So it begins

[jc8745]

Ok, so starts the next phase of my fish room.
I have my 240 gallon South American Cichlid Tank, My 55 Gallon Reef/Softie Tank and I have had a 150 gallon Fresh Water Tank .

My plan was to convert the 150 into a reef tank. The tank is a 48x24x30, tempered glass, and I planned on using a spare 55g aquarium to build the sump/refugium out of. Problem is that the 55 wasn't going to fit in the stand that I have so I was going to have to rebuild the stand.

My brother-in-law (who likes african cichlids) has a 125g (72x18x22) reef ready tank (the reef ready overflow and holes were not being used). So we traded, yeah I loose a few gallons but I don't think that is too big of a deal.

So I'm not in a big rush (ok I am really anxious, but the wallet will keep me at a slow pace on this build out) so I have several questions and want some feed back on things before I dive in.

I have a mag 12 that I hope to use for the return pump. I have a 55 gallon tank I plan for the refugium/sump. The cheap part will the glass for the baffles, and the pvc piping.

In the overflows there are 2 holes, 1 larger, and a smaller one, I haven't measured them yet. Which one should I use for the Durso style stand pipe?

In the main tank there are 3 hole in the bottom, right, center, and left. Should I use these for the returns ? Or should I just run the pvc pipe up the back and then over an into the tank ?


So here is what Garf suggest to build a bullet proof reef. I'm not sure if I can afford the brand of everything they suggest, but i agree with the items, i will just have to spread things out over 6 to 9 months if not longer. So what does everyone think about what they suggest ?

Plenum Bed
180 Pounds CaribSea Seaflor Grade Reef Sand
33 Pounds Garf Grunge
148 Pounds of Rock/Aragocrete
1 to 3 Seio 1100 Power Heads
(2) 300w heaters
ICE Cap Ballast
(4) 72" 160 Watt VHO URI 50/50
(4) 72" 160 Watt VHO URI Blue Actinic
CPR BF BakPak Skimmer for 125 Gallon

By they the final parts of the plan is after the 125 is up and running (established) i will move the live rock and softies from my 55 into the 125. Then i will start adding various hard corals to the 125. The 55 will be a Mantis Tank.

 

[jjmcat]

Next time your in my neck of the woods drop my and look and my setup.My tank is only 1 foot less then yours and I have a 55 gallon sump.I like what garf is doing for saving the reefs with aragocrete but wow.I do have some of the garf grunge in the fuge section of my sump but its nothing special and it was free.Catch me at the next meeting and I will talk with you.Eight VHOs would be alot of light but I think you could get away with some T5s or halides for less money.

 

[jokeloma]

Sounds great, But I don't have an opinion on the holes, sadly I am not reef ready I do have a plenum and it being the only bed I have ever had I think it's great for several different reasons.
The garf grunge is good but you might check into the ECO products, makers of miracle mud. Come to the meeting and I will let you borrow the new dvd showing all the products with explanations. Just let me know to bring it. You can look it up online under ecosystemaquarium.com.

Anyway that's a good skimmer but don't be afraid to upgrade to something else. Surely someone else has an opinion.

 

[jc8745]

Good stuff so far. I think i will make this month's meeting, i'm hoping too.

I am planning on some cost for lights and skimmer, i want to monster size the skimmer (overkill some), and i would like lights that will handle stoneys, and sps corals.

I'm thinking i can possibly save some money by making my own rocks, i'll have to mix live sand with dry sand, i just can see putting down 800 bucks on live sand and rocks.

I will have just have to go slow with letting it get established.

I'm not planning on the skimmer or heavy duty lights for a while, i dont think i will need them for at least 6 months.

I have (2) 2 bulb 36" t5 light fixtures, not what is needed when i start placing corals, but i am hoping they will be ok while the tank establishes.

 

[scott0615]

You can certainly save some serious cash with newer technology...for example lighting options, powerheads, skimmer, & substrate. Send me a pm or call me....maybe we can do a barter for some soccer training for the kids or an insight on the FOR program!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[TheMcs]

Garf grunge is garbage in my opinion. Saw it in a year+ old 150g, nothing but detritus and shells. May work, I don't know, but it's some fugly stuff.

 

[TheMcs]

BTW, big hole is your drain, little hole is your return. Big hole usually accepts a 1.25 or 1.5" bulkhead, the small return a .75" bulkhead.

 

[sarai826]

I use MiracleMud and have been really pleased with it. It's a little expensive, but I've had really good results and no major tank problems to date. I've never used the GARF Grunge, but the mud is definitely more attractive.

For what it's worth, I replaced my mud (for the first time) after the power outage... and after 9 days with no/minimal power, my corals were opening back up in a matter of hours. I'm sure that's not entirely attributable to the mud (I also run a skimmer, and added a poly pad and carbon for clearing out post-ice-storm muck), but I did seem to have slightly-better-than-average results as far as recovery goes. You might at least look into it...

 

[jjmcat]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=11603929#post11603929 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by TheMcs
Garf grunge is garbage in my opinion. Saw it in a year+ old 150g, nothing but detritus and shells. May work, I don't know, but it's some fugly stuff.

I got mu grunge from that 150 you and I moved.

