SPS Coral bleaching from bottom - STN ?

[Reef_Matrix29]

I'm having similar issues as well, I did recently recharge my GFO, but I didn't add any more than I normally of 1 cup of GFO for 90 gallons of tank water. So I wasn't sure if my coral peeling was due to that or trace elements/iodine overdose since I have recently increased my two part method and I put trace in the calcium and iodine in the alk. I have since stopped the two part and done a water change to monitor over the next few days. Should I stop the kalk as well? What about the GFO reactor?

 

[DeathWish302]

I'm having similar issues as well, I did recently recharge my GFO, but I didn't add any more than I normally of 1 cup of GFO for 90 gallons of tank water. So I wasn't sure if my coral peeling was due to that or trace elements/iodine overdose since I have recently increased my two part method and I put trace in the calcium and iodine in the alk. I have since stopped the two part and done a water change to monitor over the next few days. Should I stop the kalk as well? What about the GFO reactor?

What is your PO4 measuring at? The reason I ask, is after I replaced my GFO 1 week ago with some fresh recharged BRS HC GFO my most bullet-proof sps (Sanjay's Pink Mille) started RTN and completed the trend on all frags I cut on Thursday last evening. :sad2:

I can only attribute this to the GFO and the rapid drop of the PO4 this must have had. I'm understanding more with coral color, survival and explosive growth have to do with walking a PO4 tightrope.

 

[gig]

Of course stability is the key to keep SPS and I am very careful now when adding fresh GFO not to put too much, maybe half if what I require, when I overloaded it, that's when I saw bad things a happen.

 

[Reef_Matrix29]

My PO4 by Salifert test kits is undetectable at this point, just tested it Saturday. I think the GFO might have been the issue, but I started to wonder if the trace elements was the issue, just unsure. I use the BRS granular pellets for my GFO and only change out once every 4 weeks at one cup. However, lately I have had to replace it more frequently as I had my alkalinity line dripping in the sump near the pump feeding the GFO and coated the ferric oxide with white film. I have since moved it to another location and it's fine, but perhaps the constant recharging of the GFO stripped the tank, but would that cause polyp shrinking and paleness in SPS only? My LPS and clams are fine, same for my inverts, just my SPS that are stressed. I took the refugium offline this morning, should I feed the tank to help re-establish that nutrient?

 

[DeathWish302]

My PO4 by Salifert test kits is undetectable at this point, just tested it Saturday.

A little off topic, but I have seen the light and quit testing with Salifert and ELOS entirely for PO4. The new ULR Hanna meter cannot be beat if your only using it as a baseline for GFO changes. I love it and think it's the best money spent since a hydrometer I bought all those years ago.... Just letting you know so you don't go blind squinting at the color chart.

I think the GFO might have been the issue, but I started to wonder if the trace elements was the issue, just unsure. I use the BRS granular pellets for my GFO and only change out once every 4 weeks at one cup. However, lately I have had to replace it more frequently as I had my alkalinity line dripping in the sump near the pump feeding the GFO and coated the ferric oxide with white film. I have since moved it to another location and it's fine, but perhaps the constant recharging of the GFO stripped the tank, but would that cause polyp shrinking and paleness in SPS only? My LPS and clams are fine, same for my inverts, just my SPS that are stressed.

The sudden drop in available PO4 and NO3 play a crucial role in the sps food chain. These compounds support 'some' zooplankton that is produced in the tank to feed the sps, but mainly the sps has this as an accepted food source. Strip if away and now what they have become accustomed to is gone with no substitute. I've never had good success with the AA dosing or other 'additives' for coloration and have always found a few extra chunks of food is the best method for gaining this color back. Also, patience is the key when playing with GFO and sps coloration...too much GFO and you'll be ULNS with pale colors, too little and you'll never get the color to pop and have a 'brown' reef (IME).

I took the refugium offline this morning, should I feed the tank to help re-establish that nutrient?

