The iwan method?

David MC Lee

Well-known member
Has anyone looked into what is being called the ââ"šÂ¬Ã…"œiwan methodââ"šÂ¬Ã‚? There is a thread in the large tank forum about this guys 211g tank. Its worth taking a look at. I went through all 26 pages of it. I would like to here what some of the CIMA members think about it. I'm up for giving it a try. I have not had the color in my sps as I would like.
 
I've read it too. Nice tank but honestly I do not believe his "method" is going to make your corals look like his. I think he simply has some nice pieces (and he should send me frags!). Iwan himself has stated that the most important thing to good SPS coloration is their genetic makeup.

As far as I understand, his method is not all that unique, he just feeds his DSB bacteria (similar to the vodka method, but he uses some specialized product).

Bottom line is there have been people with increddible results no matter what method or what type of lighting is used. Funny thing is, the current US trend is the exact opposite of what Iwan does, we like to go BB and kill all bacteria using Ozone. And some of those tanks are awesome too.

I do believe that it's possible is that his usage of T5's *may* help SPS coloration a little because T5s provide a much broader light specrtum than typical MH. His T5s probably also make the colors pop more because of the same reason (spectrum). I would never give up the awesome shimmer effect and PAR of my MH though, maybe switch my VHO to T5 (?).

David I think your should definitely switch to all T5 and give me your old MH. :lol:
 
I don't care that much about shimmer. After having MH and VHO I still like the look of the VHO better. I too have been moving toward BB. I suck out sand at every water change. My old tank's sand bed seemed to work very well. I don't know if this was due to the fact it was infected with sand anemones or the ATS I used. The down side it the sand anemones kill off my snails. Now a few sand anemones made it to the new tank.
 
It's called Zeofit, it was all banned from this site and all the guys that know there stuff were banned as well.

PM Horace, he has been looking into this a lot and can point you in the right direction.
 
I would have to say hands down iwan's is the best looking sps I've seen. I would love to see some links to other tanks that look as good as his.
The best sps tank I've seen in person was oncampus1 tank. Don't know if he ever recovered from the red bugs.

For the most part on my new tank I only use the ca reactor, kalk, and biotrace. Not the same biotrace from iwans supplier. I get it from inland.

For the most part been just letting my tank sit for the last year with hopes the corals would color up as the tank ages. So far I have not seen much increase in color. This may also be due to running the MH bulb too long and they just need to be changed. I get some of the most incredible growth on my sps but just not the best color.

I could try and put some T5s over one corner of the tank and see how it does after 6 months.

I've also thought about adding some DT's.
One of my problems is keeping up on the latest info here at RC I hate these 500 post long threads. RC need a place for the latest info only.
 
I'm not to savvy with SPS but I have heard that photo period duration and bulb color spectrum have a little bit to do with coloration. The main thing with SPS is though is water quality and few fluctuations with it's quality. There are many other factors of course but just like people, every tank is different........
 
That tank that I posted pictures of in the "mixing salts" thread is a Zeovit tank that is right here in Chenoa IL. Iwan is not an all out Zeovit user but he does use several of the Zeo products. The tank that I showed you is pure zeovit and is damn nice as well.

I somewhat disagree witht he above post about genetics. There are LOTS of corals that just plain look like crap in most tanks. But when you get them in a tank with super low nutrients and proper coral nutrition and conditions they color up like you wont believe. Many people have given their browned out craptastic looking corals to Jeff and in a matter of weeks they look amazing. Most people just dont have the proper conditions for corals to reach thier fullest potential. I have to be careful about how I support Zeovit because many folks get labeled as pushing products and Zeovit seems to be one of the more sensative topics on this forum. I would advise you to go to the Zeo website to learn more about it if your interested. There is alot of folks who will help you out and give you the info you want. You can also check out the main dealer for Zeo products in the US which is www.captiveoceans.com. The system is NOT cheap to use, espeically on a tank your size David, but I have a feeling it may help you get those colors that your looking for.
 
I agree that most SPS can be turned brown if conditions are bad enough, that's not what I meant. My point was that not every SPS can become a vibrant color like the ones in Iwan's tank. Some corals just have naturally weak coloration, even in the ocean.

