The Grim Reefer
Ready for some NOBALL!!!
Hahn
Guess what I ordered today?
Guess what I ordered today?
The T5 Q&a Thread
- Thread starter JohnL
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xxxbadfishxxx
Active member
Grim,
i ordered a teklight fixture 4X24watt. I want to protect the bulbs and reflectors from salt spray. Would the lighting be more efficient with the acrylic shield or to place glass over part of the tank that the lighting is suspended over? i would imagine without the lens the bulbs would be cooler, but the glass over the tank might get more salt spray and need to be cleaned every couple of days. What do you think?
thanks,
Jeff
i ordered a teklight fixture 4X24watt. I want to protect the bulbs and reflectors from salt spray. Would the lighting be more efficient with the acrylic shield or to place glass over part of the tank that the lighting is suspended over? i would imagine without the lens the bulbs would be cooler, but the glass over the tank might get more salt spray and need to be cleaned every couple of days. What do you think?
thanks,
Jeff
TropTrea
New member
As far as salt spray goes I have this to a be a triple ended sword with basicly no true solution.
1. The glass over the tank.... You have two issues here. First the glass does filter a considerable amount of high frequency light (short wave lenght) plus there is a constant accumilation of salt on the glass that basicly difusses or filters out all the other light. They basicly require loads of cleaning.
2. plastic shield of the light itself. Well plastic does fnot filter out as much light as glass does so you have a slight gain there. How hot your nulbs get can be an issue with plastics though as if someone is overdriving there bulbs you do get a lot heat on the plastic that can cause it to destort, yellow, or even melt. Then again there will be salt deposits on it requiring it to be cleaned regularly.
3. no sheild..... The best answer to not loosing any light. but remembber the closer the lighting is to the tank water surface the greater the amount of salt that will accumilate on the bulbs and reflectors that need to be regularly cleaned. By raising the lighting up higher you reduce the salt deposits however yopu have more loss do to the greater distance between the lights and the actual corals.
I personaly tried all three above. I prefer the third choice keeping all lights at least 8" above the surface seems to minimize salt deposits.
Dennis
1. The glass over the tank.... You have two issues here. First the glass does filter a considerable amount of high frequency light (short wave lenght) plus there is a constant accumilation of salt on the glass that basicly difusses or filters out all the other light. They basicly require loads of cleaning.
2. plastic shield of the light itself. Well plastic does fnot filter out as much light as glass does so you have a slight gain there. How hot your nulbs get can be an issue with plastics though as if someone is overdriving there bulbs you do get a lot heat on the plastic that can cause it to destort, yellow, or even melt. Then again there will be salt deposits on it requiring it to be cleaned regularly.
3. no sheild..... The best answer to not loosing any light. but remembber the closer the lighting is to the tank water surface the greater the amount of salt that will accumilate on the bulbs and reflectors that need to be regularly cleaned. By raising the lighting up higher you reduce the salt deposits however yopu have more loss do to the greater distance between the lights and the actual corals.
I personaly tried all three above. I prefer the third choice keeping all lights at least 8" above the surface seems to minimize salt deposits.
Dennis
hahnmeister
In Memoriam
Being that that is directed at me... Im going to have to guess that you ordered a bunch of Aquascience bulbs, or you sprang for an ultra-solaris (those 5' units are hard to pass up price-wise).
hahnmeister
In Memoriam
Good way to look at it Dennis. let me modify your opinions though slightly.
1. I use full glass covers. The key is that they are 1/4" starphire covers, and according to the PAR meter they block out something like 2 PAR (.05% or something). As for the salt, well... if you have a full glass cover, the humidity will build up on the glass, which is distilled water really, and this keeps things pretty clean FWIW. I clean mine once a month and its nothing serious really... just to wipe off the dust.
2. Plexi is most likely the best solution, like you said though, it can be bad for heat.... or... in the case of my Tek mod... good for heat. The plexi itself blocks out a minimal %age of light... 1% maybe. With my Tek mod, the acrylic actually aids me with cooling though, as it provides a duct that forces air across the bulbs with the use of a cross-flow fan mounted at one end of the fixture.
3. Open fixtures are nice when you can use them, but waterproof endcaps would be high on my list, as well as removable reflectors that are coated. FWIW, I think that the plexi idea is the best, provided you accomidate for the ventilation, as its a whole lot easier to remove and clean a single piece of clear plexi than it is to have to remove every reflector and clean them, as well as the bulbs because they are unprotected.
TropTrea
New member
there is one thing I failed to mention about clear plastics. That is warpage.