Why? I would suggest against changing multiple facets on the system at this moment as you will not know what has/has not made a difference in your coloration. When we start playing mad scientist and not giving the system time to equalize, you will likely overshoot your target or miss completely several times. Believe me, I speak from experience that time is the only thing we do not have control of for a reef. Let it be for awhile and watch the results.

 

[Reef_Matrix29]

Makes perfect sense and after an additional water change last night, I simply turned off the GFO and will monitor over the coming weeks. I pruned away the branches of SPS that had already peeled white and prayerfully they will stop soon or I will be removing stumps. Also, I didn't take the fuge off just because, the cheap pump was clogged and apparently had been offline for at least a week, so while I wait for a replacement pump to come, I removed it from the back of the tank. I believe I will try to put the fuge in my sump, just need to make some room.

I will continue the normal feeding and additions routines in the mean time and update my journal as things change. This process has definitely taught me that recharging reactors takes a toll on water quality, even if the change is perceived as good, it might have strong effects. I am purchasing the Hanna checkers for Phosphate and Alkalinity this week and retiring the Salifert kits for those two areas. Do you find that they give accurate readings to what you once tested with?

 

[DeathWish302]

Do you find that they give accurate readings to what you once tested with?

I feel that accuracy, precision and an acceptable 'range' are three areas that have been scrutinized about these checkers.

Accuracy - IME, I have checked multiple samples several minutes to an hour apart of the same water sample with no detectable variance. I have measured tank water in this manner and also a sample of tank water that was 'juiced' with some Miracle Grow. Unfortunately, I cannot state if any additional reactions that may have occurred with additional substances in the Miracle Grow that would offset the measurement when using the Hanna powder and the ascorbic acid method. I would assume accuracy is within an acceptable range for a hobbyist.

Precision - I have no way to measure the exact PO4 concentration, nor do I care to. If I can obtain a value between 3 and 9 on the checker, I can accept that the measurement may be off. The checker may have a shift of 9 points for as much as I know. Until I would check against a known concentration of PO4 that the ascorbic acid method can measure, I know little of the precision of this unit.

This brings about the third area that truly has driven me to use the Hanna checker. Before the checker, I would shoot at th hip when it was time to change the GFO. After measuring my tank when GFO was taken offline (due to lack of time to recharge some before biz travel) and my two clown pairs were fed 2 times daily about 0.5gm per clown, I found my level was at 0.075ppm. I measured with the ELOS kit and since it measure not low enough, I assumed my level was 'good'. The Hanna checker came in about two weeks ago and I about dropped when I measured 0.075ppm. My GFO had been offline for about three weeks and in that time the dry food for the 2 week auto-feed had raised PO4 substantially. If I had measured with the ELOS, I would have said everything was good and moved on.... Big mistake! At elast now, I have a bit more flexibility in knowing a more 'precise' (loosely using the word mind you) method to obtain the level the GFO is currently at.

I use to measure GFO usage mainly by shooting at the hip and watching a patch of HA in my overflow that would diminish after changing the GFO and woudl slowly grow back. It was a good canary in the coal mine indicator, but was not flawless. That same patch of HA has died off completely in the past two weeks. Was this due to the Hanna meter, probably not. But it sure beats having to count on that single variable that I used before to measure GFO exhaustion.

To answer your question... they kick the snot out of any colorimeter kit on the market that I have tried. I didn't try D-D or Hanna, but if your going to spend $80+ on a colorimeter kit you might as well get a $200 meter. The these little beauties came along. I was skeptical, but I now feel this is a valuable tool....the best tool for a SPS junky.

 

[Reef_Matrix29]

Alright, all of that was very good information and has me preparing to buy the Hanna checkers for Alk and PO4 this weekend. I'm almost finished with my current stock of Salifert kits, so the timing is well. So my question at this point regarding the water being stripped of nutrients that could be the reason for my STNing, are water changes alone enough to re-establish healthy levels for the tank? My total tank volume is about 90 gallons and after tonight I will have done a 33% water change since Sunday and took the GFO and Carbon offline while corals attempt to recover. Anything else that I could or should do? Should the lights be left off during the recovery process or would that matter too much in your experience? Thanks.

