Pufferpunk
New member
1/2 dose for the 1st 2 days, then full dose for 5 days after. IMO, a large WC would be like 50%.
Small Wierd Spots on Puffer
- Thread starter Adam S
- Start date
Stuart60611
New member
You just break up a full dose into two 1/2 doses spaced one day apart. After the second 1/2 dose, wait 4-5 days, do a large water change, and repeat. I would add that the white spots you describe concern me. There is chance that the black spoting you are seeing are nothing more than bacterial infections or exit markings from where crypt parasites fell off. As such, you may not have black ich here and instead crypt. If you have crypt and not black ich, prazipro will not help. You could also have both crypt and black ich in which case prazipro will not work for the crypt. If you have crypt and black ich, the only treatment that could work for both at the same time would be cupramine, and otherwise, you will have to treat for each separately.
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I accidently added the whole dose b4 i posted so what should i do? The fish seem to be doing fine as in all swimming around. What should i do for the next doses now that i screwed up the 1st one? So i had it all wrong. I dont dose each day i just do a full dose then wait without adding anything for 4-5 days then water change.
Stuart60611
New member
Probably not going to be a problem. You break up a full dose into two 1/2 doses only to avoid any adverse reaction from the fish. Some fish can react negative and go on a hungar strike from the medicine so you break up the dosing into smaller amounts to attempt to avoid this. I would still break up the dosing into 1/2 doses when you repeat to be safe and because you will have some residual medicine in the system from the first round of treatment.
Edit:
i just re-read your original post. The white spots you describe on the fins is classicly where dogface puffers most noticeably show signs of crypt. From what you are describing, I think it very likely you are dealing with crypt. It is possible that you are also dealing with black ich, but I doubt it. This is not real common with puffers. I think I would have treated for the crypt first because it is a much more serious parasite, especially with puffers, and odds are the black spoting is not black ich but only skin irritation from the crypt. If you see little white transparent sprinkles on his fins than you for sure are dealing with crypt.
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Stuart60611
New member
Ya, do a large water change after second treatment (4-5 days after second 1/2 dose) and run carbon. Read my post before this one again b/c I added something important.
Its hard to tell whether it is ick or sand. He rubs on the sand probably about 3-4 times a day so i cant really tell whether its ick or something else. No other fish show signs of ich so im really kinda stuck. I guess i will wait the 5 days and see what happens with him. Ive also started feeding with garlic so we will see if he can pull through whatever is happening. He hasnt lost his apetite since this has started. He has also learned his own dentistry which was interesting to watch. Hope he pulls through...i will update in 5 days i guess.
EDIT: He also has seemed to start rubbing on the sand more now that the prazi has been added.
EDIT: He also has seemed to start rubbing on the sand more now that the prazi has been added.
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Stuart60611
New member
Good plan. However, observe his fins carefully, particularly his left and right front fins. You will see (at least this how they looked on my dogface) the transparent almost raised circles on his fins, and there will be quite a few of them. If you see these grow in number daily than it is not sand but crypt. You may also see some white spoting on the very end and edges of his tail. If you see this, I would adandon the second prazipro treatment and change gears toward treating crypt.
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Stuart60611
New member
As far as a crypt treatment, that unfortunately is a difficult problem. Ideally, you will want to remove all fish, place them in another tank, treat them with cupramine or hyposalinity in this new tank (which can even be a cheap plastic tub) and leave your display tank without fish for 8-12 weeks. It is is possible to treat the display for crypt, but it is a difficult and very risky process that can end in disaster (have done it successfully in my system) and may potentially make the rock and sand unuseable for a reef tank if you treat with cupramine (fine for a fowlr and still may be fine for a reef tank). The only treatments in the display tank which are possible, although very risky and difficult to do, are cupramine, hyposalinity, or some quinine based drugs, such as chloroquine phosphate. Nothing else will work in terms of treating the display to eliminate crypt, especially the multitude of retail reef safe products that claim they eliminate crypt. None of these reefsafe products work.