Also, I recall Iwan stating that he does not use any Zeovit products, though the products that he does use have similar purpose. I think what he uses is called "prodibio". Some people have already ordered it successfully off European websites in their attempts to duplicate Iwan's setup hehe. As I recall, the prices were very reasonable.

Here's a link for those who have not seen the thread: my house reef (211 g.)
 
Hello together.

Interesting conversations here. :D

First of all:
Nice tank but honestly I do not believe his "method" is going to make your corals look like his. I think he simply has some nice pieces (and he should send me frags!).

I have bought many corals as fragments from other reefkeepers. The colors were usually average. Some corals showed colored tops. This was it. I have managed to win extreme colors with the time. I have bought fewest corals "colored"! I have bought many "brown" corals and they got colored. Currently, I have got a brown coral again. I will document the color development with this coral.

What is the key for my success?
It primarily lies that I create conditions as optimal as possible for my corals.
I like to mention the current ingredients of my system:

DSC01370.JPG


- Lighting:
Pure T5!!
2x54 Watt ATI Aquablue Special
2x54 Watt ATI Blue Plus
4x80 Watt ATI Aquablue Special
4x80 Watt ATI Blue Plus
For a total of 856 Watts. The lamps are changed every 6-8 months.
T5 for stone corals?
The light conditions compared at tropical reef roofs, we can often offer our corals only compromises both in the spectral light composition and in the intensity of radiation.
It just therefore makes sense to put the radiant energy with artificial light sources available in the areas in which the photosynthesis is supported optimally.
In comparison with the exclusive illumination with HQI the lights offer the corals a more efficient possibility with T5 technology of delivering sufficiently photo synthetically utilizable radiation (PUR).
This also is due to the more unfavorable radiation orientation besides the high waste of energy (approx. 20%) of the much HQI lamps with a stronger shading of one's own.
Through this coral can as a percentage absorb less PUR radiation.
By the T5 lights my corals have got much more colored.
The growth also has increased.
For me the T5 technology is the best opportunity for the light extraction.

DSC01378.JPG




- Water Changes:
10% weekly changes with Reverse Osmosis water.

- Technical Equipment:
Skimmer: 1 Aquamedic Turbofloater
Flow pumps: Tunze Streams
Ozone: None
UV: None


- Calcium Management:
Balling method
The consumption of calcium is about 40 mg/liters daily


- Filtration:
By a specific combination of maritime micro-organisms we get a stable and largely natural ecosystem in the small format. The imitation of the ecosystem "sea" doesn't confine itself only by the keeping of corals, cancer animals, fish and other life-forms.
Biology is an important factor.
Technical aids cannot replace a stable biological climate.
I prefer to limit the amount of technical solutions and focus on biological filtration methods:

Live rock
DSB (100% Livesand)
DSB should have a height of least 10 cm and consist of living sand this. However, the most important factor is the particles size.
The ââ"šÂ¬Ã…"œnormalââ"šÂ¬Ã‚ coral break is unsuitable for a DSB. We need the finest sand.
We distinguish the water in the water layer above the sand and water layers in the sand.
By the occurrence of bacteria and by gas diffusion the water is subdivided into visible layers within the DSB. These layers are different from each other by the predominant oxygen concentration. We distinguish aerobic, anaerobic and anoxycal segments. The aerobic layer has the same oxygen concentration as the water above the sand roughly.
In the anaerobic layer, oxygen is availably but already still considerably fewer than in the layer being over it.
The anoxic layer doesn't contain relaxed oxygen.
If there wasn't a life in the sand, there would be no layer formation either.
This is caused by bacteria, micro organisms and animals which live on the surface of sediment particles.
In the different layers it comes to a breakdown of nutrients.

