Tank of the Month - August 2007

[jnarowe]

belated congrats! LOVE your coral collection, frag tank too. Sweet corals. I also enjoyed your commentary on various issues you have faced.

I am wondering why more of you Southern reef keepers don't use ground loops to cool your tanks. Seems like it would save a LOT of money and require a lot less maintainance than all the fans, chillers, etc.

Also, I have a husbandry question: Do you find with your experience, that the zoanthids and palys will grow on the tank bottom itself? I am seriously considering going BB and trying to get a multi-colored wall-to-wall carpet going. Any thoughts on this?

 

[clsanchez77]

Regarding the A/C system...

Regarding the A/C system...

Two ideas come to mind...

1. I second the A/C in the garage. No it wont be the most efficient setup as garages are not insulated well, just look at the garage door. But if you can maintain and ambiet temperature just 5-10 degrees less than outside, that will make a significant difference for your aquarium. That is it will be a lot easier to maintain 80F in the tank if the ambient temp is 90F as oppose to 100F.

2. I have seen where some people have installed tank chillers outside. You may have to replace your chiller with one that will operate outdoors our buy a small shed with ventillation to place it in. This would address with venting your garage however.

3. I know I said two but what the hell. I would highly recommend a second chiller to operate in tandem. Yes it is extra money on initial investment and yes it will double the operating cost but it should reduce the operating time by almost half. Some may argue that it will drop the temp too fast (and that could easily be resolved with an Aqua Controller programmable type controller using a Max statement) and that may be true but it will also maintaint the temp better and minimize the temp movement. When I read that your are looking at near 100% cycle on the chiller, I paniced for you because you should too. I do not believe that the aquarium chillers are intended for that sort of duty cycle and also, if that chiller fails, your tank is toasted.

Anyway, I am inspired by your tank and if I ever have to evacuate to Houston, I hope to be able to come by and see it. Any one of my ideas should be very helpful...all three of them may be expensive but will give you a much more reliable, robust and redundant system.

Just some estimated pricing...
1.5 ton split A/C unit: $2,500
Second 3/4hp chiller: $350
Extra pump: $90
Rubbermaid low profile shed: $150
Electrical work: $350
Plumbing: $150
All of this can be DIY installed

Chris Sanchez
New Orleans

 

[jnarowe]

Chris, won't placing the chiller outside in the high ambient temp. make it work much harder to get the same results?

 

[KEEPERZ]

The best part of having A/C in the fishroom when it is 117 degrees outside, is when you have to actually work on the tank-fixing leaks or scraping the tank would stink in a sweltering hot garage.Fishcraze-do you dose aminos,iodine or anything in your tank?

 

[jnarowe]

I just get into my swim trunks and pretend I am in North Carolina...Just got to be careful about standing in water and screwing with electrical.

 

[Scissorhand]

Congratulations anh Quoc.

Beautiful tank my man.

 

[fishcraze2002]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=10539448#post10539448 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Zoom
It was very small when i first got it, it was 100% wild RBTA none splitter .
Ye i lost everything when it spawn in the tank.
You can look at the pictures of the tank in my gallery when the RBTA spawn.

wow I saw it. That's crazy! never thought the RBTA could spawn like that. Did you fishes go crazy for the sperms? and did you get a bunch of little anemone as a result of that? I notice some thing spawns in my tank periodically since once in a while I saw all the fishes, especially the anthias, went crazy for something in the water. I suspected my RBTA did it since it usually happened close by to that anemone.

 

[fishcraze2002]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=10539548#post10539548 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by jnarowe
belated congrats! LOVE your coral collection, frag tank too. Sweet corals. I also enjoyed your commentary on various issues you have faced.

I am wondering why more of you Southern reef keepers don't use ground loops to cool your tanks. Seems like it would save a LOT of money and require a lot less maintainance than all the fans, chillers, etc.

Also, I have a husbandry question: Do you find with your experience, that the zoanthids and palys will grow on the tank bottom itself? I am seriously considering going BB and trying to get a multi-colored wall-to-wall carpet going. Any thoughts on this?

Glad you like the tank. I read some threads about the ground loops before but it seems to be too much work (like have to dig deep, etc..) and lots of initial costs to do that too. And not very appealing to dig a hole in a new house/garage - espically to my family members
I have lots of zoo and palys on my sandbed and they spread well on the sandbed. I also see zoos growing well on my friends bare bottom tank. One advice for you, some zoo (esp. the palys) are more aggressive and grow faster than others and could take over the weaker species. So makesure to give them some space in between or keep the slower/weaker species in one group and the others in another group.