 

[DeathWish302]

So my question at this point regarding the water being stripped of nutrients that could be the reason for my STNing, are water changes alone enough to re-establish healthy levels for the tank?

When you ask about 'nutrients', I'm expecting your talking about trace elements? If so, many reefers use small (~1%) daily or bi-daily water changes to regulate the flux of these elements. I perform 5gal changes every other day on my ~175-200gal system, so I'm performing about a 2.5% WC. If you talk to the Zeovit guys/gals, they'll tell you that you should experiment with every additive including the kitchen sink. In my past, I have added many additives. One such example was Potassium. I finally bought a test kit about 3 months ago and found my K was at 580ppm, 200ppm OVER NSW. Moral of the story is if you can't measure it with a kit, don't add it in the beginning. Once you understand the dynamics of your system, you can experiment. In that same breath, even an experienced reefer as myself overdosed a substance that I thought was a minimal addition over several years. Test and test frequently is the best advice I can give if your having problems.

If your talking about phosphate and nitrate, most salt mixes have a low level to zero amounts of these elements (as they should). This is gained by a higher feeding rate in my system.

My total tank volume is about 90 gallons and after tonight I will have done a 33% water change since Sunday and took the GFO and Carbon offline while corals attempt to recover. Anything else that I could or should do? Should the lights be left off during the recovery process or would that matter too much in your experience? Thanks.

What is your photoperiod? I have also noticed that with higher wattage lighting rigs, the prolonged exposure can fade colors. I'm talking about 100W+ per sq. ft or the 400W over my 58gal Oceanic. My photoperiod was 10 hrs awhile back and the colors started fading over many months. I have since cut it back to only 7 hrs and noticed a dramatic color difference. Besides possibly cutting your photoperiod back to 5-7hrs of halide, there isn't much you can do but ride out the storm. Corals perish in some situations regardless of the effort you put forth to save them. The brutal reality is many of the TOTM members won't tell you to your face, but they have a 5gal bucket full of skeletons from frags, mini-colonies and wild colonies for that beautiful 180gal DT. I have spoke with a few and personally know some and it happens to the best tanks too. Make it through this storm and eventually you'll see the horizon.

 

[Reef_Matrix29]

When I say "nutrients", I was simply thinking of any and all things that may have been out of balance in the tank to due to over-use of the GFO. The only additions to my tank that I dose is some trace elements and iodine in very small amounts, but now that you mention the not being able to test it part, makes more sense. I will focus on keeping the tank fed well as I have recently started using more higher quality fish and coral foods with more protein content than before. I'm documenting all of the changes that I'm seeing throughout this storm and it is definitely a learning experience. Thanks so much for your advice.

 

[DeathWish302]

When I say "nutrients", I was simply thinking of any and all things that may have been out of balance in the tank to due to over-use of the GFO.

When using GFO, the only thing that 'could' be affected is alkalinity and Ca (due to clumping and coating the granules). You would have to use an absurd amount of GFO to have that happen. GFO should not negatively impact any nutrients except PO4 that routine WC's would not fix.

 

[Dog boy Dave]