DSC01379.JPG




- Current Water Parameters:
Temperature: 25Ã"šÃ‚°C
Salinity: 35ppt
pH: low 7.90 high 8.1
No3: undetectable
No2: undetectable
NH4: undetectable
Po4: undetectable
Si3 : undetectable
Ca: 420mg/ml
Alk: 7-9 DKH
Mg: 1300mg/ml
Redox: 400-450

- Additions:

Daily:

Amino acids
Coral Vitalizer (Korallenzucht)

When required:

Stylo-Pocci Glow (Korallenzucht)
Potassium-Mix (Korallenzucht)
Potassium-jodine (Korallenzucht)
I use these products into dependence of the corals.
I have no dosage helps and no dosage suggestions.
The only tip:
Watch the corals, they tell you what is good for them.

Weekly:
Amino acids/vitamins ââ"šÂ¬Ã…"œReefBoosterââ"šÂ¬Ã‚ (Prodibio)

Bi-Weekly:
Bacteria ââ"šÂ¬Ã…"œBio Digestââ"šÂ¬Ã‚ (Prodibio)
Bacteria food ââ"šÂ¬Ã…"œBioptimââ"šÂ¬Ã‚(Prodibio)
Aim of all products is creating a relatively low nutrient environment in our seawater aquaria.
The bonus of selected bacteria and the feeding reduce the nutrients.
The biological functions are activated. ReefBooster serves the diet of the corals and DSB resident.
The dosage of the individual components is very simple. The ampoule tops are simply broken off, the contents thinned down into some aquarium water and admitted. Ready!
The Vodka method also increases bacteria anyway? Right!
Vodka is a carbon source for the bacteria. By the bonus of Vodka one obtains an increase of all bacteriaââ"šÂ¬Ã¢"žÂ¢s contained in the system. By the bonus of selected bacterium and carbon sources the desired bacteria remain dominant.
So the biological functions are used optimally.

DSC01373.JPG




Important:
the keys for the success aren't the products but the observation of the effect on the corals.
I only can write here how I use the components.
The daily look into the aquarium and the specific customization of the efforts bring the success.
 
Hello iwan:

Thanks for posting in the CIMA forum. I want to start a talk about your tank but didn't want it turn into another 500 post long thread. Where all of the good info gets lost. I will say it again I think you have the best looking tank I've seen. I'm not a very easy person to impress but you have done it! I would like to see my tank
<img src=http://reefcentral.com/gallery/data/500/5434SCN3745.JPG>

Look as good as yours.

I wanted to get feed back from people I know. I like to take in lots of info and then come up with own best solution.

iwan can I ask what do you do for a living? What is your background. Do you have a lot of knowledge of chemistry? I do my tank as just a hobby and my knowledge of chemistry is very poor. Iââ"šÂ¬Ã¢"žÂ¢ve learned all of it from my tank. Now if you need to know something about electronics I can help a person out their.

I'm sure many people will like to ask more questions. I encourage people on this thread to ask good question/ get answers and keep the thread short

Some of my sps coral do have very good color but I would say more than half do not. My MH bulbs are over 18 months old and I now it time to change them. I did two last week.

iwan: Do you run anything but SPS? My tank is a mix of soft/hard lps/ sps. I try to keep most of the sps at one end and the soft corals at the other end. The tank is 10 foot long. I know a lot of people may say you can't have good sps with the big leather corals I have in my tank. I wanted to try it.

How many other people do you know " have met" that use more or less your system? How long have their tanks been setup? Do you know of anyone in the US is doing "your method" as a test I would love to send them free frags from my tank to see what they would look like in a tank that is getting all of the additives you put in yours plus T5 lights.

I think this coral should have better color. It started to turn a bit brown over the last month. This pic was the best it ever looked. I got it from epon when it was about 2" in size 13 months ago.

<img src=http://reefcentral.com/gallery/data/500/5434DSCN4944.JPG>


Thanks again for posting here.
 
This is my birds nest which is about a brown as brown gets.

<img src=http://reefcentral.com/gallery/data/500/5434birdsnest.JPG>

epon can you post a pic of your birdsnest. Yours always had much better color than mine. Mine is a frag from epon.

Thanks
 
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Hi David,

excellent tank tank, very impressive.
iwan can I ask what do you do for a living? What is your background. Do you have a lot of knowledge of chemistry?

