Randy's 180G Reef-Photo Journal
- Thread starter rdmpe
- Start date
- Status
rdmpe
New member
Making some progress! I have the actuated jandy valve system put together and wired (not plumbed tho). I'm going to post some more info and pictures this weekend. It's pretty slick IMO. Also getting all of the unions, valves and such together. This stuff adds up quick $$$ ouch.
I just ordered two pumps:
Sequence Tarpon for the sump return, running two penductors
Sequence Dart for the closed loop
I just ordered two pumps:
Sequence Tarpon for the sump return, running two penductors
Sequence Dart for the closed loop
rdmpe
New member
FINALLY AN UPDATE
FINALLY AN UPDATE
I have all of the parts set up and working for my flow switching device. I really had my mind set on doing some type of flow switching to make the tank more dynamic, and because I like gadgets! I looked at a lot of different options for flow switching, including:
OceanMotions 4-way
OceanMotions SuperSquirt
SCWD
Sinusoidally Varying Valve (cylindrical)
Motorized Ball Valve
Actuated Jandy Valve (typically used for swimming pools)
One of the driving factors in deciding what to use was that I want to run penductors on this system, and they create approx. 10 psi (~23') of backpressure. I want to use penductors since I want to get maximum flow from my sump return but don't want to pull 2000+ gph through the sump (too noisy, etc.). So I figured a sump return is a good place to use penductors. I can run it at around 1000 gph and get much more effective flow than that inside the tank. They claim that for every one gallon pumped through the penductor you can get five gallons of tank water moving through the penductor, under ideal conditions (7.5 gpm at 10 psi) I will be happy if I'm getting 2X to 3X flow. Assuming 3X actual flow, I'll get 3000 gph from my sump return and another 2800+ gph from my closed loop. That should be enough flow I think.
So what I decided to use...
- The OM devices are not really set up for back pressure created by the penductors. From what I've read here and on their forums, using their products with penductors or eductors has been problematic.
- SCWD was ruled out for the same reason as the OM devices.
- I couldn't deal with the sinusoidally varying valve project. I don't feel like I have access to the equipment to attempt that project, and don't have the time either.
- I liked the actuated ball valve idea . . . until I found out how much they cost. As far as I could tell, I'd be looking at over $300 for a 1.5" setup, not including the timer.
- The Jandy valve looked like a good option to me. I have one on my pool, and it runs under more pressure and flow than I'll need on the reef tank. They are very simple to take apart to clean, lube, etc. and the price is right.
All of the parts for my Jandy valve setup were bought on ebay, all new items, and for much less than typical retail.
I paid
$36 shipped for the Omron H3CA-A digital timer
$30 for the 1.5" Jandy neverlube valve (which I promptly lubed)
$90 for the Jandy 2440 valve actuator
$10 for the 24VAC 1500mA power supply (from a local surplus store)
I have it all wired up and it works great. There are a few other people I've heard of using this type of system, so I'm confident it is going to work well. It is not really made to run at the duty cycle that I'm going to run it at but if I lube the valve seals every few months I think it will be fine. And the neverlube valve has a lifetime guarantee.
Some pictures:
I have the tank in the house finally, although it is still far from ready for water...
And this morning I'm going out to pick up the correct union ball valves (I had bought the wrong type last time, they can't actually be taken apart while under pressure - wierd). Once I have them I can start the sump/fuge plumbing. But I probably can't go too far with that until my pumps get here, have to make sure everything fits under there. I have a feeling it's going to be a little tight. It will be like fitting a puzzle together...
If I had done a little more looking around, I would have realized I needed the stand to be at least 6" higher. Although it works well from an aesthetic point of view since it is about level with the back of that sofa, it would be great to have 6" more vertical space under there for plumbing... But I am not up for modifying the stand, so I'll make it work as is.
FINALLY AN UPDATE
I have all of the parts set up and working for my flow switching device. I really had my mind set on doing some type of flow switching to make the tank more dynamic, and because I like gadgets! I looked at a lot of different options for flow switching, including:
OceanMotions 4-way
OceanMotions SuperSquirt
SCWD
Sinusoidally Varying Valve (cylindrical)
Motorized Ball Valve
Actuated Jandy Valve (typically used for swimming pools)
One of the driving factors in deciding what to use was that I want to run penductors on this system, and they create approx. 10 psi (~23') of backpressure. I want to use penductors since I want to get maximum flow from my sump return but don't want to pull 2000+ gph through the sump (too noisy, etc.). So I figured a sump return is a good place to use penductors. I can run it at around 1000 gph and get much more effective flow than that inside the tank. They claim that for every one gallon pumped through the penductor you can get five gallons of tank water moving through the penductor, under ideal conditions (7.5 gpm at 10 psi) I will be happy if I'm getting 2X to 3X flow. Assuming 3X actual flow, I'll get 3000 gph from my sump return and another 2800+ gph from my closed loop. That should be enough flow I think.