Over the years I have seen many corals loose tissue slowly from the base up. This is a natural almost universal coral reaction to chronic stress. By loosing tissue in the base area out towards the tips the coral is effectively fragging itself and separating the individual tips into individual colonies. I have seen this happen to coral exposed to AEFW and several different long term water quality issues. Often, if the sourse of the stress is eliminated some of the tips will survive. My point here is that the symptoms all of the different people on this thread are seeing in their tanks could be due to different kinds of stress but they are all due to a long term "chronic" stress. Eliminate the sourse of the stress and the corals remaining will likely recover. Unless you are finding parasites on your corals, removing or fraging corals showing damage is likely to prove ineffective. While i cant speak to the "low nutrient" school, which have thier own unique chemical demands, in a conventional active high energy reef tank these kind of coral losses are usually due to high phosphates or defective, worn components or exhausted resins and carbon in your water treatment system. To address the phosphate issue I have seen people jump start a high energy system that has begun to languish as some of these seem to be doing by increasing flow and or adding the comercial bacteria cultures available at your lfs. In a conventional high energy system the only additives needed are alk and ca. Trace eliments are supplied by water changes and food added to the tank. Once again, i cant speak to the low nutrient systems but I would be surprised if these incedents of slow tissue loss are all caused by the same kind of stress.

 

[Oldtimer]

I’m also in the same camp as others here. Large SPS system which has been up and running for about 1.5 years.

A brief overview of my system is as follows:

240 gal Display
450 gal Total System
Established 3/27/2010
Clean-up crew added 4/21/2010
First Fish added 7/25/2010
First Coral added 8/10/2010

All water comes from a BRS 6 Stage Chloramines RO/DI system with TDS always reading zero after the second DI canister.

Salt has primarily been Red Sea Coral Pro mixed approx 50/50 with Tropic Marin Pro Reef. 10-15% water changes every month.

Filtration:
* Bubble King 300 Deluxe External gravity fed directly by display tank overflow
* Carbon in fluidized reactor - changed monthly
* Filter socks in sump - cleaned weekly with vinegar/water in washing machine and finally rinsed in RO/DI water. Socks Replaced Monthly.
* Filter sponge as pre-filter to sump return pump inlet - cleaned weekly with vinegar/water and finally rinsed in RO/DI water
* 150 lbs+ Live Rock between Display and Frag Tank
* 100 lbs+ Live Sand (SSB in Display plus DSB in Fuge)
* 40 gal Refugium with Chaeto which grows very slowly if at all

Circulation:
* Vortech MPW40 x 2
* Tunze 6105 x 1
* Tunze Wavebox x 1
* Dart Gold (Sump return and feed to frag tank & fuge)

Lighting:
* 2x 250W Reeflux 12K + 1x 400w Radium MH's - 8hr photoperiod
* 2x 80W T5's (Dimmable for sunrise/sunset) - 11 hr photoperiod
* T5's on fuge and frag tank

Heating/Cooling:
* 400W heater in sump and fan over tank controlled via Profilux.
* All tanks are housed in a dedicated fish room (In wall display).
* Fish room has it's own ventilation and A/C system.
* Tank Temperature maintained between 25.9 C (78.6 F) and 26.4 C (79.5 F) during day.
* Tank Temperature maintained between 25.4 C(77.7 F) and 25.9 C (78.6 F) during night.

Control/Supplementation:
* Profilux II Plus EX system with ORP, pH, Temp, Salinity Control
* Profilux 4 channel dosing unit for top off (trigged by Conductivity probe) and Balling Salts (Alk, Ca and Mg)

Over the past few weeks, I’ve been seeing STN on a few of my acros. Many of my acros are doing fine with no signs of STN or discoloration. Among these are my milli’s, valida’s, torts, red planet, shades of fall, strawberry fields and stags. I’ve already lost a mini Echinata colony, a colorful Aussie sp, and a teal acro. Joe the Coral purple tips are turning white although polyp extension is good. My beloved crayola plana and chips are showing nearly zero polyp extension. This is very abnormal for them. My Miami Orchid is pale white and losing tissue at the base and the tissue along the branches is thinning… same case with a Youngi. All monti’s, seriatopora, pocillopora and stylophora are doing great. I also have a few small to medium (3-5”) colonies of Acan’s, some zoos, a few chalices, a scoly, a 6” colony of ricordea and a small hammer frag. Acro’s dominate the system.

I have been through my battles with red bugs and AEFW and there are no signs of either on these. I treated the entire system with Interceptor several months ago and the red bugs have not returned. I baste all acro’s weekly to check for AEFW and I also dip some occasionally in revive. There are no signs of the buggers.