 

[fishcraze2002]

Re: Regarding the A/C system...

Re: Regarding the A/C system...

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=10541681#post10541681 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by clsanchez77
Two ideas come to mind...

1. I second the A/C in the garage. No it wont be the most efficient setup as garages are not insulated well, just look at the garage door. But if you can maintain and ambiet temperature just 5-10 degrees less than outside, that will make a significant difference for your aquarium. That is it will be a lot easier to maintain 80F in the tank if the ambient temp is 90F as oppose to 100F.

2. I have seen where some people have installed tank chillers outside. You may have to replace your chiller with one that will operate outdoors our buy a small shed with ventillation to place it in. This would address with venting your garage however.

3. I know I said two but what the hell. I would highly recommend a second chiller to operate in tandem. Yes it is extra money on initial investment and yes it will double the operating cost but it should reduce the operating time by almost half. Some may argue that it will drop the temp too fast (and that could easily be resolved with an Aqua Controller programmable type controller using a Max statement) and that may be true but it will also maintaint the temp better and minimize the temp movement. When I read that your are looking at near 100% cycle on the chiller, I paniced for you because you should too. I do not believe that the aquarium chillers are intended for that sort of duty cycle and also, if that chiller fails, your tank is toasted.

Anyway, I am inspired by your tank and if I ever have to evacuate to Houston, I hope to be able to come by and see it. Any one of my ideas should be very helpful...all three of them may be expensive but will give you a much more reliable, robust and redundant system.

Just some estimated pricing...
1.5 ton split A/C unit: $2,500
Second 3/4hp chiller: $350
Extra pump: $90
Rubbermaid low profile shed: $150
Electrical work: $350
Plumbing: $150
All of this can be DIY installed

Chris Sanchez
New Orleans

Chris, Thanks for the helpful and detail inputs. I'm thinking hard about the AC option now after I saw that system on KEEPERZ's tank. Also like the idea about the 2nd or tandem chiller. I have a backup chiller but not hook up. Maybe I could hook it up and set it to kick on at 1 degree higher than the existing setpoint - just in case the main chiller fails. Moving the chiller outside is not easy or possible for my case since that means I have to run a very long line across my 3 car garage. The garage itself may be ~20-30 ft wide,and I would have to run it around the corners to the other side,making the total pipe length to go up to 40-50ft.. Running a pump just for that long distance would not be economical.
And yeah stop by when you are in Houston.. but I hope the reason you are in Houston not due to evacuation from a hurrican like Katrina

 

[jnarowe]

Thanks for the tips. Do you know of a good resource that would define the weaker/stronger species?

As far as the ground loop goes, It really doesn't matter how much work it takes if you can operate your system without a chiller. Seems like a lot of work but renting a mini-digger at HD wouldn't be such a big deal. I know it's work to set up, but imagine how much simpler and easier it would be to run and maintain. Nothing to break down. Just cleaning out the heat exchanger once per year would probably be it, and a heat exchanger can't be damage by electrical spikes etc.

No lecture from me of course, I just am a big fan of the idea and left room on my manifold to add a ground loop if needed. Currently I can run my system with just evap cooling, but sometime in the future that may not be the case.

 

[fishcraze2002]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=10545906#post10545906 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by KEEPERZ
The best part of having A/C in the fishroom when it is 117 degrees outside, is when you have to actually work on the tank-fixing leaks or scraping the tank would stink in a sweltering hot garage.Fishcraze-do you dose aminos,iodine or anything in your tank?

I absolutely agree w/ you about the advantage of a cool garage in the summer. I hate to walk out to my garage in the evening for just 5 mins to feed my fishes since my shirt and body will be stink as hell eventho I just stay in the garge for just 5 mins!

No I have never dosed aminos in my tank. A friend of mine tried it in the past and said he had bad results w/ it so I stayed away from that. I don't dose iodine either. As I mentioned in the article, my tank supplement comes from weekly water changes. recently i had issue w/ low Magnesium in thetank and tried to use Kent Mg to bring it up. I do dose kalkwasser to keep the pH >8.0.