My first encounter with was using 1/4" polycarbonate as tank cover on fresh water tanks. I had several goals with it, to reduce jumpers, to conserve the heat of the aquarium water extend the life of my lighing, and to reduce evaporation rates. The results were within 24 hours the polycarbonate warped very badly making it almost useless.
My second attempt was using Acrylic that was 3/8" thick. The warpage factor was still there but drasticly reduced. If basicly worked out on the 24" or shorter tanks but did not work at all on the 48" or longer peices.
The final attempt was using 3/16 Polycarbonate with 1/2 X 1 1/2" polycarbonate ribs added for suport. Finaly I had something that did not even wrap on a 72 lenght.
Dennis
My first encounter with was using 1/4" polycarbonate as tank cover on fresh water tanks. I had several goals with it, to reduce jumpers, to conserve the heat of the aquarium water extend the life of my lighing, and to reduce evaporation rates. The results were within 24 hours the polycarbonate warped very badly making it almost useless.
My second attempt was using Acrylic that was 3/8" thick. The warpage factor was still there but drasticly reduced. If basicly worked out on the 24" or shorter tanks but did not work at all on the 48" or longer peices.
The final attempt was using 3/16 Polycarbonate with 1/2 X 1 1/2" polycarbonate ribs added for suport. Finaly I had something that did not even wrap on a 72 lenght.
Dennis
The Grim Reefer
Ready for some NOBALL!!!
Ordered a 6x54. Figure that will be easier to sell once I am done testing but if I can't I have a use for it.
casingbill
New member
I've got dibs!!!...I'm still setting up a 75 and thats what I need....
hahnmeister
In Memoriam
The plexi, if held in a track or bolted on, doesnt warp much at all. There is a slight bowing in the middle, but the addition of fans to the Tek prevents the heat buildup that so many have reported as the cause for massive warping and failure. Look at the ATI units... they use 1/4" thick acrylic it seems without a problem because they have an active thermal solution that keeps the acrylic cooler.
OR, you can do what I did, and get your hands on some special types of heat-resistant acrylic. I used Acrylite® GMS, (249 is also good). Its a simple way to not have to worry.
Take a look here:
http://www.sdplastics.com/acrylit1.html
Many types are made, abrasion & chemical resistance, UV absorbing and UV allowing, UV resistant, heat resistant, etc. The GMS is a mil-spec acrylic used for fighter jet canopies, and these days its not even that expensive by the sheet.
Or, you can do what I did at first and just opt for 1/4" thick Starphire... no warping, and near perfect transmission of light... etc.
jay375
Member
I'm currently upgrading from a 90g with 2x250w MH to a AGA 180.Ive been thinkng about switching to t5 lighting to save on the electric bill. The 180 will start as a FOWLR but Im sure I'll gradually go to a mixed reef. My question is do you think its a good idea to use t5 lighting on such a large tank?If so what lamp combos would you recommend? Also this will be a DIY project. So I'll be using a retro kit. After reading 40+ pages any insight would be helpful.
hahnmeister
In Memoriam
For a 180g, you have a few options.
1. twin 3' banks. This gives you total coverage, but it also means double the bulbs... I wouldnt want that, although I know there are people who do it like this. On a 180, you are most likely going to want something in the 8-10 bulb range, so thats 16-20 bulbs when it comes to replace them... not worth it. Aquatinics handles 6' tanks this way, and they are nice fixtures, but that many bulbs!? No thanks.
2. 4' bulbs that are staggered. On a 6' tank, this is pushing it. You will get a bright spot in the middle, but your ends will be left to dwindle a bit with half as much light as over the center.
3. 5' bulbs. You dont even notice the 6" at the ends... it fills in. The best option IMO, but not always the easiest to impliment... until recent. Tek makes 5' reflectors, but Icecap reflectors are really the way to go with retrofits, and they dont have a 5' reflector (unless you get one of those rare deals on the dual 3' reflectors direct from IC where they overlap two 3' reflectors... $$$$!). And add to that the cost of 80 watt ballasts... as 80 watt ballasts dont come in a 2x80 or something like with smaller bulbs... they are expensive, and only run one bulb each. The lower cost alternative is the Icecap 660 in this case, but it overdrives the bulbs to 100watts each, but doesnt boost their output as well as the shorter bulbs... not to mention it can only run 3 of the 5' bulbs then. Oh, and nobody really makes a 5' fixture.