I am manager in the medical area in an international society. My basic formation is medicine, completes afterwards with economy. I have acquired my knowledge of the processes in coral-reefs from books. I am enthusiastic diver and later reefkeeper.
iwan: Do you run anything but SPS?

I keep 90% sps and 10% lps. I do not have any softcorals in my tank, except some xenias.
How many other people do you know " have met" that use more or less your system? How long have their tanks been setup? Do you know of anyone in the US is doing "your method" as a test I would love to send them free frags from my tank to see what they would look like in a tank that is getting all of the additives you put in yours plus T5 lights.
I have presented my system in this forum only few months ago. I do not know any reefkeepers which have the same system for quite a long time. But many aquanauts are interested and begin to change their system or did it already.

I have the same corals in my tank as you showed. Here are my colors:

Seriatopora hystrik in pink:

DSC01379.JPG


Montipora in pink:

Iwan056.jpg


Optimal water values and strong illumination model the colors!
 
iwan so your tanks is not a zeovit? Just uses some of the same products. What makes a zeovit tank a zeovit tank! Did you sort of come up with you own way of doing stuff? Took the best of both worlds?

iwan can you take a photo of you take each day for a week and post it to show the how the algae on the glass progresses. This always seem like a good way to test nutrient level. I too have tested my water and it always seems to have good reading. A shot from the side looking at the front glass.

iwan have you ever had the "red bugs" or acro eating flat worms in your tank? I had both a year ago and pulled almost all of my acros from the tank.
 
Iwan's tank IMO is not something most people could repeat because he doesnt have any "set way" of doing things. There are no dosing methods that somone can easily follow which makes it hard to reproduce without his personal help I think. Thats one nice thing about Zeo is there is alot of people doing it, and quite abit of docs on how you should go about doing it properly. Iwan's method definatly works, but he obviously has indepth knowledge on how each ingredient works and how much and when to add stuff. I dont think I trust myself that much to try and do his method :P

What makes the zeovit system, Zeovit, is running a zeo reactor with zeolith rocks in it for filtration and nurtrient reduction. Along with that carbon and heavy skimming are key. There are 4 basic additives called, the basic 4 (go figure :P). Those 4 additives are mainly to encourage growth of different strains of bacteria, and also a carbon source for the bacteria (similar to what some claim vodka will do). There are other additives that some people are using that do not use the basic 4 or the zeoliths. Two of the most popular products from Zeo that non-zeo users use are the Coral Vitalizer, and the AAHC (Amino Acid High Concentrate), and to a lesser extend K-Balance, which is supposed to do something with patassium but not really sure about the specifics. The CV and the AAHC have a very loyal following by some, and some very pesemistic people as well. If you search, there are quite a few threads about it that show before and after pictures.

I am actually considering splitting a bottle of CV (cost is $100) and AAHC with someone else and seeing if we both get good results. If we do I may very well start using it long term and possibly change over to use the whole system.

Hope that helps. If you want more info your best bet is to just read the FAQ about Zeovit on the Zeovit site or the main dealer which is www.captiveoceans.com.
 
Interested in a three way split? Since we both have SPS frags around the same size and the same kind. Yours are probably a bit bigger. Anyway it would be a interested test to see how similar are results are.

Are systems are the same size and have similar setups, different lights. I think it could make for a good write up to put on here.
 
The Iwan Method

The Iwan Method

Greatings Illinois from England :) I have been following the 'Iwan Method' for 10 weeks and have been asked via PM if I could do a summary of Iwan's method for this thread to supplement what Iwan has already posted here by pulling together what I have learned from Iwan's thread so far. Clearly his tank is such an inspiration.

So what follows is my understanding of his approach, a step by step run through for english speakers on how much of what is needed, reference to manufacturers recommendations and a little from my own experience.

The additives Iwan is using are in two categories:

A: Probiotic (biotechnology based on bacterial interactions with disovled componds) method - and an alternative approach to the Zeo Basic 4:

(ZB4 and Prodi differ as follows: ZB4 employs specific zeolites in a dedicated reactor that are designed to adsorb NH3 (like GAC does for DOC), are changed every 6 weeks and pumped daily. Bac cultures and bac food are added daily. Prodi is simply bac cultures and bac food dosed every 2 weeks - there is no reactor or zeolites. The content of the zeo bac cultures isnt publically disclosed, while the Prodi strains are on the manufactorers web site. Both are designed to achieve super low nutrient enviroments. ZB4 has a higher monthly running cost - as for effectiveness - each must judge for themselves from experience or from the tanks of others) - Back to Iwans method.....