I’m suspecting a possible low nutrient issue based on what I’ve read and my system’s specs. There is a small harem of Anthias (7 female + 1 male), 3 green chromis, yellow coris wrasse, chalk basslet, sailfin tang and mandarin. I feed them one cube of mysis or spirulina brine shrimp combined with a small (half as big as a cube) piece of Rod’s reef food once per day. I also give them a 1.5” square of nori once per day. I add a couple drops of Lugol’s once per day. Aside from that, I don’t regularly supplement other than the BRS 2 part solution which is automiatically dosed even throughout the day via a Profiulx dosing unit. Latest parameters are as follows:

pH – 8-8.2
Alk – 10.2 dkh (Salifert)
Ca – 410 to 420 (Salifert)
Mg – 1300+ (Salifert)
P04 – 0.03 ppm (Hanna ULR)
N03 and NH3 – Undetectable (Salifert)
Spec gravity – 1.022 (Lab grade hydrometer), Salinity is regulated via conductivity probe hooked up to Profilux controller and kept within +/- 0.2 ms using one dosing channel as RO/DI top off
Redox – I’ve debated this one before, but my redox runs really high and I’ve cal’d the probe many times. It’s consistently 450+mv. I just use it as a gauge for significant changes in the system

I was running a couple cups of BRS GFO in a fluidized reactor and changing it every 4 weeks until a couple weeks ago when I saw that my P04 was down to 0.0015. I find the media to be a real pain as it turns into a solid mass in the reactor and impedes water flow. I also run BRS GAC and change it every 4 weeks. I last changed it 2 weeks ago. I have 2 filter socks in the sumps which I clean every week in vinegar and change every 4 weeks. I do a 10-15% water change once a month using a mix of Red Seal Coral Pro and Tropic Marin Pro.

There have been no significant changes in my system in the last several weeks. The MH and T5 bulbs are a few months old. Over the last several months, I have been fighting a nasty red hair like cyano. After tirelessly basting all the rocks and substrate weekly, I finally purchased some Coral Snow, Zeobak and Zeozym per the recommendation of others and dosed them per the prescribed amount for 2 weeks. I just finished that 2 weeks ago. Perhaps these helped further strip nutrients from the water??

About a week ago, I started adding small amounts of ELOS amino acids and Brightwell Zooplanktos-L every couple days or so. I am just suspecting possible starved corals and trying to get some more nutrients in the water. I did notice some improved polyp extension on my red planet and Joe the Coral, but no change in the Chips or Crayola Plana which are normally about as hairy as a milli.

Any insight would be appreciated. Thanks!

 

[rigleautomotive]

I’m also in the same camp as others here. Large SPS system which has been up and running for about 1.5 years.

A brief overview of my system is as follows:

240 gal Display
450 gal Total System
Established 3/27/2010
Clean-up crew added 4/21/2010
First Fish added 7/25/2010
First Coral added 8/10/2010

All water comes from a BRS 6 Stage Chloramines RO/DI system with TDS always reading zero after the second DI canister.

Salt has primarily been Red Sea Coral Pro mixed approx 50/50 with Tropic Marin Pro Reef. 10-15% water changes every month.

Filtration:
* Bubble King 300 Deluxe External gravity fed directly by display tank overflow
* Carbon in fluidized reactor - changed monthly
* Filter socks in sump - cleaned weekly with vinegar/water in washing machine and finally rinsed in RO/DI water. Socks Replaced Monthly.
* Filter sponge as pre-filter to sump return pump inlet - cleaned weekly with vinegar/water and finally rinsed in RO/DI water
* 150 lbs+ Live Rock between Display and Frag Tank
* 100 lbs+ Live Sand (SSB in Display plus DSB in Fuge)
* 40 gal Refugium with Chaeto which grows very slowly if at all