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I think he actually does have ich now that you mention the fins. I really rather treat the dt. I know im going to want to do corals at some point so now im screwed. Im going to see how the prazi pans out before i get a worked up. He seems to be dealing with it pretty well if it is infact crypt and the other fish dont show signs of it. Time to watch and wait. I will update on the condition. Thanks for the help
Stuart60611
New member
Something to consider also is not treating for crypt and just keeping nutrition and water quality high. Fish are often able to reach a balance with the parasite and tolerate living with it without major symptoms (although will have some). If you adopt this approach, it is best to keep things in terms of tank conditions as constant and steady as possible. Also, whenever you add a new fish all fish will be at very serious risk because the parasite often blooms whenever new fish are added. If you feel you have to treat the display and do not want to risk your rock and sand for use with corals, you can do hyposalinity in the display and not risk the rock or sand. The problem with any treatment of the display is you will kill all the small life in the tank and have a major ammonia spike that could kill your fish and will require a lot of effort, careful monitoring, and some luck to avoid. I remember in the Fish Only section in one of your threads asking you about quarantine. Now you see how important quarantine can be. Don't feel too bad, I too had to learn the importance of quarantine the hard way, even more than once. Hopefully, you will avoid the worst here. Best of luck.
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geaux xman
New member
just 2 fish? i would consider finding a cheap 20gal long for a QT and copper treat it or both.
See i thought that i would be ok because the foxface and puffer were both at the lfs for over a month so im not really sure what happened. In any event i think ill just keep up with the feeding of garlic and everything and if the puffer stops eating then i will medicate. If i have to treat with copper...oh well my dad will just have to finally get a reef for himself because he is already asking me if i can try any corals with the puffer and the tank has only been up a couple months.
geaux xman
New member
so its been about 4days since the original post. has the puffer got any better or worse?
Pufferpunk
New member
Go with Stuart's advice, he knows more about medicating than I do.
Stuart60611
New member
I am not sure that is true based on your substantially greater experience, but I am just making a best guess like you. I have seen several people here misdiagnose black ich when in fact it was crypt and the black markings were either bacterial infections or skin irritation caused from the crypt. Without pictures, no one can make any definitive diagnosis, and we can just give a best guess. Adam's comments about the white specs on the front fins of his puffer really jumped out at me b/c that is exactly what I saw when my dogface had crypt. This combined with how rare black ich is in puffers leads me to believe that Adam is actually dealing with crypt here. But I could for sure be wrong.
Adam:
In looking over these posts, I would highly recommend that you post as clear / close-up pictures as you can of the spots both on the body, and the fins. You have three possible diagnosis (possibly more): lymphocystis (sort of a fish wart), black ick (worm), and marine ich ( crypt parasite).
It appears you may have already over dosed your fish, and for the wrong disease.
If you have a chance to post a picture, that would be most helpful. In the interim, pristine water conditions, and highly nutritious food is definitely in order.
SV
In looking over these posts, I would highly recommend that you post as clear / close-up pictures as you can of the spots both on the body, and the fins. You have three possible diagnosis (possibly more): lymphocystis (sort of a fish wart), black ick (worm), and marine ich ( crypt parasite).
It appears you may have already over dosed your fish, and for the wrong disease.
If you have a chance to post a picture, that would be most helpful. In the interim, pristine water conditions, and highly nutritious food is definitely in order.
SV
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I honestly have no chance of catching a picture of him god enough to be able to see whats going on with him. Now that stuart mentioned ich and how it appeared on his puffer im thinking that is what is going on. I have some Ap Quick Cure ich treatment left over from when i had a freshwater tank. Im unsure if i will use it though because i remember it turning some of my rock blue/green but maybe that was because there wasnt any circulation except for the hang on filter. What does everyone think about using it? It does say it is safe for marine tanks.
Here is the product...http://www.aq-products.com/APpro/quickcure.htm
Here is the product...http://www.aq-products.com/APpro/quickcure.htm
Stuart60611
New member
Do not use this in your display tank or even in quarantine. I posted above the only treatments that work to eliminate crypt. Do not waste your time on any others because they all do not work. Rather, spend your time first determining whether your puffer actually has crypt, and if so, research the available treatment options I posted above, where and how you want to treat, and whether you even want to treat.
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