So what I decided to use...
- The OM devices are not really set up for back pressure created by the penductors. From what I've read here and on their forums, using their products with penductors or eductors has been problematic.
- SCWD was ruled out for the same reason as the OM devices.
- I couldn't deal with the sinusoidally varying valve project. I don't feel like I have access to the equipment to attempt that project, and don't have the time either.
- I liked the actuated ball valve idea . . . until I found out how much they cost. As far as I could tell, I'd be looking at over $300 for a 1.5" setup, not including the timer.
- The Jandy valve looked like a good option to me. I have one on my pool, and it runs under more pressure and flow than I'll need on the reef tank. They are very simple to take apart to clean, lube, etc. and the price is right.
All of the parts for my Jandy valve setup were bought on ebay, all new items, and for much less than typical retail.
I paid
$36 shipped for the Omron H3CA-A digital timer
$30 for the 1.5" Jandy neverlube valve (which I promptly lubed)
$90 for the Jandy 2440 valve actuator
$10 for the 24VAC 1500mA power supply (from a local surplus store)
I have it all wired up and it works great. There are a few other people I've heard of using this type of system, so I'm confident it is going to work well. It is not really made to run at the duty cycle that I'm going to run it at but if I lube the valve seals every few months I think it will be fine. And the neverlube valve has a lifetime guarantee.
Some pictures:
I have the tank in the house finally, although it is still far from ready for water...
And this morning I'm going out to pick up the correct union ball valves (I had bought the wrong type last time, they can't actually be taken apart while under pressure - wierd). Once I have them I can start the sump/fuge plumbing. But I probably can't go too far with that until my pumps get here, have to make sure everything fits under there. I have a feeling it's going to be a little tight. It will be like fitting a puzzle together...
If I had done a little more looking around, I would have realized I needed the stand to be at least 6" higher. Although it works well from an aesthetic point of view since it is about level with the back of that sofa, it would be great to have 6" more vertical space under there for plumbing... But I am not up for modifying the stand, so I'll make it work as is.
rdmpe
New member
PLUMBING QUESTION
PLUMBING QUESTION
I got my new Sequence Dart today :celeb1: :celeb2: :celeb3: :celeb2: :celeb1:
I know they are now shipping with a stronger black wet end,
but I don't plan on breaking this blue one and they'll ship me
a new one if I do. The thing I like about this pump version is
that it has the Baldor motor. I wanted the Baldor motor...
So my question about plumbing is . . .
I need to connect two slip fittings with a very short piece
of 2" pipe. Should I use spa flex or just use rigid pipe?
Here's the picture...
It would not give me much flex tho since it would be so short.
But a little flex there might be helpful for fitting things up.
There will be plenty of spa flex above the ball valve so vibration
isolation will still happen either way.
Here's another picture
So what do you use to cut spaflex? A hacksaw?
PLUMBING QUESTION
I got my new Sequence Dart today :celeb1: :celeb2: :celeb3: :celeb2: :celeb1:
I know they are now shipping with a stronger black wet end,
but I don't plan on breaking this blue one and they'll ship me
a new one if I do. The thing I like about this pump version is
that it has the Baldor motor. I wanted the Baldor motor...
So my question about plumbing is . . .
I need to connect two slip fittings with a very short piece
of 2" pipe. Should I use spa flex or just use rigid pipe?
Here's the picture...
It would not give me much flex tho since it would be so short.
But a little flex there might be helpful for fitting things up.
There will be plenty of spa flex above the ball valve so vibration
isolation will still happen either way.
Here's another picture
So what do you use to cut spaflex? A hacksaw?
rdmpe
New member
It is very heavy. Three guys could probably handle it but it would be tough. Depends on your overflows too. As you can see, I have a large overflow on one end. That end is noticably heavier than the other end...
I would call it 300 lbs off the top of my head. I bet if you call or email them they'll tell you the approx. weight for a given size.