Circulation:
* Vortech MPW40 x 2
* Tunze 6105 x 1
* Tunze Wavebox x 1
* Dart Gold (Sump return and feed to frag tank & fuge)

Lighting:
* 2x 250W Reeflux 12K + 1x 400w Radium MH's - 8hr photoperiod
* 2x 80W T5's (Dimmable for sunrise/sunset) - 11 hr photoperiod
* T5's on fuge and frag tank

Heating/Cooling:
* 400W heater in sump and fan over tank controlled via Profilux.
* All tanks are housed in a dedicated fish room (In wall display).
* Fish room has it's own ventilation and A/C system.
* Tank Temperature maintained between 25.9 C (78.6 F) and 26.4 C (79.5 F) during day.
* Tank Temperature maintained between 25.4 C(77.7 F) and 25.9 C (78.6 F) during night.

Control/Supplementation:
* Profilux II Plus EX system with ORP, pH, Temp, Salinity Control
* Profilux 4 channel dosing unit for top off (trigged by Conductivity probe) and Balling Salts (Alk, Ca and Mg)

Over the past few weeks, I’ve been seeing STN on a few of my acros. Many of my acros are doing fine with no signs of STN or discoloration. Among these are my milli’s, valida’s, torts, red planet, shades of fall, strawberry fields and stags. I’ve already lost a mini Echinata colony, a colorful Aussie sp, and a teal acro. Joe the Coral purple tips are turning white although polyp extension is good. My beloved crayola plana and chips are showing nearly zero polyp extension. This is very abnormal for them. My Miami Orchid is pale white and losing tissue at the base and the tissue along the branches is thinning… same case with a Youngi. All monti’s, seriatopora, pocillopora and stylophora are doing great. I also have a few small to medium (3-5”) colonies of Acan’s, some zoos, a few chalices, a scoly, a 6” colony of ricordea and a small hammer frag. Acro’s dominate the system.

I have been through my battles with red bugs and AEFW and there are no signs of either on these. I treated the entire system with Interceptor several months ago and the red bugs have not returned. I baste all acro’s weekly to check for AEFW and I also dip some occasionally in revive. There are no signs of the buggers.

I’m suspecting a possible low nutrient issue based on what I’ve read and my system’s specs. There is a small harem of Anthias (7 female + 1 male), 3 green chromis, yellow coris wrasse, chalk basslet, sailfin tang and mandarin. I feed them one cube of mysis or spirulina brine shrimp combined with a small (half as big as a cube) piece of Rod’s reef food once per day. I also give them a 1.5” square of nori once per day. I add a couple drops of Lugol’s once per day. Aside from that, I don’t regularly supplement other than the BRS 2 part solution which is automiatically dosed even throughout the day via a Profiulx dosing unit. Latest parameters are as follows:

pH – 8-8.2
Alk – 10.2 dkh (Salifert)
Ca – 410 to 420 (Salifert)
Mg – 1300+ (Salifert)
P04 – 0.03 ppm (Hanna ULR)
N03 and NH3 – Undetectable (Salifert)
Spec gravity – 1.022 (Lab grade hydrometer), Salinity is regulated via conductivity probe hooked up to Profilux controller and kept within +/- 0.2 ms using one dosing channel as RO/DI top off
Redox – I’ve debated this one before, but my redox runs really high and I’ve cal’d the probe many times. It’s consistently 450+mv. I just use it as a gauge for significant changes in the system

I was running a couple cups of BRS GFO in a fluidized reactor and changing it every 4 weeks until a couple weeks ago when I saw that my P04 was down to 0.0015. I find the media to be a real pain as it turns into a solid mass in the reactor and impedes water flow. I also run BRS GAC and change it every 4 weeks. I last changed it 2 weeks ago. I have 2 filter socks in the sumps which I clean every week in vinegar and change every 4 weeks. I do a 10-15% water change once a month using a mix of Red Seal Coral Pro and Tropic Marin Pro.

