Salt for zoanthid tanks

uscgbeachbum

uscgbeachbum

New member
I've had very very slow growth of my zoanthids since I started the tank a year ago. I have a total of 15 frags of varying sizes (2-15 polyps) and I've had a growth of maybe 4 new polyps total since January 2014 :rolleyes:. I've considered my lights, flow, tank parameters, etc, but haven't really improved growth.

So I started thinking, what kind of salt does everyone use? I currently use Red Sea Coral Pro (Ca~440ppm, Alk~11 dkh, Mg~1400ppm) and have begun to wonder if my alk is too high. If so, what kind of salt do people use with lower alk? FWIW, my tank goal is primarily zoanthid tank with a handful of LPS, shrooms, and ricordia.
 
It is not likely the salt. However, I use instant ocean.

Post up your N and P levels. If those are fine, then it could be your lights.
 
It is said that Zoanthids like High Alkalinity so I think you are good there.

What Lights and Power Heads do you use?

Zoanthids like a Dirty Tank.

Since I started using Reef Roids and Reef Chili Twice a Week I have noticed a lot of extra growth in my Zoanthids.
 
I've always had 0 ppm NO3 and PO4 (tested both with Salifert and PO4 tested with Hanna ultra low range). The only exception to that was a couple weeks ago when I "finally" got up to 1ppm NO3. It wasn't necessarily a goal, but it let me know that my NO3 test kit wasn't bad.
 
For lights I'm running 2xKessil 360WE's. My main photoperiod is 12 hrs long: ramping from 0% to 40% over hour 1, then 5 hours ramping up to 60%, then 5 hours ramping back down to 40%, then down to 0% over 1 hour. I originally thought it was my lighting and started to increase the intensity at about 5%/week. The highest I got was 75% and i noticed the zoos near the top of my tank were very stressed. They would open up, but I found them literally moving off their frag plugs trying to get away from the light. So I've since backed down to 60% and have been here for about 2 months.

My main pump is about 200 gph and I had 2xJebao WP25s on else mode since I installed the tank. Last weekend I went out and got a Maxspect Gyre 150 and have it cranked up as much as it'll go without blowing sand around (about 30% on a 1 sec on/off pulse). Flow is now SIGNIFICANTLY more.
 
Thanks, tFG. Admittedly, I'd been feeding occasionally (read: sometimes twice a week, sometimes not once in a month) with Reef Chili and Cyclopeeze. I'll start following a more consistent feeding schedule.
 
Mine grow like crazy in SPS type water with N at .02 and P at .005. I don't know where the rumor got started that anything other than perhaps dendro and other filter feeders like dirty water. Most of the places that these grow in the wild are not dirty. NSW parameters are still best for zoas, IMO.

IMO, it is too much of the wrong kind of light, not just too much. They grow like crazy under a large amount of metal halide with PAR well over 500 (some of them) and nothing comes close to the sun. If it is not too much against your plan or beliefs, see if you can find a cheap 2 bulb T5 to run for a month, or so. (to be far, I am no fan of Kessils at ALL, so take my sentences with that in mind, but also consider that there is no way that they are providing "too much" of a good kind of light)
 
reefwars said:
this couldnt be further from the truth:)
Click to expand...

Why do you say that?

I have heard that saying a million times over (And I have never heard once someone say otherwise until now).

And I myself have proven it true since dosing Coral Food and witnessing first hand increased growth rates in my Zoanthids due to dirtier water.
 
that Fish Guy said:
Why do you say that?

I have heard that saying a million times over (And I have never heard once someone say otherwise until now).

And I myself have proven it true since dosing Coral Food and witnessing first hand increased growth rates in my Zoanthids due to dirtier water.
Click to expand...

Explain to me in detail how this animal would benefit from dirty water or .....nitrates high , phosphates high in comparison to what we shoot for our closed Systems that contain just about every other corals including nps ones???

food itself when added is not soluable so what in the water it's self classifys dirty...n and p alone???? lol my friend you can have a tank with little to no n and p and still feed corals to provide them with thier needs , so yes that sentence in the way you put it about dirty water is false and has no merit , feeding the way i look at it does not mean dirty water , sps guys need to feed their fish do they not so is they're water dirty?

I have about 200 types of zoanthids and about a couple thousand pieces in zoanthid only coral beds and have collected for 6yrs while doing zoanthids closer to 10 , I've tried all types of water conditions and all types of feedings, when you try new things you tell yourself wow that worked lol truth is its stability, lighting, flow and nutrients available that promote growth. Mature systems tend to have this down pat and use up all the trial and error in the beginning.

What would be the benefit exactly to a phosphate level of 0.12 be to zoanthus compared to 0.05 ......this is what I would like to know?


Feeding is benficial and all corals require n and p , this isn't new news and we know it's fact as all living things need these as well so yes there needs to be some present but step out of the test kit vial and look at the bigger picture Presence of nitrogen and phosphorous isn't hard to come by these can be manipulated or added to your liking , to become limiting on po4 is harder than you think in a system that is closed and does not get removed unless exported , no?

On my Hanna and salifert I've for years kept po4 under 0.05ppm and for the last year or so around 0.02ppm as I've yet to see any benefit to higher, nitrates have always read zero in a heavily carbon dosed system.

If anything when I slack it's apparent in the system and growth , colors and overall health of the system isn't quite to par.

