waterfaller1
New member
Does chaetomorpha have to be taken out for nutrient removal?
Remove Chaeto Or Not?
- Thread starter waterfaller1
- Start date
racrumrine
New member
Usually, the nutrients stay locked up in the macro algae until you remove it from your tank.
Assuming it is growing for you, you let it reach the natural size of the space you want to keep it in, then you start to trim it and give to other reefers to start their chaeto farm; or, you toss it.
I started out with a piece about the size of a golf ball. Now it's the size of a basketball. Nitrates are zero in that tank.
Depending on your area, some people are even willing to pay, or trade, you for some.
Best of luck,
Roy
Assuming it is growing for you, you let it reach the natural size of the space you want to keep it in, then you start to trim it and give to other reefers to start their chaeto farm; or, you toss it.
I started out with a piece about the size of a golf ball. Now it's the size of a basketball. Nitrates are zero in that tank.
Depending on your area, some people are even willing to pay, or trade, you for some.
Best of luck,
Roy
Seahorsewisprer
In Memoriam
Roy, do you test for phosphate? I'm curious with a zero nitrate level, where your PO4 is at?
waterfaller1
New member
So..it's ok to leave it in until you just need room to grow more?racrumrine said:
As the ball of chaeto gets huge..it won't get enough light correct?So it's best to take some out at that point?
I'm just trying to clarify this..I always thought the macro had to be removed for nutrient export.
How about xenia....same thing?
racrumrine
New member
I don't remember what my last PO4 reading was. I'll have to check my log and post it later.
In my sump, I rotate the ball of Chaeto about once a day or so. From my experience, the color of the Chaeto stays exactly the same whether or not it's facing the light. I've read before that an ideal situation would be for the chaeto to be able rotate or tumble on it's own. However, mine can no longer do that and I haven't noticed any adverse effects.
As far as I know, unless the macro algae dies, it won't release it's nutrients back into the tank.
Best of luck,
Roy
In my sump, I rotate the ball of Chaeto about once a day or so. From my experience, the color of the Chaeto stays exactly the same whether or not it's facing the light. I've read before that an ideal situation would be for the chaeto to be able rotate or tumble on it's own. However, mine can no longer do that and I haven't noticed any adverse effects.
As far as I know, unless the macro algae dies, it won't release it's nutrients back into the tank.
Best of luck,
Roy
Seahorsewisprer
In Memoriam
Roy, I'm just curious because of the ratio of nitrate/phosphate that macros and plants use. It turns out that we need to add nitrate to get the macros to consume the phosphate!
Weird, huh? Adding nitrate?
But, some reefers prefer to use that expensive and cumbersome phosphate adsorber stuff...I've found it much more convienient and a lot cheaper to add nitrate. It only works for those of us who are lucky enough to have zero nitrate!
Waterfaller, to actually remove the nutrients from the system, it must be physically removed. But, the more macro you have sucking up nutrients the less available for nuisence algaes, right? So, until you have a zero nutrient level, I would grow as much as posssible.
My goal is to have ZERO phosphate! (I hope Mr Barr doesn't see that! If I ever get to the point where PO4 reads zippo, I'm going to give my fish the biggest fiesta! I am just getting used to adding N03, but adding PO4 is going to take a major philosophy adjustment!)
But, what if these crazy talkers are right? What if one day I have soooo much green stuff that I can feed my fish to the point of obesity?
If it really happens, I'm buying a juvenile Emporator!
Weird, huh? Adding nitrate?
But, some reefers prefer to use that expensive and cumbersome phosphate adsorber stuff...I've found it much more convienient and a lot cheaper to add nitrate. It only works for those of us who are lucky enough to have zero nitrate!
Waterfaller, to actually remove the nutrients from the system, it must be physically removed. But, the more macro you have sucking up nutrients the less available for nuisence algaes, right? So, until you have a zero nutrient level, I would grow as much as posssible.
My goal is to have ZERO phosphate! (I hope Mr Barr doesn't see that! If I ever get to the point where PO4 reads zippo, I'm going to give my fish the biggest fiesta! I am just getting used to adding N03, but adding PO4 is going to take a major philosophy adjustment!)
But, what if these crazy talkers are right? What if one day I have soooo much green stuff that I can feed my fish to the point of obesity?
If it really happens, I'm buying a juvenile Emporator!
racrumrine
New member
Because I feed the critters in the tank, I think I'm always adding sources for Nitrates.
Fortunately, it's not measurable via my Salifert Nitrate test kit.
As an aside, before I had the Chaeto, the lowest I could go with Nitrates was 3-5 with a Euro Reef Skimmer. Now, there are days the skimmer hardly works (at one point, the air intake on the pump was plugged up by a small snail for a few weeks and I couldn't figure out why it wasn't working right) and the nitrates still test out as undetectible.
On my tank without a skimmer, my nitrates run from 25 to 50 depending on frequency of water changes. At one point, that tank only had live rocks and shrimp in it and Nitrates were 15-25. If that tank had a sump, I would throw in a bunch of Chaeto to test how low I could get the nitrates to go without a skimmer.