There have been no significant changes in my system in the last several weeks. The MH and T5 bulbs are a few months old. Over the last several months, I have been fighting a nasty red hair like cyano. After tirelessly basting all the rocks and substrate weekly, I finally purchased some Coral Snow, Zeobak and Zeozym per the recommendation of others and dosed them per the prescribed amount for 2 weeks. I just finished that 2 weeks ago. Perhaps these helped further strip nutrients from the water??

About a week ago, I started adding small amounts of ELOS amino acids and Brightwell Zooplanktos-L every couple days or so. I am just suspecting possible starved corals and trying to get some more nutrients in the water. I did notice some improved polyp extension on my red planet and Joe the Coral, but no change in the Chips or Crayola Plana which are normally about as hairy as a milli.

Any insight would be appreciated. Thanks!

This sounds very similar to my experiences with P and N manipulation with bacteria.I have seen large colonies of mine that have thrived for many years decline shortly after employing this type of nutrient control.First sign would be decreased polyp extension and then lightening.Shortly there after stn at the bases of colonies that only encrusted and grew previously.I saw all my milleporas go bare and loose PE along with noticeable loss in all acros.Discontinuing use of bacteria dosing and returning back to my old school methods for nutrient control would prove to reverse this after a few months.

I have witnessed this 2 times in the last 3 years and my opinion is bacteria dosing is not the best method to control nutrients for my system.Every system and reef is very different so I am sure probiotics and bacteria type systems work great for others but its not for me.


also,is there a reason you are running sg on the low side.I like it at 1.025 to 1.026 as does the majority

 

[Oldtimer]

Thanks for the feedback Dan. I appreciate it. I'm tending to think the same the more I study this. I'm going to continue slowly adding nutrients into the system while watching P04.

As for sg, I monitor and control salinity via a conductivity probe and the Profilux controller which regulates a dosing pump that tops off RO/DI. When I set it up, it was set at 53 ms which corresponds to 34 ppt or 1.026 sg at 26 C. I checked it against a calibrated refractometer a few times and they agreed fairly closely. That said, I trust my lab grade hydrometer more and it says I'm at 1.022 or 1.023 at best. I've read that some have had great success with SPS at these lower numbers and aside from this issue my system seems to operate well here. Sometimes, better to leave well enough alone. I don't think it's related to what I'm experiencing with the STN, but I'm certainly open to other insight here.

Andy

 

[ronharel]

Your SG is very low without any reason
1.022 = 30 PPT which is about 20% lower from what it should be - 35 PPT or even higher as it's presented in NSW. 35 PPT is not only salinity (nacl) but a combination of all the other salts like CA MG K S and others. by lowering your SG you're lowering those salts as well and adding those salts in order to get balance will effect the ionic balance and may cause the SPS to react.
I think you should try reaching 35 PPT in slow moves and check the change.
will be glad to have updates

 

[Reef_Noob]

Actually I'm having the EXACT same problem. I've been riddled scratching my head for the last 2 months or so. All my tests are coming out fine but my salinity was a little high (1.030). I'm slowly dropping it back to 1.025 with fresh water changes. I'm also using RODI but mine comes in around 2ppm. I thought maybe bulbs, my 250 halides are about 10 months old now just doesnt seem consistent with where the pieces are that are receeding. And my bubble king its pulling out nasty stuff as usual, running carbon and phosban and thats all been changed monthly as part of my maintenance schedule. I do about a 10 gallon water change once a week on mine. For a while there I was doing 20 gallons a week to try and re-establish my base elements again as my tank has been up for a while, it doesnt appear that helped at all cept burn through some salt.

I'm starting to loose some of my ORA's now so I'm really hoping this is something easy we're overlooking.

Hi Nick

Salinity of 1.030 is quite high and with ya trying to bring it back to 1.025 will add on to salinity, pH, Alk instability.
Do you hav high phosphates? Changing or even that matter continuously running GFO has been proven to cause STN.
If it will be me I would stop it unless u see a spike in PO4 and use 3/4 the recommended amount and once the PO4 values get down stop it's use. Since you are doing regular water changes PO4 might not be a big issue.

