 02

In the future I would suggest you limit the number of fish you purchase for QTing. Diagnosing a disease is tough by itself and you will find that having multiple diseases within a QT is something that even an expert may find difficult if not impossible to handle. Qting 18 fish at a time is at least 15 more than I would suggest to the ave. aquarist.

I would love to only stock my tank with 3 fish at a time but unfortunately if I were to do that with my quarantine regiment, it would take 2 years just for Anthias. It might be sound advice with a 100G aquarium but it is just not at all practical with my setup.

If any of them had any signs of anything I would have put them into individual tanks, yes 20 tanks. Sometimes things don't go as planned, which is why I QT in the first place. I'm not coming at this with zero experience, just asking for opinions, because I have never kept anthias. I know how to QT and research treatments ect. Problem is I don't know what im fighting. Which is why I posted here.

Thanks for the two replies with potential disease and parasite options, I have looked into them and am preparing a treatment plan. I had velvet before I QT'd, this doesnt really look the same but it is definitly an option.


From WWM under marine velvet

Infected fishes have a white, tan, golden or gray dusty or powdery appearance over their outside.

Its not really a dusty appearance. Its as if there scales are raised a bit. I am going to do a few FW dips tomorrow to eleminate this option.

 

[rlcline76]

Have you looked into amyloodinium? That can cause skin to strip away. Have you put any treatments into the tank?

 

[tkeracer619]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=11706224#post11706224 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by rlcline76
Have you looked into amyloodinium? That can cause skin to strip away. Have you put any treatments into the tank?

No treatments as of yet. I have been waiting on a positive id or a better id before trying to medicate.



EDIT: Just pulled the blue jaw trigger. He is no longer. Is there anything that causes darkened bellies? Intestinal worms? That is the only problem I could see with him period.

 

[rlcline76]

Occasionally a nutritional problem will cause discoloration here and there...usually something that takes more time than a couple of weeks. At the rate everything is going downhill, I would be treating with copper. Someone here may disagree with me, but I believe all of the fish listed can handle it, some might even suggest formalin3...but that is a very strong drug and I would be cautious to recommend it. If it is amyloodinium, you will need to act quickly because it is a fast killer, and as I can tell, you already realize that you do not have a friendly pathogen.

I know you do not want to hear how sparse the QT set up should be, it is not practical for your set up. A QT full of dead fish is not practical either. Try not to be too hard on those trying to help out, even by telling you what you might not want to hear right now.

Good luck!

 

[tkeracer619]

Yeah, I didn't mean to come off hard on anyone. Sorry if it sounded that way. This has just been very stressfull event and that reply was after sitting in traffic for 5 hours.

 

[spike78]

Where did you get the QT tank? Is it custom built or used? I'm wondering if maybe the silicone is bad or you have some other poison seeping into the tank. Are you running carbon by any chance?

Generally you want to go bare bottom with PVC or plastic decorations that can be easily cleaned for your QT. I used to have rock in my QT and it made treating for ich a pain in the neck. Just something else to think about, I doubt the rock is contributing to deaths.

 

[tkeracer619]

The tank is a backup I have in case of problems. I used it the last 4 months to house a lot of my livestock after my 150 burst a seam. I did not have any problems out of it.

I have another system that is running set up like that. These guys were just so healthy looking I decided to put them in the one with the rock so they would feel more secure. I am going to pull the rock and swap the bioballs from the other tank onto this one.

 

[tkeracer619]

Update: Last night I was watching the fish and noticed that all of them had very dark bellies. One of them had something hanging out its bottom. Unfortunatly it was after 9 and I didn't have the proper medication. Feering that the fish looked like they were gonna pop I did some searching. I came up with fresh water parasite tabs from Jungle at walmart, the active ingredients are praziquantel, diflubenzuron, metronidazole, and acriflavine.... I was unsure but the list looked like it would be ok. This morning the fish have a lot more normal coloration in there bellies, the poop has come out, the fish look a lot better already, and the few zoanthids on one of the rocks is still open. I also have not noticed any microlife die off.

I know its to early to jump the gun but I am hoping this solves the problem or atleast it gives me hope. Atleast the fish are able to pass waste.

Here is the link to the tabs http://www.junglelabs.com/pages/details.asp?item=TB635

 

[tkeracer619]

Update: The fish have stopped dying. The fresh water medication I found at walmart actually works! The fish have passed the parasite that was in there bellies. I ran carbon, did a 50% water change, and am now treating with copper in case of amyloodinium.

Thanks for the help, I will update if needed.

Note: The medication seemed to fair ok with rock and the things on the live rock. Small stars, snails, and crabs will not survive it seems. I had some stars survive the 24 hour treatment but I doubt they would survive for the standard 48 hour treatment.