After Steve Tyree told me he ran all of his tanks without skimmers (he uses sponges instead), it made me think that skimmers might be a crutch that we overly rely on.
Someday, I might be willing to run the no skimmer experiment on my main tank. However, now that I have a lot more SPS (which I'm trying to master taking care of), I don't think I should be messing with so many variables at the same time until I have really mastered SPS growth and coloring.
Best of luck,
Roy
Fortunately, it's not measurable via my Salifert Nitrate test kit.
As an aside, before I had the Chaeto, the lowest I could go with Nitrates was 3-5 with a Euro Reef Skimmer. Now, there are days the skimmer hardly works (at one point, the air intake on the pump was plugged up by a small snail for a few weeks and I couldn't figure out why it wasn't working right) and the nitrates still test out as undetectible.
On my tank without a skimmer, my nitrates run from 25 to 50 depending on frequency of water changes. At one point, that tank only had live rocks and shrimp in it and Nitrates were 15-25. If that tank had a sump, I would throw in a bunch of Chaeto to test how low I could get the nitrates to go without a skimmer.
After Steve Tyree told me he ran all of his tanks without skimmers (he uses sponges instead), it made me think that skimmers might be a crutch that we overly rely on.
Someday, I might be willing to run the no skimmer experiment on my main tank. However, now that I have a lot more SPS (which I'm trying to master taking care of), I don't think I should be messing with so many variables at the same time until I have really mastered SPS growth and coloring.
Best of luck,
Roy
Seahorsewisprer
In Memoriam
The problem with just adding nitrate through feeding is that you actually add phosphate, which isn't removed by your anaerobic bacterias, and is removed at a much slower rate through your macros. So, the PO4 builds at a faster rate than the nitrate. It just depends on how you want to address the increasing PO4. It will de reduced through water changes, but because water changes also remove the nitrate, the PO4 continues to elevate.
I have gorgeous SPS! I'm into pinks and purples now, but I have the sexiest turquoise hydnopora on this planet! it grows like a weed! And, weird as it sounds, I dose nitrogen compounds!
I run without a skimmer, with a ton of sponge and a lot of macros, seagrass and mangroves, in my main display and a large sump. I really think once your tank hits zero nitrate, you might consider the crazy talk! Phosphate in my system was much more problematic when I just addressed the nitrate issue.
But, it is a pretty new concept with SPS fans. I do think the crazy talkers are going to win them over, though!
But, if it is too weird, I am going to invent a PO4 reactor! Think it could be a big seller before everyone figures it out!
I have gorgeous SPS! I'm into pinks and purples now, but I have the sexiest turquoise hydnopora on this planet! it grows like a weed! And, weird as it sounds, I dose nitrogen compounds!
I run without a skimmer, with a ton of sponge and a lot of macros, seagrass and mangroves, in my main display and a large sump. I really think once your tank hits zero nitrate, you might consider the crazy talk! Phosphate in my system was much more problematic when I just addressed the nitrate issue.
But, it is a pretty new concept with SPS fans. I do think the crazy talkers are going to win them over, though!
But, if it is too weird, I am going to invent a PO4 reactor! Think it could be a big seller before everyone figures it out!
waterfaller1
New member
Well THAT really clarified things 
Plantbrain
Active member
If you use a test kit, especially at the lower or extreme ranges, ALWAYS make a reference solution to calibrate the test kit.
I've had more folks have issues due to some cheapy test kit that was plain wrong.
I use lab equipment and spects, so I have accuracies without touch a color chart down to 10ppb of NO3, 100ppb of PO4 and these tend to be the extended workable ranges for labs.
I could likely knock it down to 3-5ppb but the error would float that much also.
You cannot measure PO4 to limit Cyano's, you do not have the equipment to measure the limitation...........anyway, PO4 leaks out of critters, corals etc, can measure something before you have a chance to measure it?
I can, but few of you folks are going to use stable isolatope enrichment and mass spects.
Not hobby stuff.
I've been threatening to do this with NH4 and NO3 N15 with macro algae and plants and in Fw systersm also to see who gets what.
Maybe someday.
Regards,
Tom Barr
I've had more folks have issues due to some cheapy test kit that was plain wrong.
I use lab equipment and spects, so I have accuracies without touch a color chart down to 10ppb of NO3, 100ppb of PO4 and these tend to be the extended workable ranges for labs.
I could likely knock it down to 3-5ppb but the error would float that much also.
You cannot measure PO4 to limit Cyano's, you do not have the equipment to measure the limitation...........anyway, PO4 leaks out of critters, corals etc, can measure something before you have a chance to measure it?
I can, but few of you folks are going to use stable isolatope enrichment and mass spects.
Not hobby stuff.
I've been threatening to do this with NH4 and NO3 N15 with macro algae and plants and in Fw systersm also to see who gets what.
Maybe someday.
Regards,
Tom Barr
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