About the ppm of the RO water, it would be best to add an additional DI filter and get it to 0ppm believe me ur corals will love it.
And the MH halide bulbs do check their PAR readings. Some lose PAR quite fast and iv known reefers changing bulbs as often as 6 months to keep the lighting a constant. And the SPS thrive.

SPS like stability. Some SPS are very sensitive even to slightest instability and start going downhill. But some go brown and put up a lil fight and pick up back.

Just a few suggestions that came into my mind.
Hope it helps and hope all ur corals will get back in great condition. Do keep us posted. :wave:

 

[Oldtimer]

Your SG is very low without any reason
1.022 = 30 PPT which is about 20% lower from what it should be - 35 PPT or even higher as it's presented in NSW. 35 PPT is not only salinity (nacl) but a combination of all the other salts like CA MG K S and others. by lowering your SG you're lowering those salts as well and adding those salts in order to get balance will effect the ionic balance and may cause the SPS to react.
I think you should try reaching 35 PPT in slow moves and check the change.
will be glad to have updates

I'm certainly open to raising salinity. As to whether or not it will address the STN, I'm not convinced one way or the other. I have my doubts since the system has been operating like this for several months minimum... since I first introduced the hydrometer and corals have been thriving otherwise aside from some pests that I previously delt with... the good news is that salinity is easy to slowly change by adjusting the conductivity set point in small increments. I'll bring it up very slowly and report back. That said, I'm sticking with more frequent feeding and ditching the Zeo products. I saw little benefit against the cyano anyway. It was only after introducing the Zeobak, Coralsnow and Zeozym that I began seeing the STN. So, I'm tending to think they cleaned the water to such a degree that my small feedings did not provide enough food to the system. We'll see.

Just noticed tissue loss on the tips of my crayola plana which has had almost no polyp extension now for several days. I may try to frag it, but have a feeling it's on the way out at this point.

 

[CUNAReefer]

This sounds very similar to my experiences with P and N manipulation with bacteria.I have seen large colonies of mine that have thrived for many years decline shortly after employing this type of nutrient control.First sign would be decreased polyp extension and then lightening.Shortly there after stn at the bases of colonies that only encrusted and grew previously.I saw all my milleporas go bare and loose PE along with noticeable loss in all acros.Discontinuing use of bacteria dosing and returning back to my old school methods for nutrient control would prove to reverse this after a few months.

I have witnessed this 2 times in the last 3 years and my opinion is bacteria dosing is not the best method to control nutrients for my system.Every system and reef is very different so I am sure probiotics and bacteria type systems work great for others but its not for me.

also,is there a reason you are running sg on the low side.I like it at 1.025 to 1.026 as does the majority

Wow! I cant believe that this is happening so often when employing ULNS tanks. This just happened to me over the past two weeks. I started Zeovit using all the recommended dosages for starting a new tank, and started seeing STN on a couple of my acros. Today, I have taken my ZEOReactor offline and stopped using the carbon reactor. My plum crazy, hawkins, and green lantern monti have all shown STN. I dosed the following daily:

5 drops zeobak
5 drops zeofood
1 ML Zeostart (.5ml in am & pm)

I also used .35 L of carbon and 1 L of ZEOlites.

Within 10 days my plum crazy and green lantern monti started to STN. Within 14 days my hawkins has lost half its skin and others are just starting to STN. Today I performed a 20% water change and have gone back to my oldschool way of keeping corals... until stabelized. I do plan on trying zeo again after my tank has stabalized. I have ordered a new PC4 to turn the reactors on for only a couple hours a day. I will also reduce my daily dosing to twice a week. ZEOVit products are very dangerous if not used properly!

James

 

[Iskandar]

I would stop Ca and PFO reactors, switch to bionic for awhile.