should i test alkalinity, phospate and calcium ?

fasturtle30

New member
Hi friends im almost done with cycling (sg=1.025, ph=8.2 am=0,nitri=0.25, nitra=0) and now i just realized i didnt check for alkalinity, phospate or calclium, i plan to have FOWLR for maybe several months before i put any soft corals if/or i decide to, should i test for those right now? i have no fish or cleaning crew yet ! thanks for your comments.
 
People here tend to recommend Salifert test kits. As far as testing, you might as well test the parameters although I don't know how important phosphate is at this point, I could be mistaken.
 
I hate wait ing for cycling to be done. IF you are planing to have a reef tank you probobly need to start feeding it slowly as if you have corals so nothing dies off that has traveled with your LR. test for calcium right away if you are planing to put any corals soft or hard in the tank over the next couple of days
 
IF you have nothing in the tank don't worry about a cleaning crew there ain't nothing to clean yet let it build up a little bit at a time and start to add your clearners. Remember if there's no food for them to eat they will die so start with only a few at a time
 
thanks reeft for your comment i guess i know calcium r important for growing corals but hope someone else comment here
 
Starting a log will be good: you can actually have a few corals before fish, if you like: just pick hardy ones, because your water will be inherently unstable---all new tanks are.

Cleaning crew first, a small number of micro hermits, scarlet hermits, and snails.

Don't mix stonies and softies, imho, because of chemical issues. You can build up your fish and corals together with no special problems---actually some advantage, because there's a great temptation to start adding fish without any sense of balances of chemistry.

As said, start with a cleaning crew of inverts. When they've taken care of the algae and your chemistry is stable, I'd advise a couple of hardy soft corals, a small fish [quarantine the fish first. The coral, which doesn't need quarantine, can just transfer in your bare hand, and it will entertain you until the fish is through quarantine and ready to venture into the tank.

That way you will never have ich or the other problems common to new tanks.]

And you can be testing and logging and learning how the balance between fishes and corals works...gently, slowly, and in moderation, increasing your population and testing as you go: a log book with a clear record of trends is your best friend and will keep you ahead of disaster. Your calcium has been dead stable for 3 weeks and suddenly drops? Your corals have started 'eating.' You'll need to supplement as directed on the supplement bottle. WIth a log book, you'll see this coming gradually, not find out about it when your corals fold up and turn purple.

Keep carbon, salt, and ro/di water at hand. Carbon can magically reduce ammonia and remove nasty chemicals if you have a problem. The first move in any 'bad water' situation is run carbon and do a 10% water change. And 'bad water' situations usually arise on your fish store's 'closed' days. Murphy's Law applies.

Run your tests every few days and log the result: top off faithfully and I would recommend an autotopoff to keep salinity stable. Phosphate won't be an early problem, but start testing at about 6 months.

Do a 10% salt water change at the end of your cycle, as you add your inverts, and every week from now on. Do not forget to acclimate your inverts: they need it even more than fish do, and many people assume they don't.
HTH.
 
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thats a good tip cracker i dont have 2 much algae now is growing slow since i dont have lights off just barely but after i finish cycling im gonna have to look and decide how many i need, but then again do i have to check alkalinity, phospate and calcium before i put fish in my tank ? like i said plan to be FOWLR for maybe 6 months at least ! thanks
 
hey sk8r i read carefully and thanks for your comments i guess i could do what you said since i see those steps plan in advance a tank with fish, coral and control of parameters :)
 
I think you'll be happy with it, if you just test methodically: it's how I started my sps/lps tank, few corals, few fish, lot of tests, everything in balance. Don't be worried about corals: they're tougher than fish and they DON"T wander into powerheads. ;) You won't need to supplement calcium at first, until your corals start growing. Calcium is a part of your reef salt; but when the corals take off, their demand exceeds what the salt provides.

You need 2 basic tests specifically to keep corals: dkh alkalinity, and calcium. WIth a 55g, you can hand-add your supplements, when needed. I recommend Kent dkh Buffer and Kent Turbo Calcium. Do not add any supplement until you've tested your water for the presence of that element and know whether it's needed: a buildup of calcium and buffer is as dangerous as a shortage of it. Never add anything you can't test for...or have a really good reason why you must. That maxim will keep you out of all sorts of trouble. If you always add your fish and corals in balance with each other, you'll have a balanced tank when you get it up and going---all chosen for compatibility, and nothing in excess of what the tank will support. HTH.
 
mhh very interesting im copying your comments on my word and saving for future reference and guide thanks ! so talking about compatibility wich softies would go if i plan to have a tang, a trigger and maybe some chochip starfish?
 
Here's where the planning part gets interesting. A chocolate chip starfish eats corals, I believe. Triggers can be a problem with some corals. Tangs can get along nicely---with corals and with fish that are shaped like cigars, but most grow too large for a 55g, and they need a lot of room: a kole tang would be ok in a 55. I had a purple and just had to sell him, fond as I was of him: he was there specifically to get some algae that I couldn't get at any other way. But he scared all my other fishes into hiding because he was so big...you can see my fish list: they're all little guys. He scared most of them even though he never attacked, and my little mandarin thought he was wonderful---followed him everywhere like a puppy. So you have to do some figuring. My advice would be twofold: first, visit www.liveaquaria.com and look at the side panel, where it says Compatibility: they have a really good chart that helps you figure what will go with what. Tour the 'for sale' offerings, and see what the life requirements are on the fish and corals you ultimately want. There's a lot of good info on that site.