So no I don't see how zoanthids would benefit from dirty water , the better saying would be zoanthids wouldn't benefit from a nutrient deprived system ;)

Cheers
 
Last edited:
If I told you that you could swim perfectly fine in ten feet of water ......would you swim better in twenty or thirty?


No and you probably wouldn't swim well in two



Having excess n and p doesn't mean animals will use it any faster , having not enough will surely result in poor health ;)
 
I cannot think of a single softy that would do better in other than NSW parameters. The "softies like dirty water" thing comes from way back in the 80s when lots of what was imported was dendro, and similar filter feeders, that really did need dirty waters... but we are not talking about these.

I have never met a single coral that did not do better under NSW tank parameters with high quality, high intensity lighting. Dirty water - not true. Too much light - not true (maybe too much of the wrong spectrum).

I have about 1000 rastas now to the point that I am starting to kill them since they are getting invasive. They started about 18 months ago with 2 polyps. N is .02 and P is .005 and they are under 250K phoenix anywhere from 500 to about 180 PAR.
 
reefwars said:
Explain to me in detail how this animal would benefit from dirty water or .....nitrates high , phosphates high in comparison to what we shoot for our closed Systems that contain just about every other corals including nps ones???

food itself when added is not soluable so what in the water it's self classifys dirty...n and p alone???? lol my friend you can have a tank with little to no n and p and still feed corals to provide them with thier needs , so yes that sentence in the way you put it about dirty water is false and has no merit , feeding the way i look at it does not mean dirty water , sps guys need to feed their fish do they not so is they're water dirty?

I have about 200 types of zoanthids and about a couple thousand pieces in zoanthid only coral beds and have collected for 6yrs while doing zoanthids closer to 10 , I've tried all types of water conditions and all types of feedings, when you try new things you tell yourself wow that worked lol truth is its stability, lighting, flow and nutrients available that promote growth. Mature systems tend to have this down pat and use up all the trial and error in the beginning.

What would be the benefit exactly to a phosphate level of 0.12 be to zoanthus compared to 0.05 ......this is what I would like to know?


Feeding is benficial and all corals require n and p , this isn't new news and we know it's fact as all living things need these as well so yes there needs to be some present but step out of the test kit vial and look at the bigger picture Presence of nitrogen and phosphorous isn't hard to come by these can be manipulated or added to your liking , to become limiting on po4 is harder than you think in a system that is closed and does not get removed unless exported , no?

On my Hanna and salifert I've for years kept po4 under 0.05ppm and for the last year or so around 0.02ppm as I've yet to see any benefit to higher, nitrates have always read zero in a heavily carbon dosed system.

If anything when I slack it's apparent in the system and growth , colors and overall health of the system isn't quite to par.

So no I don't see how zoanthids would benefit from dirty water , the better saying would be zoanthids wouldn't benefit from a nutrient deprived system ;)

Cheers
Click to expand...

Why does that term get thrown around so much then?

Why does everyone I talk to (lots of people) say the same thing about Zoanthids?

I can tell you this.

Since I started Dosing Reef Roids and Reef Chili in one of my Zoanthids Tanks Growth has taken off (I am very pleased).

I have another Zoanthid Tank that I just started Dosing.

The "Non-Dirty" one has had pretty much Zero Growth Since I have had it up (Around a Year) (I am not pleased with this Tank).

The one with elevated Nitrate and Phosphate is exploding with growth.

Can I tell you how and why this happened Scientifically? No.

All I can tell you is what I did and the Results.

And the Results Speak for Themselves.

And everyone else seems to agree with me and have had the same results.

You are the only one that has said otherwise.

Please explain that.
 
that Fish Guy said:
Why does that term get thrown around so much then?

Why does everyone I talk to (lots of people) say the same thing about Zoanthids?

I can tell you this.

Since I started Dosing Reef Roids and Reef Chili in one of my Zoanthids Tanks Growth has taken off (I am very pleased).

I have another Zoanthid Tank that I just started Dosing.

The "Non-Dirty" one has had pretty much Zero Growth Since I have had it up (Around a Year) (I am not pleased with this Tank).

The one with elevated Nitrate and Phosphate is exploding with growth.

Can I tell you how and why this happened Scientifically? No.

All I can tell you is what I did and the Results.

And the Results Speak for Themselves.

And everyone else seems to agree with me and have had the same results.

You are the only one that has said otherwise.

Please explain that.
Click to expand...

Maybe read the thread again , there's not one person saying dirty water is resulting in growth explosion , in fact the opposite that its the feedings , read the post right above yours as well read mine again but carefully , nothing wrong with feeding were talking what makes water dirty and in your thinking that it's the high nitrates and po4 levels that do this and thia is wheree your growth comes from , feeding a starved coral would be common sense no and sure to see positive results wouldn't you agree? So why can't you do this while maintaining low phosphate and nitrate levels ?

Surely systems out there exist with low ranges of these that grow zoanids well there's two stories alone in this thread that seem to have good merit to them do they not? Vs what?

I don't think anyone would agree a nutrient deprived system is healthy or that one with elevate levels is either , the proper levels for healthy aquariums has been beat to death I don't know why some people insist on finding some flaw in this lol


There's a lot of myths in this hobby , even a whole thread dedicated to them have a google you'd be surprised how many have no merit;)
 
a bunch of marine hobbyist that need to be told what "dirty water' means....and I come here for advice...........
 
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