 

[jprince58]

Be aware that the information at Garf is old (i.e. doesn't address newer technologies such as T5 lights) and is targeted for non-reef ready tanks. My preference is to eliminate the power heads and go with a closed loop system to drive your flow. Utilize the overflow to plumb in a sump/refugium and get a good in-sump skimmer. As for the "grunge," I agree with Greg...it's just sludge. You'll do just as well seeding your tank with a cup or two of sand from another established (and healthy) tank.

 

[jjmcat]

For those who have used or are currently using the grunge please speak up.Am I the only one who has this in his fuge?

 

[dustin Combs]

Jarrod,

I have used it in the past and the tank that it was in was the best tank we have ever had. Great stuff. It has been a few years ago though.

 

[jokeloma]

Big purchases and small

Big purchases and small

Just to plug our sponsors. Before making any big buys get your online price & seller and let them try to match or beat it. Local shops want that business so give them a chance. :thumbsup:

Sounds like you have it really well planned so far.

 

[jc8745]

I'm not sure I would actually use Garf Grunge, or exactly what Garf suggested, I have thoughts on what I need and how much it might cost me, but when I spend the money I don't want spend money on something that was expensive and limited, and that I could of spent the same amount and got something a little better.

My thoughts
Step 1 - PVC Plumbing, Glass for 55g Sump $75 or abouts
Step 2 - Plenum, $50 (depends on feed back)
Step 3 - 150 Pounds of Sand, crushed coral (hadn't thought about how much this was going to cost, just going to spread it out over time)
Step 4 - 150 Pounds of Rock (same as sand, make some rocks, buy some live, spread it out over time)
Step 5 - Refugium Light $75-$100
Step 6 - Protein Skimmer around $200 - $300
Step 7 - Lighting System around $300 - $400

Steps 1 - 4 might take me anywhere from 6 months to 9 months, mainly spreading cost of sand and rock out.

Any idea if the mag 12 will be strong enough ?

Alright what I think I have read so far,
I have the (55g) reef tank already and a refugium that is pretty well established, I can take some of that out, and seed the new tank, I'd replace what I took out.

Mud is being suggested for the refugium ?

I was thinking that (8) 72" vho bulbs and ballast could be expensive, I'm thinking that for that same amount or less I could possibly get some lights with newer tech and better ?

I'm not sold on the suggested skimmer, in my mind I'm thinking 250 for a really good skimmer for a tank this size, is that a decent thought, if so what would be suggested by everyone.

 

[TheMcs]

As a longtime proponent of VHO (T12) I'd avoid those. From what I hear the new manufacturers of the bulbs aren't doing a good job. If you have a canopy you can retrofit HO T5s in as the budget allows, say 2 at a time.
I'm a big believer in the AquaMedic skimmers. I've got the Shorty II on my system and love it. You might look into the T1000, which can go HOB or in fuge.

Jarrod, that's the grunge I was referring to. Not a bad idea for a fuge, but definitely not in the display as we saw it.

 

[jc8745]

No canopy, i might consider building one, but will most likely lean away from it,

My plan right now is for the skimmer to go into the fuge,

Which brings me to this, in the fuge, the stages,

Water In, Skimmer, Fuge, Return

or

Water In, Fuge, Skimmer, Return

I've seen diagrams both ways ??

I'm going to look into the AquaMedic's

 

[jprince58]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=11605226#post11605226 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by jc8745
Water In, Skimmer, Fuge, Return or Water In, Fuge, Skimmer, Return

I'm partial to Euro-Reef skimmers, but know at least two locals who are quite happy with their AquaMedic units.

I have both type of sump/fuge types you list. My latest sump is set up with the standard three chambers arranged in a "skimmer/sump -> return <- fuge" configuration. I think I like this design the best. This configuration requires a bit more plumbing, but allows you to independently control the flow through your fuge and sump areas. I've read that placing the skimmer before or even outside the flow through the fuge is a good idea and avoids skimming good stuff coming out of the fuge...I've also read that it doesn't make any difference...seems reasonable, though.

 

[TheMcs]

If you can, don't put the skimmer in the same chamber as the return. The chamber with the return is where the water level will fluctuate depending on evaporation. If the skimmer is in there, you'll have inconsistent performance. Place it in a stable area and the need to adjust and constantly fine tune will be minimal.

I've set up a few like this;
drain, skimmer, skimmer feeding fuge with a bypass around the fuge, then the drain.
You can also have the outlet of the skimmer feed into the return area with no bypass of the fuge. That way, whatever water the skimmer doesn't pick up goes through the fuge.

 

[sarai826]

I vote for:
Water In, Skimmer, Fuge, Return

I'd second the T5's... everything I've seen is that they pull better colors from the coral, and if you're going to end up wanting that eventually you may want to do it from the start (saves the additional cost of upgrading). I have VHOs, and I'm not unhappy with them, but you can definitely see the difference when you move a coral from the VHOs to a T5 tank.

And one more than I'd add... if I were setting my tank up again, I'd have put in a UV sterilizer from the start. I don't run mine consistently (or even frequently-- only when I have ich, a tank death, or something of that nature-- 3 times total so far), but the few times I've had to use it it's definitely been nice.

 

[jc8745]

Ok, slight issue to deal with, i have been working on doing a little clean up on the tank while i plan the plumbing.

I took all the plugs out, because all of them had simple bathtub plugs and lots of aquarium glue. If i am not going to use the holes i still want to bulkhead and cap them properly.

So in one of the overflows it has some sort of bulkhead on it, not sure how to get this off and replace it with the same parts as the others will have.