Second, I'd go to the zoos and softies forums and look at what fish they're supporting that are getting along with such things as colt coral, sinularia, devils hand, leathers, xenia, and zoos, kenya trees and so on. That way you can figure which fish are going to eat your favorite coral---or each other. Or all your crabs and snails. You can spend your time waiting on fishy quarantine learning the finer points of these corals, and figure out what will be a good looking tank. There'll be lots of pictures.
 
Agree with Sk8r. Chocolate chip starfish are not reef-safe and triggers tend to pick at them anyways. A tang might not be a good idea or a 55g either but is safe around corals. Most triggers are not reef safe either.

I also think testing for phosphates can be a good idea especially when you have corals.
 
THanks, Jer77. I'm not that familiar with triggers. Are there any that behave well with corals, or are they like angels, hit and miss with the individual fish? I have heard the koles can get along in a smaller tank, but have never had one under those circumstances.

You can tell by my fish list, I'm mostly blennies and gobies and dartfish, the real little guys. For a sandbed critter, I favor conches, comical little guys and hardy, maybe an urchin. So it's hard for me to give specific advice on some of the larger fishes and inverts.
 
im copying all these ideas and i will be really carefull the day i will go shopping for fish or order online guys i have to make my list again my guess is id really i mean really like 2 have a trigger but not sure if any fits my needs !!!!!!???
 
fasturtle, your tank is about the same size as mine, and what you need to look at in buying a fish or invert is its adult size. One of the tangs---the vlamingi, I think---tops 18 inches when grown, and you can imagine *that* in a 55! Don't even ask how large a 'territory' they want to command!

My own rule of thumb is fish that top out at 2" to 3", so they have plenty of room to run about and establish territories and politic with each other: they each have their hole, their nook---except the silly chromis, that runs endlessly hither and yon looking for handouts---and the dartfish that sits midtank and defends his spot from all comers. The tailspot blenny is a hoot: he likes to sleep in a coral at night, but comes out to clean anything that's grungy, and isn't afraid of the dartfish[firefish] in the least. The two highfin gobies live in a hole, and only one at a time comes out; and the yellow watchman has a burrow he sits in front of like an old geezer on the front porch, all day long. A combo of swimmers and sitters is good: a few that eat algae are very good because they take away something the tank produces that you dont' want, and that means their food 'footprint' is very small on the tank. They're practically free, as far as fish load goes. The blenny is an example of that.
Urchins are fun, but you really have to secure your rock, sometimes with reef putty, because they can shove like you wouldn't believe. I think everyone should have an urchin once. ;)

Conches burrow in the sand with just their eyestalks up, and an elephant trunk that feels around looking for food. They're hardy, and good sand-cleaners. Just 1-2 tiny ones per 55g tank, or they'll starve.

Peppermint shrimp are hardy and don't bother much: they may take an experimental nip at a coral, but rarely repeat. Coral banded shrimp are pretty, but a bit of a PITA due to attacking things.

Avoid crabs: cute, but fast growers and inclined to take to a diet of fish when they grow up.

My advice would be to meander through liveaquaria's site and see what there is, then come back to RC's "reef fishes" forum and the "invertebrate" forum and ask people's experiences with it. You've got a lot of time to make good choices. My own 'first fish' [I've had many tanks, interspersed with moves across country] always tends to be a yellow watchman goby, because they're so funny, but there are a lot of good 'first fish' in the sea! There are also real neat inverts like coco worms and feather dusters that you can have if you don't have a worm-eating fish. Etc.

One nice thing about the corals, btw, is that you can trade bits of them for pieces of someone else's type, and they grow FAST, contrary to rumor. This last summer, after 6 months' growth, I was fragging off pieces to trade at the rate of 1-2 a week. Fragging softies just involves a razor blade and a bit of fishing line to tie the piece to a new rock, which it will grip in a few days. Between Cheyenne and Denver, you can likely find a lot of people to trade with.
 
thanks im taking notes and i pretty much m doing that i research for crews and their info and come back to RC since you find lots of good information as well and yeah i have some friends around who want to trade coral in the future, even here in cheyenne, so thats is gonna be cool, i mean still dont have any or stuff but like you said works pretty cool, i looked an the urchin pics and they look amazing ! only thing i was thiking is they comsume primarily algae hard and soft coral and also CORALINE, does it mean my rock colour will change or stop being purple? thanks
 
No, they never stay in one spot too long: eat and move. My fave is tripneustes gracilis, a red-striped one, but they grow like bandits: I had to trade mine in after 3 months, because he was just too big. The purples are a good first urchin. The long-spined blacks look neat, but they're bad about knocking rock over, and if you get their spines in your fingers, major festering pain. The others' spines are all equal, so you can safely pick them up and move them out of trouble.
 
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