Royal Gramma sick in QT, help plz

[rfdoc]

I've had a Royal Gramma and a Yellow Watchman Goby in QT for the past week. The Goby looks fine and is eating, the Gramma has been floating on his side for the entire week now. He is still breathing but I haven't seen him eat much at all. He looks fine physically I don't see any signs of disease, except that he is floating. He was even floating in the bag I received him in from shipping. What can I do to make him better? Here are the params of the QT -

Ammonia .25
Nitrite .10
Nitrate 0
pH 7.8
SG 1.010

In the QT I have an aquaclear running with a sponge and some carbon, a heater, and a maxijet for flow. The light is the standard light that came with the 29 gallon tank, which isn't on much which is probably why the pH is low. Should I move the Gramma to the main tank where the conditions are better?

 

[kevin2000]

My 02

Ammonia is highly toxic and your goal when running a QT is too keep that level at zero .. even if that takes frequent large water changes. Don't waste time monitoring PH (will go up and down on its own) and forget nitrite and nitrate because they just don't count in a QT envirornment.

A large water change is in order.

Any reason why your SG is 1.010? Isn't going to hurt the fish but if your trying to run a hypo tank then your goal s/b closer to 1.009

Under no circumstances should you move the gamma to your show tank until he is healthy and completed quarantine.

 

[rfdoc]

Thanks for the reply. The SG has been hovering around 1.010~1.009. Does having it .001 higher make that much of a difference? I'm using a refractometer to measure. I've been changing the water, about 25% every couple of days. In one week I've changed it 3 times already trying to get the ammonia down to 0, doesn't seem to be doing anything though. It could be the test kit too I suppose and inaccurate readings.

 

[kevin2000]

As far as water changes ... you need to make whatever water changes are necessary to keep ammonia at zero ... if that means 50% or more every day .. so be it. Forget all the water change rhetoric that you read about in show tank discussion boards ... in a QT it just doesn't count.

You might consider using an ammonia detox agent .. most convert ammonia into less toxic ammonium. Unfortunately many ammonia test kits can't distinguish between ammonia and ammonium so purchase of an inexpensive Seachem ammonia alert badge (which only registers ammonia) may be a good investment.

One of the best methods for maintaining water quality in a QT is to keep it clean. Run a bare bottom QT and use a turkey baster to remove any uneatened food/fish debris several times a day. Additionally ... not sure of your ST setup but if you have any mature filter media in that setup you can transfer some of that to your QT filter .. will help mitigate ammonia issues.

You are correct on the SG issue .. my mistake. If you have a refractometer you should shoot for a salinity between 12-14%.

Hope this helps

 

[rfdoc]

I used water from the main tank to setup the QT initially but that was all I could do, didn't have anyting else I could transfer over. So you think the ammonia is what is causing the gramma to float? I'm just worried because the Goby seems fine.

 

[kevin2000]

Whats wrong with the Gamma is not certain ... but an ammonia level of .25 is way too high and ammonia will burn the gills of the fish making breathing difficult. Fish with breathing difficulties will hang at the top of the tank.

You mentioned that the fish was "floating" in the bag when you received it ... thats a real bad sign and if you purchased from a vendor who "warrants" the product I would try for a replacement.

Its always a good idea to make up a large batch of replacement water when you run a QT ... comes in handy when you run into water quality issues.

If your in a tank stocking mode you should purchase some of those inexpensive filter sponges (foam blocks about 4 inches long 2 inches wide 1 inch thick) and tuck some in your sump or behind some live rock in your ST .. those sponges will accumulate beneficial bacteria within a few weeks and if you place those sponges in your QT filter you have "instant cycled QT". Makes running a Qt alot easier.

Hope this helps.

 

[rfdoc]

Yeah I ordered both of them from thatfishplace.com and the gramma was definitely floating on his side when I opened the box. I don't have a sump that's a different issue, I took some water from the main tank and put it in the QT and let the aquaclear filter run for about 9 days before I put the new fish in. I'm going to do a large water change today and tomorrow to see if that knocks the ammonia down. Thanks for all the advice.

 

[kevin2000]

Your welcome.

In the future you should note that beneficial bacteria (ammonia converting bacteria) really don't reside in the water column .. as such use of ST water in the QT will not have any impact on ammonia.

Good luck.

 

[Aquarist007]

Some other questions come to mind:
How did you introduce the fish from bag to tank
How long was the fish in the bag
Was the fish ok in the dealers tank---was it stressed out by sloppy netting or capturing.
What else is in the quarantine tank---aged sand or live rock?

----sorry for all the questions but they help to zoom in on the problem
-----and I would get rid of the sponge in the filter

 

[rfdoc]

I acclimated both of them to the QT over a period of approximately an hour and a half. Not sure what condition the fish was when he left the store since it was an online order, and it was overnight shipping. There is nothing in the tank except the heater, aquaclear, and maxijet, and a couple of pieces of PVC, and the goby and gramma. I'm trying to take a picture, can't get my camera to work at the moment.

 

[Aquarist007]

Definetly sounds like the stress occured in the shipping--probably was in the bag too long and ammonia built up.
If you are doing the water changes as suggested above that's about all you can do right now and hope for the best.