And then Fauna-Marin came to town. Okay, I know I must sound like a broken record at this point, but to me the faunas represent an great, upgradable, modular package. The other thing is price... go to geek and look up the cost of a tek 5' retrofit. Then look up the cost of a faunamarin 5' unit at aquarium obsessed. They cost the same, and both come with bulbs, but the fauna has active cooling built in, better ballasts, better reflectors, and comes in more of a fixture configuration... ready to mount! Need 8 bulbs? Just buy two of the 4x80watt units and place them side by side, thats all. With or without a canopy... your choice.
Also, Ive seen someone said that the ATI fixtures might be lower priced than originally expected (perhaps to compete?). The powermodul by them is expected to be sold by reefgeek, and they are taking pre-orders. I know they have a 8x80watt unit (heck, they have 10 and 12 bulb units if I remember right), and Im sure that would be great for a 180g.
1. twin 3' banks. This gives you total coverage, but it also means double the bulbs... I wouldnt want that, although I know there are people who do it like this. On a 180, you are most likely going to want something in the 8-10 bulb range, so thats 16-20 bulbs when it comes to replace them... not worth it. Aquatinics handles 6' tanks this way, and they are nice fixtures, but that many bulbs!? No thanks.
2. 4' bulbs that are staggered. On a 6' tank, this is pushing it. You will get a bright spot in the middle, but your ends will be left to dwindle a bit with half as much light as over the center.
3. 5' bulbs. You dont even notice the 6" at the ends... it fills in. The best option IMO, but not always the easiest to impliment... until recent. Tek makes 5' reflectors, but Icecap reflectors are really the way to go with retrofits, and they dont have a 5' reflector (unless you get one of those rare deals on the dual 3' reflectors direct from IC where they overlap two 3' reflectors... $$$$!). And add to that the cost of 80 watt ballasts... as 80 watt ballasts dont come in a 2x80 or something like with smaller bulbs... they are expensive, and only run one bulb each. The lower cost alternative is the Icecap 660 in this case, but it overdrives the bulbs to 100watts each, but doesnt boost their output as well as the shorter bulbs... not to mention it can only run 3 of the 5' bulbs then. Oh, and nobody really makes a 5' fixture.
And then Fauna-Marin came to town. Okay, I know I must sound like a broken record at this point, but to me the faunas represent an great, upgradable, modular package. The other thing is price... go to geek and look up the cost of a tek 5' retrofit. Then look up the cost of a faunamarin 5' unit at aquarium obsessed. They cost the same, and both come with bulbs, but the fauna has active cooling built in, better ballasts, better reflectors, and comes in more of a fixture configuration... ready to mount! Need 8 bulbs? Just buy two of the 4x80watt units and place them side by side, thats all. With or without a canopy... your choice.
Also, Ive seen someone said that the ATI fixtures might be lower priced than originally expected (perhaps to compete?). The powermodul by them is expected to be sold by reefgeek, and they are taking pre-orders. I know they have a 8x80watt unit (heck, they have 10 and 12 bulb units if I remember right), and Im sure that would be great for a 180g.
The Grim Reefer
Ready for some NOBALL!!!
Better ballasts than Ice Cap?
Yeah, whatever
Yeah, whatever
hahnmeister
In Memoriam
Hey... youve seen what a good high-frequency ballast can do without the need to overdrive.
The Grim Reefer
Ready for some NOBALL!!!
Where?
hahnmeister
In Memoriam
You know... the ATI that you tested...
The Grim Reefer
Ready for some NOBALL!!!
I have tested a stand alone VS ballast. It provided no more light than the Triad or Dynamic. All were within a few points of each other.
Roland Jacques
Premium Member
Is there a thread where you or others have compared ballast's?
Gim is it true they boot you after 10,000 posts?
Gim is it true they boot you after 10,000 posts?
TropTrea
New member
Not necessarly. If you go over 10,000 the check your usage and if it is over 5 messages per day they give you a choice of upgrading to a donating member or they put a restriction on your posting to 1 a day untill you get down to under 5 per day.
I think the upgrade costs like $25.00 per month or $1,000 one time donation.
:rollface:
I think the upgrade costs like $25.00 per month or $1,000 one time donation.
:rollface:
:rollface:<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9139895#post9139895 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Roland Jacques
Is there a thread where you or others have compared ballast's?
Gim is it true they boot you after 10,000 posts?
The Grim Reefer
Ready for some NOBALL!!!
I thought they sold your name and address to some therapists.
I did a test of the Ice Cap, Dynamic and Fulham in the threa T5 ballasts compared. When I did the Triad, VS, and Dynamic the output and power draw were so close I didn't even bother.
I did a test of the Ice Cap, Dynamic and Fulham in the threa T5 ballasts compared. When I did the Triad, VS, and Dynamic the output and power draw were so close I didn't even bother.
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