1. Prodibio Bio Digest - Bacteria strains to take No3 and PO4 to undetectable levels; - Dosed every 2 weeks - 1 ampule per 1000lts;

2. Prodibio Bio TIPM (or Trace) - bacteria food. Dosed every 2 weeks - 1 ampule per 200ltrs;

3. Zeo Start 2: Carbon bacteria food: Dosed daily 1ml per 100ltrs. (One of the Zeo basic 4);

B: Coral food and trace elements:

4. Prodibio Reef Booster - Omega 3, Amino Acids, and trace elements. Dosed weekly at 1 ampule per 400ltrs;

5. Zeo Coral Vitaliser (CV)- SPS food dosed daily after lights out 1-3 drops per 100l (depending on stocking levels);

6. Zeo Amino Acid High Concentrat (AAHC): Dosed daily after lights out 1-3 drops per 1 100 ltrs - Coral growth and coloration enhancer;

7. Zeo Potassium Iodine Flouride (PIF) : Dosed twise a week anytime at 1 drop per 100ltrs;

8. Zeo K- Ballance - Potassium supplement varies depending on indicators.

Prodibio will be available shortly in the US.

Zeo products are available in the US from sponcers on the Zeo site.

When calculating how much you need of each - the following tips maybe helpfull.

1. 100lts = 26 USg
2. 3 drops from a Zeo pipette = 0.1 ml
3. Estimate net system water volume.

For example if your net water volume is 600ltrs (150 usg) the following amounts will be needed for 1 year 2 months supply based arround the 30 vials in the core product - Prodibio BioDigest:
(- Quater the amounts below if you want to trail the approach for 3 months.
- Double the amounts below if you are lucky enough to have a 1200ltr reef.
- Half the amounts below if you have a 1200ltr reefand want to trail it for 3 months.
- Etc etc)

1. BioDigests: 30 vials;
2. BioTIPM (or Bio Trace): 90 vials;
3. ZeoStart 2: 10 x 500ml bottles;

4. Prodibio Reef Booster: 60 vials (this is underdoing on a 600l - but seems OK so far on my reef);
5. Zeo CV: 100mls (Based on minimuml dosage of 1 drop per 100ltrs)(this product has a shelf life and should be kept in the fridge.);
6. Zeo AAHC: 100mls, as for CV;
7. Zeo PIF: 50 mls;

The above is what is required to follow Iwans dosage system and respectve manufactureres recommendations. In addition Iwan also uses live Phytoplancton (DT):

Iwan doses CV, AAHC, PIF, PSG etc on the basis of observing coral condition, rather than the directions in the zeo guide v1.01 mentioned above. However that guide is a good starting point for zeo noobs, and the more skilled and sensitive application of these is learned over time with experience of ones own corals.

Other points that may help:

1. Bacteria Substrate: The probiotic approachs ( Prodibio and Zeo Basic 4) results in bio films that require substrates to attach themselves to. For Zeo Basic 4 it is the Zeolith rocks and LR, - in Iwans approach it is LR and 4 inch MSB in the tank (he has no sump). In my tank it is LR and MSB in the sump (tank is BB).;

2. Ozone and UV will kill the bacteria - and are incompatible with a probiotic method;

3. Regular water changes are used to replenish trace elements;

4.1 Calcium, Alkalinity and PH: In common with all other systems - CA/DKH/MG/PH need to be maintained at NSW levels - . I have found that Prodibio is effective at 10.2 dkh for those who are concerned about PH dips. Iwan and Zeo run thier DKH at 8.

4.2 Kalkwasser is not required, with the use of aragonite MSB and a CA reactor. As the tank matures and CA demand increases, a CA reactor will have to run at full pelt, be exchanged for a larger one or as Iwan does - use the balling method to supplement the CA reactor.