I would call it 300 lbs off the top of my head. I bet if you call or email them they'll tell you the approx. weight for a given size.
I cut spa flex with a ratchet type PVC cutter... it makes good clean square cuts in flex... right or wrong I then glue the spa flex into the joints...
http://uniweld.com/catalog/tubing_tools/pvc_pipe_cutters.htm
lowes and HD have them... so do ACE Northern and Habor Frieght
I haven't done a big tank but, I replumbed my 90 in spa flex and I'm really happy with the clean look... Plus I uses 1/2in pan head screws and some brackets to hold the spa flex up against the Plywood bottom *make sure your bottom is 3/4*
It's easy to work with and guesstimate how much and what shape you need. Plus if it's a little long a quick wack and viola...
HTH
http://uniweld.com/catalog/tubing_tools/pvc_pipe_cutters.htm
lowes and HD have them... so do ACE Northern and Habor Frieght
I haven't done a big tank but, I replumbed my 90 in spa flex and I'm really happy with the clean look... Plus I uses 1/2in pan head screws and some brackets to hold the spa flex up against the Plywood bottom *make sure your bottom is 3/4*
It's easy to work with and guesstimate how much and what shape you need. Plus if it's a little long a quick wack and viola...
HTH
Id imagine as soon as you sit about a ton of water onto the styrofoam; it quickly becomes about 1/32" foam 
Ive always been a fan of cutting PVC with a miter saw. maybe its not correct, but it seems to work well; get perfect straight cuts, nice and clean. and super fast.
donno how itd do for flexible tubing.
Ive always been a fan of cutting PVC with a miter saw. maybe its not correct, but it seems to work well; get perfect straight cuts, nice and clean. and super fast.
donno how itd do for flexible tubing.
rdmpe
New member
The amazing thing about the styrofoam is it actually hardly compresses. I couldn't believe it. So I did a quick calc. The water weight per square inch is about 24" x 1" x 1" x (62.4 lb/cf) x (1 cf / 1728 ci) = 0.87 lb per square inch. The glass tank itself adds about another 0.17 lb per square inch.
So in reality, the styrofoam only sees about one lb of weight per square inch and doesn't squeeze down much. Not what I expected at all.
I do have a cutoff saw, maybe I'll try cutting some flex tubing with it (very carefully!) wouldn't want it to get hung up somehow...
So in reality, the styrofoam only sees about one lb of weight per square inch and doesn't squeeze down much. Not what I expected at all.
I do have a cutoff saw, maybe I'll try cutting some flex tubing with it (very carefully!) wouldn't want it to get hung up somehow...
hmmm wow; did expect it to be much higher. I can see how styrofoam could help now. before I thought, thats silly... the styrofoam will just flatten like a pancake and couldnt possibly offer any support. I still believe that even 1lb on an inch will flatten it somewhat; but guess it would help with distributing the weight after all.
very cool.
did you get a glass tank or an acrylic? cause your overflows are acrylic right? I didnt even see an acrylic 180 on there, so I planned on glass. but the pictures looked like their overflows were glass too.
very cool.
did you get a glass tank or an acrylic? cause your overflows are acrylic right? I didnt even see an acrylic 180 on there, so I planned on glass. but the pictures looked like their overflows were glass too.
donfishy76
In Memoriam
definitely sticking around to watch this unfold! looks great so far!
kudos!
kudos!
rdmpe
New member
Thanks donfishy
areze - the tank is glass. The overflow is also glass. However, it has an acrylic cover that slides over it. I actually sort of like the glass look, but the drain pipes probably would look kinda crappy. So I'll end up using the acrylic I think.
I don't know how "Fresh" your tank will be, but mine was only a week old when I picked it up here in Orlando. So I had to wait over two weeks for the silicone to cure more before I put water in it. They put the date on the glass so you'll know when it was built...
We had originally built my stand to support a tank that only sat on it's edges. So then when I bought this tank and found out it had to have full support across the whole bottom, I had to do some retrofitting. But it turned out rock solid.
areze - the tank is glass. The overflow is also glass. However, it has an acrylic cover that slides over it. I actually sort of like the glass look, but the drain pipes probably would look kinda crappy. So I'll end up using the acrylic I think.
I don't know how "Fresh" your tank will be, but mine was only a week old when I picked it up here in Orlando. So I had to wait over two weeks for the silicone to cure more before I put water in it. They put the date on the glass so you'll know when it was built...
