Refugium Set Up Questions

M

mjohns27

New member
I am looking to set up a remote refugium for my 60 gallon cube with some chaeto and other "display" type macros. I currently have a 20 gallon sump and found a 75 gallon tank online that I am wanting to drill for an overflow and return. I am fairly new to the hobby and have a few questions.

- If I add a 75 gallon tank to my system, am I going to need to upgrade my skimmer? I currently run a Vertex Omega 130 (rated for 130 gallon lightly stocked tank or 65 gallon medium stocked tank according to BRS).
- I am looking to plumb a manifold off my return pump to feed the DT, a dual reactor, the refugium, and a drain line for water changes, how big of pump do you think I need? There is about 5 ft of head pressure to the DT, and about 4-5 ft for the refugium I am planning.
- Looking to get some inexpensive grow bulbs with some clamps to mount them. The refugium is 21" deep, will I need stronger lighting? (looking to keep it as cheap as possible)

I will have some live rock with a bare bottom in the refugium. Any advice or tips is much appreciated. Thank you!
 
Hello MJohns27, welcome to this wonderful hobby!

Protein skimmers being rated for so many gallons is misleading. I might catch some flak for this, but the basics of how large your skimmer is depends on how many nutrient producing organisms you have in your aquarium. Nutrient absorbing critters (in your case algae) do not require a protein skimmer to stay healthy. Ask yourself, do I have a large number of fish or am I a heavy feeder? If so, then you need a large skimmer. If you have few fish and/or you are a light feeder, than a smaller skimmer is ok. Your Vertex should work well for your set-up. If I understand correctly, you are looking to turn the 75 into a refugium right? If so, you might find that running your skimmer less will actually create a healthier refugium! Keep your Vertex and see how the algae grows. If it grows slowly, then place your skimmer on a cheap timer set to only work 75% of the time. If the algae continues to not grow, keep turning down the timer on the skimmer.
As for a pump, check the charts most manufacturers have. I imagine an Ehiem 1262 will work well for this application.
Grow lights. A hotly debated topic. You desire to grow "display algaes"; many of these have high light requirements. A great cheap solution are the GE Bright Stik lights; I've used these on a planted aquarium with decent success and they are dirt cheap for a bright LED. Alternatively, there are plenty of people unloading Kessil A150 lights very inexpensively on Ebay and Craigslist. As far as a refugium light goes, they cannot be beat.

I hope this helps and good luck with the set-up!
 
I agree with most of what H2OCulture had to say, especially about the skimmer.

Your macro algae will mostly reduce nitrate and phosphate levels more than nutrients. But they won't add things to the water that the skimmer would need to take out. I've run good size refugiums with chaeto for years with various kinds of lights. Grow lights are probably your cheapest good bet. I recently set up a new system (due to a massive tank failure) and decided to do a display refugium. I'm running Reef Breeders Photon V2 fixtures over both tanks. Thet fuge has only been set up about 6 weeks and the algae is only just starting to show signs of growth.

 
Refugiums make lesser need for skimming. So I don't think you need more skimming unless you do it wrong. You might find that the skimmer is not needed.
 
H2OCulture said:
I love your stands! Very clean.
Click to expand...


Thanks. After years of good looking tanks on home made stands that were OK but not top shelf, we are enjoying the modern look of this system too.

The reef system is all CADlight Artisan 125 which I decided I like better than the Red Sea Reefer 425 for various reasons. The 50g cube I made and the stand is a kitchen cabinet that I retro fitted for the 400 pound tank.
 
Do you really NEED that refugium, or is it just another tank? We all want another tank...

There is no shame adding one later on if you need it... ;)

Just as an experiment, take it offline for a month and see what happens. The tank might fall on something else.
 
Last edited:
oneofmany said:
Do you really NEED that refugium, or is it just another tank? We all want another tank...

There is no shame adding one later on if you need it... ;)

Just as an experiment, take it offline for a month and see what happens. The tank might fall on something else.
Click to expand...

Who are you addressing this post to?
 
There is a direct relation to Skimmer output and the amount and color of the waste product from the skimmer.. Here is how i come to this conclusion.

First..
my tank is about 240 gallon 84x32x22 inch
My skimmer is a skimz sm201
My Refugium is a 55 gallon barrel split connected end to end Lite with 6 30w 7000k led flood lights..

When i set up the refugium.. it has about 100 lbs of sand in one of the containers with maybe two quarts of Caulerpa and a softball size ball of chaeto. the Refugium is feed from the water leaving my display thru a ball valve bypassing before the sump to about 300 gph thru the fuge ..

So when i first set it up the algae seemed to not grow much so i reduced the water flow thru the refugium as the refugium algae started growing (fuge becoming more mature ) the dark color and amount of skim on the skimmer started to reduce. i have had to adjust the skimmer more and more closed.. and it went from filling the collection cup in 3 days to a week and a half..

now i can do a huge clean up pruning in the fuge and the skimmer will try to over flow the next day.. when i clip the fuge back big time the skimmer will ramp up .. and vise versa .. it takes a few days for this to happen...

i agree with above that there are things a fuge will not clean out of the water such as contaminates . skimmer removed desolved organics before they break down to nitrate and phosphate.. where the fuge removes the nutrients nitrate and phosphate.