4.3 Given the strong acidification that will result from hyper active bacteria, I would recommend that a DSB or MSB of aragonite is used in the tank or sump to buffer the water and maintain PH at 8.1 just before lights go on (point of highest acidification in the daily cycle. My sump MSB base area is 20% of the tank base area and seems to work fine;


5. Protein skimming is always helpfull. I have found that taking the skimmer off for 3 weeks to test the effect on phyto and zoo plancton populations did not result in a rise of NO3 or PO4. I took off a super agressive detlec skimmer, but have since put on a more plancton friendly Tunze skimmer. NO3 and PO4 remain undetectable. Skimmate is lightening gradually the longer Prodio is used;

6. Algae refugium: IME the effect on algae refugium with Prodibio is similar to the reported effect with Zeo BAsic 4. During the first 4 weeks the chateo continued to grow well, then stagnated and at week 6 begab to die due to NO3 PO4 starvation - so keep an eye out for that.

7. Activated carbon: I have found that 24/7 use of activated carbon (rowacarbon) through a Tunze quick change filter (ie powered) has not resulted in STN or RTN. This is switched of for 30 mins after any dosage). However - I may not be experiencing the full effect of the coral food and trace element suppliments and will change carbon use to 24/7 passive use;

8. Fluidised Rowaphos: This media is at the very last stage in the sump - and the small amount that I fluidise has not been depleted. This may indicate that it is no longer needed. Iwan no longer uses it;

9 Lighting: There is no doubt in Germany that T5 lighting with individual parabolic reflectors alternating between actinic and white bulbs in a 50/50 ratio is highly effective for SPS. Full side to side and front to back coverage is required. This will have a radiant heat effect and raise tank water temperatures. Running fans to cool T5 bulbs will control tank water temperature and increase T5 light output.

It allows coral placement across the full length and width of the tank to a depth of 80cm (depending on SPS species) from the tubes. Iwan changes his approx every 8 months - dannano (RC TOTM March 05 hasnt changes his in over 2 years). B Mohr described a slowing of SPS growth after 9 months.

10. SPS Coloration: None of the above can turn a genetically brown sps into any other colour. This approach will make the best of the color in the coral DNA.

11. Risks:

An attractive feature of the Prodibio approach has been no observed risk of RTN due to rapid changes in clinical nitrogen cycle parameters.

I suggest you can be confident to use the Prodibio elements from day 1, along with Zeo CV and AAHC when NO3 and PO4 are undetectable (these 2 start at 1 drop per 100lts per day and titrate the dope upwards in 2 weekly intervals)

There are contra indications with ZeoStart2 and PIF and PSG that are described in the Zeo Guide V1.01.

So much for the theory - what about the results? Can others follow the Iwan method and see improvements?

Attached are before and after shots of the impact after 9 weeks on a brown hystrix. The only variable between the two pics have been:

1) The 3 Prodibio products described above started when the first pic was taken;
2) Zeo CV started 4 weeks after;
3) Zeo AAHC started at week 7.

Lighting feeding etc etc have remain constant. Mg has had a downward presuure and flucuates between 1180 and 1220.

88693IMG_4031.jpg


88693Misc_209.jpg


Finally a pic of my tank in case anyone is interested....? It is 5 months young - so more planting to do.

88693Misc_220.jpg


88693Misc_219.jpg


HTH

I hope this is a helpful sumarry of what I have learned to date - and many many thanks to Iwan for introducing the english speaking world to this approach.


Cheers for now

Simon (trythechi)
 
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Iwan, Simon, which came first, the probio additives or the T5's?

Or, if you prefer: to which do you attribute the greater success of your system?

Also, Simon, in the first picture how old is the birdnest?

Thanks,

Dan
 
Awesome, thx for that write up. It makes a good case for this system and it shows that the underlying science that both methods are using are essentially acheieving the same thing but in slightly differing ways. This only makes me want to do one of them even more. I am still leaning towards Zeovit though because I have one of the more knowledgable people in the country who lives 20 mins away and will help me out if and when I need it. Thx again for the info!!
 
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