We had originally built my stand to support a tank that only sat on it's edges. So then when I bought this tank and found out it had to have full support across the whole bottom, I had to do some retrofitting. But it turned out rock solid.
rdmpe
New member
I still don't have a good way to cut the 2" spaflex. I've been using a box knife which is sort of a PITA but it works. I only have one piece of that size to deal with so it isn't too bad. OF COURSE the first piece I cut and glued ends on is much too long due to a bonehead mistake... Oh well, good practice I guess. So this will be my 30th (or so) trip to buy pvc fittings... Should have bought extras of some of this stuff.
I also decided to go with a long sweep 90 ell at the pump intake. I have plenty of room for it, so it works out to a better fit too. So here's the pump with the union ball valves on it. It's the Sequence Dart with 2" intake and 1.5" output.
So now I just have to connect it up to the closed loop bulkheads. I'm also putting a tee in the output side of the plumbing, with a garden hose barb on it. So to drain the tank, I can just hook up a garden hose to it right there. Only problem is, I don't really have room for a valve beyond the hose connection, so the pump output will still be going to the tank in addition to the garden hose unless I can think of something...
I also decided to go with a long sweep 90 ell at the pump intake. I have plenty of room for it, so it works out to a better fit too. So here's the pump with the union ball valves on it. It's the Sequence Dart with 2" intake and 1.5" output.
So now I just have to connect it up to the closed loop bulkheads. I'm also putting a tee in the output side of the plumbing, with a garden hose barb on it. So to drain the tank, I can just hook up a garden hose to it right there. Only problem is, I don't really have room for a valve beyond the hose connection, so the pump output will still be going to the tank in addition to the garden hose unless I can think of something...
not sure if I understand it; you said the output side.
if you put it in the input side to the pump; from the bulkheads. then put a valve on that; then hook up a hose. all youd have to do is open that valve and instant water change.
with the sump running the water would come right out of the sump and you could replace it right back into the sump all at once which would be pretty cool.
put the water change bucket on a table; sypon it right into the sump; and right out of the tank.
might get some overlap. but unless your sump holds enough for the whole water change at once, or you pour water into the tank; not much else you could do.
I like the idea though; Im going to put that into one of my closed loops. easier than getting a random tube and syphoning it out.
so you have 1 closed loop and 1 sump pump. just 2 total.
if you put it in the input side to the pump; from the bulkheads. then put a valve on that; then hook up a hose. all youd have to do is open that valve and instant water change.
with the sump running the water would come right out of the sump and you could replace it right back into the sump all at once which would be pretty cool.
put the water change bucket on a table; sypon it right into the sump; and right out of the tank.
might get some overlap. but unless your sump holds enough for the whole water change at once, or you pour water into the tank; not much else you could do.
I like the idea though; Im going to put that into one of my closed loops. easier than getting a random tube and syphoning it out.
so you have 1 closed loop and 1 sump pump. just 2 total.
rdmpe
New member
Yeah I have the hose bib on the CL return side. I figure if I want to drain the tank, I can get some extra flow by opening the hose barb with the pump running. That's my theory anyway.
I just realized I said "garden hose barb" on that earlier post but what I meant was "garden hose BIB"...
I also may put a garden hose bib on the sump return, but not sure. I already have a lot going on over there with the actuated valve and all that mess.
You are right, I only have the two pumps. The Dart running the closed loop and the Tarpon (will arrive next Wednesday) running the sump/fuge.
I'm hoping to use this for water changes somehow. Haven't worked it out yet though. I don't have all that big of a sump system, basically two 25G rubbermaid type tubs that will be connected with 1.5" pvc and uniseals. So I'll probably pump the old water out of the tank via the CL and then pump the new water from a trash can storage into the tank or sump...
I just realized I said "garden hose barb" on that earlier post but what I meant was "garden hose BIB"...
I also may put a garden hose bib on the sump return, but not sure. I already have a lot going on over there with the actuated valve and all that mess.
You are right, I only have the two pumps. The Dart running the closed loop and the Tarpon (will arrive next Wednesday) running the sump/fuge.
I'm hoping to use this for water changes somehow. Haven't worked it out yet though. I don't have all that big of a sump system, basically two 25G rubbermaid type tubs that will be connected with 1.5" pvc and uniseals. So I'll probably pump the old water out of the tank via the CL and then pump the new water from a trash can storage into the tank or sump...
- Status