My opinion a fuge can not totally replace a skimmer but can help with less maintenance on it. The fuge however in my opinion a much better solution then running gfo and bio pellets / chemicals for controlling suck.. not to mention all of the bio diversity that grows in there without fear of predators in your display..

The above is from how my system works .. i have NO algae issues and i only do very small water changes .

I would post pics but I am in the process of moving my fuge to living room under my display from the ugly drums to a 90 gal display fuge. ..

For what its worth this my opinion...... Your tank could act differently...

Good Luck :fish1:
 
Thank you for the insight. The idea behind my post was to find out if I could add the additional 75 gallons of water to my system without upgrading the skimmer. I think I will give it a shot as it seems that the fuge will help control nutrients and add any back into the water. Looking forward to starting this project!

I currently run an Eheim 3000 (793 gph) and it handles the return needs for my 60 cube just fine (it's been a great pump and very quiet too. I'll be moving this into by Brute trashcan for a water change station). I am looking to purchase a bigger return pump for the manifold that will feed the DT (5ft head pressure), the fuge (roughly 4ft head pressure), a dual GFO/carbon reactor, and another T for water changes. I am looking at the Sicce Syncra Silent 5.0 (1321 gph) as I've read good things about Sicce pumps. Does anyone have any insight if this pump will handle the demands of the manifold? Lots of good Black Friday deals out there right now!

Thanks for all your comments!!
 
mjohns27 said:
Thank you for the insight. The idea behind my post was to find out if I could add the additional 75 gallons of water to my system without upgrading the skimmer. I think I will give it a shot as it seems that the fuge will help control nutrients and add any back into the water. Looking forward to starting this project!

I currently run an Eheim 3000 (793 gph) and it handles the return needs for my 60 cube just fine (it's been a great pump and very quiet too. I'll be moving this into by Brute trashcan for a water change station). I am looking to purchase a bigger return pump for the manifold that will feed the DT (5ft head pressure), the fuge (roughly 4ft head pressure), a dual GFO/carbon reactor, and another T for water changes. I am looking at the Sicce Syncra Silent 5.0 (1321 gph) as I've read good things about Sicce pumps. Does anyone have any insight if this pump will handle the demands of the manifold? Lots of good Black Friday deals out there right now!

Thanks for all your comments!!
Click to expand...

If you can in my opinion if you can split the Drain from the display tank and have some of that water pass thru the Refugium then into the sump.. Is the best way to do this.. You want slower flow thru the fuge . Of Course to do this you will have to be Creative with plumbing.. But its not to complicated ..

this will let you use the same return pump and use no more Electric..

I am actually moving my fuge tomorrow painting the new area for it today..
 
Your refugium may be over kill. I have a 300 gallon with a light fish load, a SRO 500 skimmer and chaeto in my sump. I had to up my feeding to get the chaeto growing and a little algae growth in the tank. I guess I need to add more fish.

For light, I just use cheap LED daylight bulbs on a cheap metal fixture. It works just fine. But my refugium space is far smaller than my DT. In your case, your refugium will exceed your DT.

Like the others, I see the algae as working with the skimmer. The algae are slightly different. The skimmer takes out macro molecules and fine particulates. These have nutrients in them that have to break down and release ions: phosphates, nitrates, etc, into the water column. The algae will suck out the phosphates and nitrates but not the fine particulates.
 
ericarenee said:
If you can in my opinion if you can split the Drain from the display tank and have some of that water pass thru the Refugium then into the sump.. Is the best way to do this.. You want slower flow thru the fuge . Of Course to do this you will have to be creative with plumbing.. but it's not too complicated ..
Click to expand...

Oh man, why didn't you bring this up when I was putting mine together! That's an excellent idea. However the plumbing does seem a bit tricky. Have you mapped out your plumbing yet? I'd love to see it.
 
Just gonna throw this in there..
At what point do I need to start my refugium? Is it after I cycle the tank, or when I start adding a few fish or what?
 
It really doesn't matter when you start it. Setting it up at the very start makes the most sense (no algae yet). Adding a macro algae as soon as ammonia levels fall seems reasonable since nitrate levels will soon be going up. The refugium is like the DT, they take time to mature and become established.
 
I just want to share my experience, something amazing just happen with my Fuge. I have a 55 gallons display and I decided to add a DIY HOB fuge to it, just to see if it would make any difference.

It has been running for about 5 months and I had very little growth and still had algae in my MDT. It only had a small 7 watts LED on top of it. actually it is 7 watts splitted between blue and white small LED.

Last week I decided to add a PAR30 5000k 14 watts LED on the side of the Fuge and BOOM!!! 90% of the algae in the MDT gone in a week, water is much cleaner and my Cheato has double in size in a week. All of this from a small 1.5 gallon HOB Fuge with a total of 21 watts of LED. There is hundred of oxygen bubbles on my cheato and my PH went up as well. Use to hang out around 7.8 - 8.0 and now 8.0 - 8.2.

This 30$ bucks investment blows my mind!

Good luck to you!
 
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