 

[fishcraze2002]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=10547694#post10547694 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by jnarowe
Thanks for the tips. Do you know of a good resource that would define the weaker/stronger species?

I don't know of such source. Just learn it from experience - the hard way - some of the nicer slower growth zoos on my overflow boxes were taken over by the pink palys that are also on the boxes. I also saw my solid bright orange zoo overwhelmed by the bright green zoo on the same rocks... I guess you may have just grow them out first, and re-locate them once they start touching/ killing each other

 

[fishcraze2002]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=10546151#post10546151 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by jnarowe
I just get into my swim trunks and pretend I am in North Carolina...Just got to be careful about standing in water and screwing with electrical.

Just saw your 1000 gal tank on your webpage. Very nice. so that how you do cleaning on your tank huh - diving in your own tank It sounds very cool to me but not sure if I want to do that every week And yeah it's a scary thought about diving in an enclosed water space w/ electrical sources:eek2: At least I saw you use Vortech powerheads only - so less source for electrical failures

I wonder how those with large reef tanks (like yours and KEEPERZ's) can maintain such large system. I feel like I have too much work on my 220gal tank already and can't imagine how much time you guys spend on the tank? Also have you ever calculated the monthly costs for the tank (like electricity, additives, water changes, etc...) for such a humongous tank?

 

[fishcraze2002]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=10546962#post10546962 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Scissorhand
Congratulations anh Quoc.

Beautiful tank my man.

Thanks. I notice your location as 'pho 54'. I passed by that store when I was in OC earlier this year and wanted to try it out. How is the 'pho' there? is it as good as pho 79 (which i think verygood

 

[jnarowe]

It does take time but when you build a larger system, you build in conveniences. Like I never deal with buckets of water because I have a water change system.

Keeping the display clean is about the worst of it. I have to lay a large plank on top of the tank to get access to the viewing pane. I lay on the plank and scrape the glass clean.

As far as monthly costs, I really haven't figured it out. I am guessing with electrical, salt etc. about $200/month, plus incidentals, livestock etc. I would guess total spent per month including all aspects to be between $300 - $400. But that is just a guess.

 

[cbui2]

Jonathan please do not leave any details out ? don't forget to tell them about your snorkel gear before fallen into the ocean :lol: .

 

[Zoom]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=10547458#post10547458 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by fishcraze2002
wow I saw it. That's crazy! never thought the RBTA could spawn like that. Did you fishes go crazy for the sperms? and did you get a bunch of little anemone as a result of that? I notice some thing spawns in my tank periodically since once in a while I saw all the fishes, especially the anthias, went crazy for something in the water. I suspected my RBTA did it since it usually happened close by to that anemone.

No baby anemones at all the milk from the anemone spawming kill the skimmer. When i got home from work the whole tank was a disaster i did 400 gallons of water changes in two days but i lost all my sps anemone from Oxygen depletion most of the fish/LPS made it after that incident the tank when down hill after that , i still can't get any sps to grow/live for more than a month i thing what ever the anemone release in the tank got in the LR .
I start the tank over but so far no luck .

 

[skeeter-doc]

Quoc, do you sell frags locally? If so, can you PM me with pricing and availablility you have?

 

[fishcraze2002]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=10549252#post10549252 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Zoom
No baby anemones at all the milk from the anemone spawming kill the skimmer. When i got home from work the whole tank was a disaster i did 400 gallons of water changes in two days but i lost all my sps anemone from Oxygen depletion most of the fish/LPS made it after that incident the tank when down hill after that , i still can't get any sps to grow/live for more than a month i thing what ever the anemone release in the tank got in the LR .
I start the tank over but so far no luck .

that's scary.. I hope yours was a very rare situation and that my RBTA would never spawn ( it's growing fast lately).

 

[fishcraze2002]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=10549901#post10549901 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by skeeter-doc
Quoc, do you sell frags locally? If so, can you PM me with pricing and availablility you have?

I do sell frags locally and usu post the frags for sale in the Marshreef sale/buy forum.. I have quite a bit of frags in my frags tank right now but the more sensitive/high end frags are not doing very well in the frag tank since the temp in that tank in the past couple weeks has been ~84-86F (just found out this after I installed a temp sensor on the frag tank and recorded to my Aquacontroller unit). I was shocked to see that temp; I thought it was ~82-83F as in my main tank since it was connected to my main system. But that explained why somee of the frags looked stressed lately.